While nasty and vindictive Homelanders were expressing glee at the news that Roger Ver had been denied a U.S. visa to speak at a Bitcoin conference in the U.S., another covered expatriate was able to celebrate a much quieter Christmas and New Year’s holiday in Southern California with his Canadian wife. A recent article in Hong Kong’s Headline News confirms that Hong Kong actor Donnie Yen Chi-tan recently visited the U.S. and Peru with his family. His wife Cecilia Wang posted a picture of herself, Yen, and the kids in Los Angeles just after the New Year on Chinese microblogging service Sina Weibo. As far as is known, Yen himself — unlike his wife — holds only a Hong Kong SAR passport and not a Canadian passport, meaning he does not enjoy visa-free entry but instead had to apply for an actual U.S. visa to enter the country.
Yen is an “accidental American” of a different sort: he was not born a dual citizen, but instead came to the U.S. with his family at age 11. However, he moved back to Hong Kong pretty much as soon as he reached adulthood, and achieved fame in the movie industry there through his roles in martial arts films. He renounced U.S. citizenship in 2009, and showed up in the Federal Register “published expatriates” list for Q3 2010; as he stated to Xinhua News Agency when they interviewed him a few years later about his renunciation, “now I’m 100% Chinese”. This was not Yen’s first visit to the U.S. since his renunciation, either; in July 2014, he went to Boston where his parents still live. Having U.S. citizen or resident relatives makes it more difficult to overcome the presumption of immigrant intent when applying for a tourist visa, but as Yen’s case demonstrates it is far from impossible either.
Even though politicians on both sides of the aisle keep threatening to banish us, many other ex-U.S. Persons both famous and obscure have had no issues in obtaining a U.S. tourist visa or entering through the Visa Waiver Program. Some have even moved back to the country, either on work visas or green cards. Unfortunately, even the mere threat of being denied entry to the U.S. to visit friends and relatives has left some U.S. Persons in other countries too afraid to cast off their unwanted citizenship.
In 2013, this ex-American was able to visit: http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/07/29/an-urgent-return-from-exile/
Of course, since then he’s been a nuisance and does not attempt to tempt fate a second time.
Re: He has said that he won’t file FBAR. http://www.iexpats.com/fatca-critics-fears-arrest-by-us-authorities/
The Q4 2014 list was just released, and it will be published in the Federal Register tomorrow.
https://s3.amazonaws.com/public-inspection.federalregister.gov/2015-02850.pdf
I counted 1062 names, which is the second largest ever for a quarter, close the record 1130 in Q2 2013. It makes the total 3415 for year 2014, which breaks the record again. Expect news articles soon.
There’s one already.
Record Number Gave Up U.S. Citizenship or Long-Term Residency in 2014
Also an ex-American (renounced December, 2014), I travelled at Christmas to see relatives in the USA. With a New York birthplace on my Canadian passport, I was not questioned, just told to have a nice trip by US border security.
Any future trips back to the US will be carefully weighed, however. My refusal to file FBARs being the reason…I simply feel it is none of their business, south of the border. (I am filing 1040’s and form 8854.)
I renounced August 2014, received my CLN in November 2015, and I am not on this list. Why can they not produce an accurate list?
It hasn’t been an issue for me in any way. I renounced in March, 2012 and received my CLN in November, 2012. Absolutely nothing has changed for me and I visit the US 5-6 times each year. I’ve been questioned about my place of birth (NY) twice, but not since renouncing. I feel as much Canadian/American as I did earlier despite not having “formal” US citizenship. However, I do feel much more FREE!
I received my CLN in December, 2014, but I am not on this list.
I know 3 persons renouncing in 2013 at same embassy. All tax papers and 8854 sent in the same package. One is on the list, two are not. All renounced in 2013, and all have CLNs.
As posted on another IBS page, hubby renounced in October 2012 and still has not arrived on the name-and-shame list. I’ve written to International Tax Blog to ask if this is something to worry about. Others have said it often takes about 1.5 years to move through the system before getting on “the list”, but for hubby this is now almost 2.5 years….. The list is inaccurate, the numbers minimized (so that home-landers don’t have to worry so much???)
Gads that picture is blue! I had to put it into photoshop and tweak the colour settings just to confirm those are humans and not of the Na’vi species (reference to “Avatar”).
EmBee, Well…looks like they put the camera on the improper white-balance setting. 😀 Should have used cloudy. 😀
I am on the list and so is my good friend. We both renounced in January and February respectively of 2014. I have travelled back and forth many times without incident. In fact, I am in the US right now at a course. I am with you Bruce, I feel much more free now. An interesting thing though when checking in for my flight into the US at the kiosk, it asked my wife and I separately – (she is and has Canadian only) if we were US citizens or US LPR. I have never seen this question before. It was nice to answer no for both of us.
If, unlike Canada or other visa waiver countries, the person who renounced has to apply for a visa to visit the US – whether or not it is granted is entirely at the discretion of the US visa officer at the Embassy. If they want to be vindictive and not issue it they can be.
As I mentioned on another thread, I renounced in 2012 and my name has never appeared. The list is a farce.
@Steve: true, but FWIW, Hong Kong isn’t in the Visa Waiver Program. The U.S. can’t give a visa waiver for HKSAR passports because HK isn’t a country (the fix to allow non-countries into the VWP was one of the things in the big immigration bill back in 2013 that didn’t pass), and they can’t give one for BN(O) passports either because the issuing country isn’t the same as the country to which returnability is guaranteed. So Donnie Yen almost certainly had to get a US visa (unless he has another citizenship he’s not telling anyone about), and the consular officer who issued the visa to him should have known who he was.
@notamused: At some point between now and a decade ago, even the IRS itself seems to have lost confidence in the Federal Register list. Bill Yates’ proposed Reed Amendment regulations back in the 2000s would have had border guards checking names against the list. The IRS could have added a similar requirement under the FATCA regs for, e.g., the bank to check the name against the list if a person with a U.S. birthplace self-declared as a non-U.S. Person — but of course they didn’t, even with all the other tortures they’re putting everyone through. They’re just as well aware as the rest of us that the list is garbage, they just don’t have any incentive to fix it.
In 1999, the then Vice Chairman of the Joint Committee on Taxation asked the US General Accounting Office (GAO) to the assist the Committee “in its review of various issues related to tax-motivated expatriation, that is, leaving the United States and giving up U.S. citizenship or long-term residency status for the purpose of avoiding U.S. taxes.” I’m going to assume that the request for this report has to do with enforcing the Reed Amendment.
The GAO was asked to obtain information on the following areas: (1) the Internal Revenue Service (IRS) procedures relevant to the enforcement of tax-motivated expatriate rules related to income, estate, and gift taxes; (2) IRS’ procedures for using the private letter ruling process; and (3) Immigration and Naturalization Service (INS) and Department of State procedures for preventing tax- motivated expatriates from reentering the United States.
http://www.gao.gov/assets/100/90271.pdf
The GAO report, called “Information Concerning Tax-Motivated Expatriation” was presented to the committee in 2000 and reveals how little the IRS knew about renunciants at the time:
31. What are the procedures for determining whether visa applicants are former U.S. citizens who renounced their U.S. citizenship with a tax motivation?
No procedures exist for identifying former U.S. citizens, including those who renounced their citizenship with a tax motivation. Under the Immigration and Nationality Act, INS is responsible for determining whether visa applicants renounced their U.S. citizenship with a tax motivation. INS has recently drafted proposed regulations in this regard, and according to INS officials, they have been reviewed by IRS and the Department of State. The proposed regulations are currently being reviewed by INS’ Office of General Counsel before being sent to the Department of Justice for further review. The proposed regulations will also be subject to public comment.
31a. Who makes the decision on whether to issue a visa?
U.S. consular officers stationed at Foreign Service posts abroad approve or disapprove visa applications, although prior renunciation of U.S. citizenship is currently not a factor in these decisions.
31b. How many visa applicants have been denied a visa because they had renounced their U.S. citizenship?
None.
31c. How many of these were denied because they renounced their U.S. citizenship with a presumed tax motivation?
None.
32. Are the types and numbers of visas issued to former U.S. citizens monitored by the State Department?
No.
32a. If yes, how do they monitor such information?
Not applicable.
33. What are IRS’ procedures for sharing information with the State Department and INS for the purpose of enforcing the 1996 amendments to the Immigration and Nationality Act?
IRS officials said that IRS has no procedures for sharing information on former U.S. citizens for the purpose of enforcing the 1996 amendments and that sharing tax information with other federal agencies generally violates the disclosure restrictions of section 6103 of the Internal Revenue Code, aside from specific exceptions noted in the law. However, as noted in response to questions 30 and 31, INS and IRS have recently identified a potential mechanism for the Attorney General to receive taxpayer information without violating the disclosure restrictions.
34. What are the State Department and INS procedures for sharing information with IRS for the purpose of enforcing the 1996 amendments to the Immigration and Nationality Act?
The State Department and INS currently have no procedures for sharing information with IRS for the purpose of enforcing the 1996 amendments. As noted previously in response to questions 30 and 31, INS and IRS recently identified a potential mechanism for the Attorney General to receive from IRS the taxpayer information necessary to enforce the act.
35. What are the IRS and State Department procedures for ensuring that the Form 8854, Expatriation Information Statement, is filed?
• The State Department’s guidance to its consular posts, as of November 1996, calls for them to obtain tax information statements, as required in
Page 16 GAO/GGD-00-110R Tax-Motivated Expatriation
Tax-Motivated Expatriation: Enforcement of IRS and Immigration Act Provisions
Internal Revenue Code section 6039G, from any person who loses U.S. citizenship. The expatriate tax information statements are then to be forwarded with the Certificates of Loss of Nationality to the Internal Revenue Service. Based on our sample of 200 IRS CLN files, we estimate that 84 percent of those processed after November 1996 did include expatriate tax information statements (see question 3a2). The State Department’s guidance also required posts to note in the CLN file when expatriates refused to provide statements. However, we found no such reports in the sample files we reviewed at IRS.
• Former long-term U.S. residents are required to file form 8854 by the due date of their income tax return for the year in which they gave up their U.S. residency.
• Also, IRS has not assessed the penalty for not filing an expatriation tax information statement.10 IRS officials said that there are difficulties in assessing the penalty, such as the lack of a Social Security number or other definitive means of identifying the expatriate.
35a. How many expatriates have filed a form 8854?
• IRS data indicate that 1,158, or 42 percent, of the 2,735 expatriates published in the Federal Register filed an expatriate tax information statement indicating whether they met the tax-motivation criteria.
• Form 8854 did not exist before January 1999, and IRS has not tracked the number filed. The expatriate tax information statements we sampled were generally provided on State Department forms.
The entire report is a short but good read. If anything its a good backgrounder to what’s happening today.
Maybe Eric or Shadow Raider with their superb knowledge in this area would be kind enough to translate what this old report means to renunciants today, and what the “mechanism” is the GAO was referring to in their answer to Q-34?
Canadians don’t need a visa. I live in a country that needs a visa. This is why I don’t give it up, for now. When I have a passport that doesn’t require a visa, I’ll give it up. I’m working on that… but I do not want to be subject to their “interpretation” of ties. I have so many ties here, I’m stuck and can’t leave, but who knows what some State Department employee in their late 20s would decide.
I will never understand this US-Resident perversion / obsession with people of the same nationality that live in other countries. I spoke to a consulate employee lately, and he asked me how I ended up here. I told him and his answer was “It’s a cool place to end up.” Ok, maybe he was just being nice, but I hear the same thing all the freaking time. It’s not “cool”, it’s basically the SAME. There are things that you like, but there are also things that piss you off.
My theory is that the average red-blooded flag-waiving US-resident American is just PLAIN ignorant. They are usually monolingual and have no clue everything is basically the same, just in a different language. They think that we are on the beach sipping martinis all day long.
Dov Lipman (Israeli legislator, former U.S. citizen) is speaking in his native Maryland today:
http://www.bethtfiloh.com/podium/default.aspx?t=52416&eid=2497086
Israeli passport holders (like HKSAR passport holders) require advance visas to visit the U.S.
Donnie Yen at the Rogue One premiere in Los Angeles last week
http://photos.sgvtribune.com/2016/12/10/photos-rogue-one-a-star-wars-story-premiere-red-carpet-arrivals/#4