How to Renounce/Relinquish
Consulate Report Directory (Brockers Describe their Consulate Meetings) and CLN Delivery Time Chart
Department of State Forms, Procedure Manuals, and Contact Info
Expatriation Date, Form 8854 & Certificate of Loss of Nationality
Important if Relinquishing Act Prior to June 4, 2004
Very important for pre-2004 relinqishers to read, the posts/threads at this link also contain some useful information for those who relinquished after June 4, 2004, or are planning to do so.
Interactions between Department of State and IRS regarding Renunciation/Relinquishment
You can renounce (or apply for a relinquishment-based CLN) if you have not filed taxes. Here’s some general information, with source links, relating to that and the relation between DoS and IRS in the context of renunciation/relinquishment.
IRS Ruling on Relinquishment and Retroactivity, 92-109
Relinquishment and Renunciation Data
The actual “relinquishment and renunciation data” was integrated into the Appendix of the Consulate Report Directory in 2013 (tracking chart of people’s wait times from booking to consulate appointment to receipt of CLN) and is continually updated there. The thread itself , however, has remained open and popular.
Relinquishment by Persons-Born-Dual or Who Naturalised in a Foreign Country as a Minor
Although a person who is already a citizen obviously can’t relinquish by naturalisation, any adult can relinquish by taking employment with a foreign government (or its subdivisions) or by joining the military.
Relinquishment by Naturalisation (INA, s. 349(a)(1)) by Person Born in US to Canadian parents: Cheryl’s Story. Relinquishing act (naturalisation) was her registering her birth abroad with the Canadian government in 1977 when she was an adult.
Cheryl’s detailed story contains information of particular interest to Canadians and general information which may also be useful to those of other countries and those with slightly different fact sets as well.
Reports by Persons who Relinquished US Citizenship Upon Taking Government Employment, Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 349(a)(4)(A)
Self-Documented Relinquishment
The relinquishing act itself causes the citizenship loss. A CLN provides proof of it, but it’s not the only way to prove it.
Estate Matters for Former US Citizens
How the 877A Exit Tax May Apply to your Canadian Assets
This is a series of nine posts on different aspects of the exit tax. Much of it is relevant to persons in all countries.
Almost No US Citizenship Renunciation Appointments Left During 2016 in Dublin
The title highlights Dublin, but this post contains a chart of links to consulate websites’ and their info re renunciation appointments around the world, as well as ongoing discussion of the topic.
Depends what you mean by “not allowed” – it’s shouldn’t be a problem unless you’re an Australian MP. If your employer doesn’t care that you have US citizenship, then it doesn’t matter. If you went to work for another country’s government, swore some sort of oath to it and did so with the intention of relinquishing your US citizenship, then in theory you ceased to become a US citizen the moment you swore the metaphorical oath. As a practical matter it’s more complicated to document relinquishment than to renounce, and the cost is the same, so unless you relinquished a long time ago and there are tax considerations, just renounce.
One exception: if you have signing authority over financial accounts, your existence could create FATCA and other reporting obligations for your employer, but this should not be an issue in the public sector.
Re: “If you went to work for another country’s government, swore some sort of oath to it and did so with the intention of relinquishing your US citizenship, then in theory you ceased to become a US citizen the moment you swore the metaphorical oath.”
I’d like to bring up a nuance regarding the oath and government employment. The oath itself doesn’t play a key role and is irrelevant if the person is already a citizen of Australia at the time of taking government employment.
Government employment (INA, s. 349(A)(4)(a)
The law does not require an oath of allegiance in order for a relinquishment to occur. Simply taking the employment, with the voluntary intention of terminating one’s US citizenship by so doing, is all that is needed.
Oath of Allegiance. (INA, s. 349(A)(2)
This is a ground for relinquishment that is not covered in other sub-articles of s. 349(a)(1) of the INA. An essential condition is that the oath of allegiance changes one’s relationship with the country , which is why it’s irrelevant if a person is already a citizen of the country.
Oath of Allegiance rarely comes into play in a government-employment based relinquishment because if a person:
Is already an Australian citizen at the time, the oath is not relevant towards relinquishment. The application is processed under s. 4(a) (govt employment ) because once a citizen, an oath of allegiance does not change one’s relationship with Australia as citizenship is deemed to include allegiance.
Is not Australian citizen at the time, the application is processed under s. 4(a) (govt employment) anyway.
This also applies to other potentially relinquishing acts which include an oath of allegiance, such as naturalisation s. 349(A)(1) and military service s. 349(A)(4)(b).
Sources
Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 349(A)
Dept of State Manual, 7 FAM 1250, Naturalization and Oath of Allegiance to a Foreign State
Dear all
It’s a pleasure to inform you that I was able to renounce today at the consulate of the country of my domicile (after I was able to secure a renounciation meeting as a substitute for a renounciant candidate that had cancelled his meeting, by insisting/asking 3 or 4 times to secure such a spot … the consular service lady told me … ah you are the one who was putting pressure on us for a meeting … :-).
Everything went very well and super smooth.
Each of the consular employees and the consul were super friendly.
I just had to pay the fee, hand over my foreign passport (which was returnde), the stamps for the return envelope, sign an affidavit that I never had an Us-Passport (or that I have currently no such passport …), swear the oath of renunciation, sign and read the documents (inter alia the preprinted CLN, signed by the consul and stamped with the approval stamp of the dept of state (which still has to be signed) and over it was.
The signing and swearing ceremony took 3 minutes at best and then I was out
(The only drawback was that I had to wait almost 1 hour there, because the consul was stuck in a meeting, despite my scheduled renounciation meeting …. obviously renounciant are not on top of the priority list, even though we are such good feedeliverers 🙂 …. that’s why I just missed my connecting train back home :-)).
Now, I hope that I will get that CLN as fast as possible (rather in 2 – 4 weeks, instead of the usual 6 to 8 weeks)
I will keep you posted when the final release letter will have arrived
Thank you for all your much appreciated support
Accidentalnominal
PS: During my waiting for the consul for the signing ceremony, three other renunciants stepped into the consular services room, 2 ladys and a gents approximately in their late 60ies or early 70ies, that understood hardly a word of English and who were children of an american parent (one might be tempted to see this as an another absurd episode of US citizenship overreach)… I served as translator and explained them the meaning of the documents they had to sign and what to fill in …. at least a productive use of my waiting time …)
Hello all, this website is pretty confusing, so I hope I’m posting to the right place.
I have received an email from my bank directing me to their FATCA form, which, through some research has led me here. I believe my situation is not as straightforward as others here (born in the US, been a citizen of the UK for more than 40 years, never registered with the IRS, BUT have always maintained a US passport). Being a US citizen brings me no benefits, so I’m thinking that renunciation is the right move, but where to start? I’ve seen advice here stating that people should just renounce and forgo any communication with the IRS, but that doesn’t sit easy with me. I’d hate to take a holiday to the US in the future and find myself in hot water.
It seems like all the US tax experts in the UK are selling themselves as “wealth management” services. I’m just an average person on average earnings and don’t want to pay thousands for an initial consultation with an expert who normally deal with expats earning 6-figure salaries. I’d be happy to pay hundreds just for someone to “hold my hand”, but I can’t seem to find anybody offering such a service. Or at least I can find dubious websites like expertsforexpats and expattaxonline, but there’s no indication of what quality of advice I would get from using a service like that.
Welcome Jon. We have considerable experience garnered over 12 years. A few things are crystal clear. The IRS has no interest in or ability to bother an average person on average income. They have only ever bothered US citizens living in the US . And even then, they have been led to that individual by means other than FATCA. Think Paul Manafort. FATCA has been a huge waste of time and billions for the banks .
There is common misinformation from the consultants to the effect that you must be tax compliant for 5 years before renouncing. This is quite simply false. An untruth designed to garner fees for the consultant. There is no such requirement
Renunciation is straightforward although there is a waiting list and a fee of $2350. We can hold your hand.
We have have not a single report of renunciants in hot water traveling to the US. It’s been 7 years for my wife born in the US with multiple trips each year and 2 years for my son born n in Canada.
@Jon
Here are your options, in order of increasing complexity and cost.
1. Lie to your bank – do not disclose your US citizenship on any FATCA forms. If you succeed, you don’t need to worry about anything.
2. Do not lie to your bank – tell them you are a US citizen and give them your SSN. Even with FATCA reporting, the IRS will not trouble you. The only downside to this approach is that some banks will not offer the full range of investment services to US-person customers, due to an overabundance of caution.
3. Renounce your US citizenship and present your CLN (certificate of loss of nationality) to the bank to end any FATCA reporting or other restrictions. File no US tax returns. The IRS will not trouble you.
4. Renounce your US citizenship and present your CLN to the bank. File 5 years’ US tax returns and FBARs plus Form 8854 to make a formal exit from the US tax system.
One option I did not present, because it’s pointless and stupid, is to begin filing US tax returns and keep US citizenship. This gains you nothing.
You should have no concerns with travel to the US no matter which course of action you take. You can renew your US passport without tax compliance. If you renounce (with or without filing) you lose the guaranteed right of entry but former citizens are not barred. Border officials have no access to tax records.
Given that you were born in the US, one factor to consider is estate planning. You may wish to renounce while still alive – sadly you cannot renounce posthumously – if you are concerned that the executor of your will might panic and attempt to bring the estate into US tax compliance (they would be personally liable from the perspective of the US government) at some cost to your heirs, in time and money.
Dear all,
I just got news from the embassy that my CLN has been approved in DC (on September 1, 2023) and will be sent to me tomorrow 🙂 (after having said on 5.9.2023 that the will send it that week or the week thereafter :- …. 3 weeks for sending a CLN from the embassy to me … respect … or are there instructions to that extent).
I am super happy and relieved to receive this advance birthday gift
(I guess I will make 10 copies (3 certified ones), open new bank accounts and close some and kick some banks asses)
Many thanks to all of you for your help and guidance and for this marvelous site
Best regards
AN
@ Accidental Nominal,
Glad to hear that your CLN is en route! Thanks for keeping us posted. Dunno why it’s taking them a couple of weeks to send it — sounds like at least they were relatively good with the booking wait time (IIRC, you had your appointment about two months after requesting one; it’s about a year currently in Canada). At any rate, good to hear it’s on its way and I hope it turns up in your mail box any day now.
Thank you very much, Pacifica.
I could get it this morning at the post office :-). What a nice birthday gift.
You are right: the whole process was rather quick after all:
19.4.2023: AN request for meeting
20.4.2023: Embassy: Answer: waiting list of well over 400 customers; scheduling appointments in order of receipt the requests; at the moment scheduling customers who contacted us in June 2022. We anticipate a waiting time of roughly 9 months for an appointment:
Thereafter: AN:
– offenering to step in in case of cancellation of meeting.
– asking various times for such an opportunity.
6.7.2023: Embassy: appointment offer for 13.7.2023
13.7.2023: appointment:
5.9.2023: information on approval of CLN on 1.9.2023 and sending of CLN this or next week (after politely asking for the status)
25.9.2023: receipt of CLN
Overall time: 5 Months and 6 days (20 days of which delayed sending by embassy for unknown reasons)
Learning: Insisting on stepping in case of cancellation by scheduled renunciants proved very helpful, also asking about the status in regular intervalls. Other spots that should be considered from my perspective for European renunciants for a swift renunciation: Francfort, Germany (got an appointment on the 14.7 after asking 25.4 or so; very professional), Luxembourg. Rather not to be considered: Paris, Amsterdam, Brussel: long waiting time over 1 year; Marseille France: take only regional residents: Italy/Spain: 2 appointments; Croatia, Czechia, Austria, Vienna.
In any event thanks for all your help and very good luck to all future renunciants.
Now: the next step will be cleaning up / establishing the banking side of the story.
I am considering:
opening up new banking relationships,
informing the old bank of the CLN (with a copy) and eventually closing it down or shifting assets to the new one step by step.
Any advice or hints on pitfalls to avoid ?
Sending in the CLN will not to lead any problems and further questions, right ? Sorry that I might be a bit overanxious here. I don’t wanna have to answer any further questions at all . I just want that they register me as local person. E basta e finito witth this US-persons nightmare
Is it better to open the new banking relationships first ?
from now on, I will tell no one of my US birthplace and will just present my local documents that do not mention my birthplace
Any further advice for banking post CLN receipt, informing about CLN etc.
Many thanks for your invaluable help
Best regards and have great start into the week
No need to fret about your banking. No need to change unless you want to for other reasons. You are no longer a US person and can proe it.
@ Accidental Nominal,
Neat that your CLN arrived on your birthday. Thanks for all the information and advice you’ve provided — it really helps to get an idea of how things are going in different places. Re banking, I foresee no problems remaining with your current bank as the CLN makes it very clear you are no longer a US citizen.
Thank you very much Portland and Pacifica.
Thus, I am just going to send in a (certified) copy of my CLN to the bank with the polite request for bankwide taking note thereof and take the necessary steps.
(i.e. unflag me as US-Person and make sure not information is sent any longer to the US under Fatca or on another basis whatsoever).
Thanks again, best of luck to everyone else on the same path and best regards
AN
…. I truly hope they will just register my non-us-person status without any further fuss (and need for redocumentation) … otherwise I am tempted to kick them out