Liberty and justice for all United States persons abroad

The Isaac Brock Society

Posted on by Posted in Issues regarding US persons abroad 162 Comments

If you are a Canadian citizen, you have the opportunity, and IMO the responsibility, to vote in the October 19 Canadian federal election. Certainly if you reside in Canada, and (with some restrictions I won’t go into here) even if you don’t.

This is Canadians’ opportunity to pass judgment on whether the government of Stephen Harper has stood up for Canada, for Canadian values, for Canada’s Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and for Canadian citizens. And to decide whether maybe some other party should be given the chance to govern our country, for the better (we all hope).

My personal advice is to vote for anyone other than the Conservative in your riding, either the candidate most likely to defeat the Conservative candidate, or if you can’t figure out who that might be, perhaps the party leading in the national polls as of today (the Liberals) and hence with the most credible chance of getting more seats than the Conservatives and hence forming our next government. Or, if you have an incumbent MP who isn’t a Conservative and whom you respect and like, vote for that incumbent.

If you can’t bring yourself to vote for anyone other than a Conservative, but are appalled at Stephen Harper’s idea of governance of Canada, take former Progressive Conservative Premier of Newfoundland and Labrador Danny Williams’ advice, and just stay at home and don’t vote this time around. Ignore that absurd recommendation by the Globe and Mail, which said the Conservatives deserve another mandate but Harper doesn’t. In our parliamentary system you can’t make that distinction, it makes no sense. Harper is the Conservative leader, if the Conservatives really wanted to they could have deposed him but didn’t, and trying to say the Conservatives aren’t to blame for Harper’s style of governance is utterly ridiculous. They’re all joined at the hip.

But VOTE. If you’re eligible to vote in this election and don’t, IMO you’ve lost any right to complain about the outcome.

I was born and educated in the US. After completing my post-graduate education, I entered Canada on a temporary work permit, moving to Canada because of the Vietnam war. Shortly after unpacking, I applied for landed immigrant status. A few months later I received in the mail an induction notice from the US Army; I drew a peace symbol on it in felt marker pen and mailed it back. As a result, I was indicted and a warrant was issued for my arrest (both were quashed in 1977 by the Carter amnesty). I became a Canadian citizen in 1975. In 1976, for the US Bicentennial I wrote a political letter to Henry Kissinger, then Secretary of State. In it I mentioned that I had "renounced" (I didn't then know of "relinquish") my US citizenship on becoming a Canadian, explaining in several pages my reasons for leaving the US. I also mentioned the fact that on my mother's side I am a descendant of a soldier who fought in Washington's army during the US rebellion, but now I was declaring my personal independence from the US and rejoining the British Commonwealth. Within six months, I received by mail a CLN recognizing my having expatriated myself from the US in 1975. I filed away my CLN and forgot I had it, until I found it after searching for it upon learning of FATCA and OVDI in August 2011. Since then, I proudly keep a photocopy of it with my passport (which is Canadian; I have never had a US passport in my life, nor will I ever). As a Canadian who long since ceased being an American and who has a CLN, I am not directly affected by FATCA or other US taxation outrages. However, my wife and several of her friends are affected, until their relinquishment CLNs (dating from 30-40 years ago) are issued. Also I have several close friends who were born in Canada of US parents and are considered by the US to be US citizens, though they have never lived in the US, worked there, earned income there, held property there, held US passports, or in any other way excercised USC and are horrified they might be considered US. I am active on this website and in writing my elected Canadian politicians about these issues, on their behalf. I am a retired former employee of the Government of Canada who faithfully and proudly served his adopted and adoptive country for many years. Updated September 2, 2012: earlier this week, my wife finally received her relinquishment CLN, State Department formal recognition that (in their exact words on the CLN) she "ceased to be a US citizen on" the date she became a Canadian more than 35 years ago. Mission Accomplished, to borrow words from my least-favourite contemporary/contemptible American. I will continue to monitor this website from time to time to see if I contribute useful information or opinions, but my wife and I are determined to regain our lives after the past twelve months of angst. Best wishes to all of you on this website in your odyssey toward freedom from the US.

162 thoughts on “October 19 is Election Day in Canada”

  4. Maybe one good thing came out of the election: Canadians relinquishing their clinging U.S.A. citizenship by working at the polls on election day, thereby accepting employment with a ‘foreign” government. I have not heard from any yet, but that is understandable.

  5. As predicted, Tory Peter Kent won my riding by a huge margin, and a majority of the vote 59%. So as predicted, my vote of conscience had no effect on the election. I voted libertarian, which is to my knowledge the only way of voting for less government. Otherwise choose your statist poison. Statism is what got us into this FATCA mess in the first place.

  6. Barbara,

    Positives? The biggest one, of course, is the ousting of *the Harper Government*, most of it anyway.

    Now, I think our best of any opportunities is that of having to keep feet to the fire using the Trudeau statements of *A Canadian is A Canadian IS A CANADIAN* and *The Liberals are the party of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms*.

  7. @LenCamp, Remember the “apple” came from the tree of Pierre Trudeau, who proudly established our Charter of Rights and Freedom, which defends people from being discriminated against based on their nationality.

    Given Trudeau’s repudiation of Bill C-24 and belief a “Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian”, I believe if Trudeau learns the truth about the IGA, his loyalty will be stronger to the essence of the Charter, one of the great achievements of his father, than to an American law that was sneaked into a bill by a president who will be leaving office in a little over a year.

  8. @Calgary411
    I agree with you; those two statements are what we need to push and push and push with as many new (and returning) MPs as we can as well as with the leadership in general.
    Could we do this (the meeting with MPs) in an organized manner by getting people in the same riding together to meet with the MP together? As for Trudeau, we all should send letters of “congrats plus here is the FATCA issue this new government needs to rectify” (with copies to IBS) with a Cc to the local MP (Liberal or not) with a request for a face-to-face meeting about “A citizen is a citizen is a citizen”.

  9. Looks like I posted this on the wrong thread earlier … so here is the comment. Sorry for the duplication.
    _____________________________________________
    There has been a Twitter & Social Media storm.
    There has been an Uprising by Native Canadians !
    There has been an expression of utter contempt for the Conservative Party of Haperites.
    There is demand that Canada restore her Sovereignty and Charter Rights for all citizens and Residents.
    There has been a glorious flushing sound as the Harperite Bums exited through the sewer.
    By God the Liberals had better do what is right and reverse the unjust laws imposed by Harper. Am I vexed ? Yes I am vexed but I see new hope !
    With God’s help a peaceful revolution … revolution? … nay, restoration of Values, Principles and Privacy … is afoot!

    Thank you Canada !

  10. “a Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian”

    time will only tell just how true this is.

    I am certainly glad a very loud message was sent to my former MP john Weston that the electorate was sick and tired of him. 🙂

  12. As part of communicating with the Liberal leadership about FATCA, Allison Christians recent article about the imbalance of responsibility/reciprocity and treaty status/non-status for the IGAs should be broadly circulated to bring to further light what Canada (and other countries) actually signed on to under threat of economic sanctions.

  13. Obama loves me this I know,
    For King Justin tells me so:
    Americans to him belong.
    They are weak but he is strong.
    Yes, Obama loves me.
    Yes, Obama loves me.
    Yes, Obama loves me.
    King Justin tells me so.

  14. Yes, Tim, someone just predicted that Weston’s replacement, Pam Goldsmith-Jones might be considered for the front bench because she’s “a strong policy person”. Some may recall that when I met with her she asked what a short policy statement would look like, and with the help of a couple other Brockers we came up with something. I have no intention of letting up and look forward to continuing my dialogue with Pam on the FATCA IGA issue. Considering that we are part a growing demographic of people in Canada affected by FATCA and CBT, I don’t think it’s possible for them to ignore us for long especially when, as George reminds us, the federal government is involved in a lawsuit defending the FATCA IGA.

    @The Mom

    Totally love and agree with your “rinse, repeat” comment, but at least we got Harper out of our hair.

  15. That’s my worry too, Petros. That is essentially where he was going when I questioned him about FATCA at one of his early campaign meetings.

    He also said in that response, politician-speak,

    I share your concerns about personal privacy, an issue that is increasingly important to all Canadians. The Conservative government’s efforts to protect the personal privacy of Canadians have been inadequate. The implications of having Canadian banks report directly to a foreign government agency are troublesome. The Liberal Party of Canada will continue to press the government on this issue, and demand a closer examination of FATCA’s effects.

    Thank you once again for writing to me and taking the time to share your concerns with me. It is through such exchanges of ideas and opinions that I can best represent not only my constituents, but all Canadians.

  16. @bubblebustin: I hope you tell John Weston you are “thrilled” at the results in your riding.

    We’re gonna wash that (Harper) man right out of our hair.

    OK I just dated myself. I’m sure many young people have never even heard that song.

  17. LM,

    You will have more people in your neck of the woods to meet with MPs in some organized manner — a good idea if you can make that happen. There has not been identified in Calgary or Alberta a group of Brockers that might accomplish any organized effort here. I tried in vain a couple of years ago to get others in Calgary and area to join me in a demonstration outside a Conservative Convention. I was a one-woman protest against FATCA one day and was joined by another Brocker who travelled in late fall weather to join me (over an hour’s drive) — so the second day we had a two-woman protest on the sidewalks outside the Calgary BMO Centre. Although we are glad we did that, the energy that both of us expended and time off work for the other just was not worth the result.

    I believe the fact is that Calgary hasn’t had other than Conservative MPs since 1968, but we have two from the Liberal Party as of last night. I will correspond with them and other elected MPs in Calgary and Alberta on an individual basis.

  19. @ Bubblebustin,
    If we are all going to try to reach out to our local new Liberal MPs, can you help us by sharing the short policy statement you and a couple other Brockers we came up with?
    Also, anyone else who is writing (letter, email or tweet) to local MPs, sharing exactly what you said here will empower us others to do the same. Thanks

  20. OK Brocker folks, I have a situation and need support /answers / information.

    I invest with a Canadian FFI (for example, RBC-Dominion) and just got a W-8BEN from them that “has to be” filled out and signed; otherwise, they will no longer allow me to trade/invest with them. I spoke with my investment counselors associate (who knows my situation totally and has discussed much about FATCA with me) and told her I found it outrageous that I should be required to sign a US IRS form to say to my Cdn investment firm that I am not a US citizen. They (the FFI) got this exact same information from me back in 2013 via a “Substitute W-8BEN” when I transferred all my accounts there and I would be happy to sign an additional “Substitute W-8BEN” from them now. I’d even be willing to provide a copy of my CLN.
    My recollection is that the IGA includes wording that allows Canadian FFIs to use their own equivalent of a W-8BEN (in this case, the “Substitute W-8BEN” with a page heading of XYZ Wealth Mgmt, ABCD Securities”) rather than the actual US form (which has, at the top “Department of the Treasury, Internal Revenue Service”, so that any signature is “under penalty of perjury” to the US).

    I don’t intend to perjure myself or in any way lie, but is it required, under Cdn law now, that I must sign a US legal document to prove that I am not a US citizen to my Canadian financial institution? I would hate to lose my investment advisor of many years but this has really angered me and I’m sure I am not the only one who will be getting this document to sign now that the FFIs are beginning to look more thoroughly at “established” accounts.

    Any advice / information / links to the part of the IGA stating that FFIs are not required to use the US form / etc would be very greatly appreciated.

  21. We need now to educate the incoming Liberal government about the ill effects of FATCA and the Conservatives’ IGA on up to a million Canadian citizens. We need to convince them to confront the U.S. about that. For those of us in urban areas with lots of U.S. expats, we need to get together and request group meetings with our local M.P.s, especially Liberals, to educate them on the issue. I am willing to help with this in Toronto if others will join me. We can give them a couple of weeks to get settled and set up their constituency offices. Then we need to approach them in groups through those offices in person, not by email or mail, requesting times to meet with the M.P.

  23. To get info on your (or any) MP, one normally can look at http://www.parl.gc.ca/Parliamentarians/en/members

    Currently, however, it says: A general election was held on Monday, October 19, 2015. Election results remain unofficial until the Chief Electoral Officer has confirmed the name of the Member of Parliament elected in each constituency. The complete official list of elected Members of Parliament should be available on Monday, November 9, 2015, the last day for the return of the writs of election. A list of candidates and unofficial election results is available in the interim for your convenience. For information on the election process, please consult the Elections Canada Web site.

    To contact a Member of Parliament, please contact the Information Service at:
    info@parl.gc.ca Toll-free (Canada): 1 (866) 599-4999 Telephone: 1 (613) 992-4793
    TTY: 1 (613) 995-2266

    One can see the list of candidates by province/constituency at:
    http://www.parl.gc.ca/Parliamentarians/en/election-candidates?electionEventId=8758948&electionResultTypeId=-54

  24. @ Petros
    Justin Trudeau said “The Liberal Party of Canada will continue to press the government on this issue, and demand a closer examination of FATCA’s effects.” – – I think we should take him at his word and provide, as much as we can, a detailed closer examination of FATCA’s effects. Such documentation for a closer examination could be sent to all Liberal MPs with a list of individuals who are willing to be contacted for further information (rather than, or in combination with, a scatter-shot of letters to MPs).

    Perhaps this could be through sending him the compilation of all the letters to the US Senate Finance Committee or a copy of the video of interviews made last spring, or someone gathering together all the recent good/supportive anti-FATCA media articles that talk about how FATCA is ruining people’s lives or, maybe, start a new IBS posting page asking (specifically) Canadians to detail fully how FATCA is effecting us, how this goes against the Charter of Rights & Freedoms, how the IGA is not an equal-partner “treaty”, how there is fear that the bank or investment firm may not want to deal with us (closing accounts like in Europe), how this is effecting our totally-Cdn spouses or business partners or Power of Attorney aging relatives or Girl Guide groups and how much this is costing the financial institutions and the drain on RESP and RDSP contributions provided by Canada’s general population.

    Others’ thoughts on the best way to go about this beyond everyone writing their own letter appealing to him to stop FATCA?

  25. Among my many concerns re. Justin Trudeau is whether or not he will honour Stephen Harper’s promise not to “collect” any U.S. taxes / penalties / fines for the IRS. Justin has stated that he intends to “improve relations” between Canada & the U.S. Will he protect our rights at the same time . . . or will he had over our hard-earned $$ to the IRS?

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