This post appeared on the RenounceUScitizenship blog.
This post was based on a “comment that deserves a place in the Isaac Brock Hall of Fame” left by @AtticusinCanada on the original Forbes article by Robert Wood. I took the comment and created a separate post out of it.
Atticus then left the following comment to this post:
Well, this is a stellar article and a great way to frame Mr. Wood’s article as well. I grow very tired of ignorant back lash from people who couldn’t dream that one day they may wake up and find the U.S. has decided they too need to lose their citizenship through no fault of their own. If it can happen to us, it can happen to them. And when the U.S. is done with you, you get to endure being called an ingrate swine, and told not to let the door hit you on the way out. U.S. citizens need to wake up and face squarely what their country is doing and if there is an ounce of morality in them stand up and say this is wrong.
Some of these Homelanders are suffering from severe distortions of reality.
#Americansabroad defend the homeland militarily and diplomatically http://t.co/AuDiJGu8I2 via @USCitizenAbroad
— AtticusinCanada (@AtticusinCanada) May 28, 2014
Robert Wood, posted a “Memorial Day Article” drawing attention to the renunciations of U.S. citizenship. The very first comment was from a Homelander who is an adherent of the “Don’t let the door hit you on the way out” principle. This particular Homelander writes:
Memorial Day is a singularly poor time to get weepy over these ingrate swine. If life is tough on U.S. citizens renouncing their nation for money, too bad.
“Ingrate swine”? This Homelander has got it in reverse. Consider the following:
Families of Patriotic #Americansabroad defend the Homeland militarily http://t.co/LCMosdqJYj
— U.S. Citizen Abroad (@USCitizenAbroad) May 28, 2014
“Clearly, Robert Kelley has no idea the impact FATCA is having on innocent families abroad. Ingrate swine?? These are the people who defended the U.S. abroad. I’ll have you know Robert Kelley, that my father was in the army, my grandfather served in WWII, my uncle served one tour in Korea and two tours in Vietnam and I have a nephew who is a Marine who also served in Afghanistan.
I had to renounce and it isn’t “for money” I would never owe any U.S. taxes. The ability to be able to keep our mortgage was a huge issue. The rights of my Canadian spouse to not have his banking data shared with a nation he is not a citizen of was another and those are just for starters. I spoke with my uncle about what was happening to my family over FATCA before he passed last year. I was very close to him and I will quote him “If that was happening to me I’d have to think about giving up my citizenship too. I sure don’t blame you.” I think I’ll take HIS opinion over those who are ill informed on this topic and unless you’ve served as much as he did you’ve no right to judge.
Some of these people YOU are calling “ingrate swine” have done more for the U.S. than you can dream of. On this “Memorial Day” some of them served in the U.S. military and now find they can’t keep their citizenship because of FATCA. I’ve met quite a few people in that situation. Maybe you should educate yourself on the collateral damages FATCA is causing before you make such blatantly ill informed, harmful remarks against those who have already been harmed enough through no fault of their own.
As I am one of those “ungrateful swine” I’ll just list a few things I used to do before FATCA came after my family. I urged my Canadian spouse to always do his best to buy American when investing. We shopped over the border to support the U.S., I got on a plane and volunteered after the Oklahoma City bombing as that is my hometown. I sent money to NYC to support the victims there, I took my entire Canadian family to Disney World one month after 9/11 because I wanted to support the U.S. economy after such a tragedy. In every conversation I had here in Canada when someone bashed the U.S., I defended. And much, much more as I saw all of the above as my duty to my home country. Unfortunately, my home country decided to treat every single expat as a criminal until proven otherwise, and not just us but, our foreign spouses and children too.
The type of people the U.S. is losing are NOT traitorous ingrates sir, they are people who previously defended and supported the U.S. while living abroad. A valuable asset which the U.S. hasn’t yet understood they are losing. My family made the U.S.A. as much as anyone else’s did. In fact we were there since before the revolution. Many have no choice. FATCA is so onerous that for some keeping citizenship is not an option. Even some in congress have acknowledged this and so has the tax payer advocate. I wouldn’t be so quick to get on a high horse if I were you, perhaps some FATCA education is in order.”
Patriotic #Americansabroad protect and further the interests of the Homeland diplomatically http://t.co/QBAbLcUzmw
— U.S. Citizen Abroad (@USCitizenAbroad) May 28, 2014
“Atticus in Canada:
The irony is that you are a Patriot in the finest tradition of American Patriots. Your renunciation of American citizenship is a great loss to America.
What American Homelanders fail to realize is how much Americans abroad provide a positive image of America internationally.
Americans abroad have traditionally been the equivalent of “word of mouth” advertising for America. That is clearly changing and America will pay a huge price for this. Whether America realizes this is another story.
But, thanks for your support of America and your willing to tell the truth about this situation.”
Atticus, of course, is a defender of what the US ought to be, not what it has become.
Hm, looks like some malformed HTML in the post has borked the layout.
Don’t know what kind of editor is employed on the back end, but if you can view source you’ll likely find an extra closing tag
right around where you embedded that last tweet (“Yet, Homeland forces Patriotic #Americansabroad to renounce citizenship…”).
Well, I’m not defending them anymore and that’s what they are losing. How can I defend something that no longer exists? I cannot. There’s a rude awakening in there. First you try wrangling with congress persons who you are sure at least one of will find the situation unacceptable. That doesn’t work so then you go to the media and try to force a bit of a wake up call down there and to alert others, then you finally realize the U.S. has zero use for expats, look at the cost to your family and must decide if you will throw your family under the bus or give up citizenship. Sorry but,…family first. That’s the choice. Frankly, I wish they’d just say “You’re right, we don’t want any expats and never did want any.” Instead we get commenters like Robert Kelley who won’t admit the U.S. is doing something wrong here but, would rather stick their heads in the sand and blame the victims. I am stymied on that one. I guess knee jerk reactions are easier than understanding it. State seems to get it but, of course they see it every day now and have to deal with the fall out. The whole thing is exasperating. I knew when Mr. Wood posted that article on that particular day though that there would be at least one to come along and react without thinking at all about what they are saying.
I wonder how homelanders would react to the story of a border homelander “accidently” born in Canadian hospital and just had spent hours/days in Canada and then went back to the good ole USSA to grow up, live, work and raise a family and save for retirement and then finds out the Canadian government wants a piece of him because the USSA government signs an IGA to report this “Canadian person” who resides in America and all his American banking is reported to CRA.
Has anyone tried this reverse example?
@northernstar – in a way yes …. this (bar a few years in Aberta as a child) is the story of Ted Cruz, Senator from Texas.
@Atticus, the righteous answer would have been to pair FATCA with a one time limited offer expedited and simplified renunciation option.
They should have said all expats resident overseas on the date FATCA was signed into law should have been able to mail in a duly witnessed renunciation statement and that would have been that.
Alternatively, each government that signed an IGA should have insisted on such a proposal.
I would dare the Canadian Government or any EU government to come up with their own expedited US Renunciation process that would be recognized solely within their borders.
I know t he Cruz story but Canada is not FATCAing him like the USSA is doing to American Canadians and other countries.
@George very good Idea People will have a decision to make … to be an american or not. with no exit fee or FBARS or Tax Returns a one time only thing (Imagine the huge response for a renunciation. They would be swamped.)
@George, your idea of a one-time expedited renunciation option would be great for the people involved in this mess, but for the US government it’s all financial: They stand to make a lot of money both from forcing people into becoming tax compliant, with the penalties and taxes involved, and from exit taxes levied on those who choose to renounce US citizenship. Why would they forgo all that money by being humane?
“Don’t it always seem to go that you don’t know what you got til it’s gone”
“U.S. citizens need to wake up and face squarely what their country is doing and if there is an ounce of morality in them stand up and say this is wrong.”
They won’t because they don’t. Not one single ounce. Especially if they’re a homelander Democrat. All they care about is supporting their begging President who hands out goodies to them and that’s all they care about. They don’t give a damn about us.
That was an excellent comment by Atticus, Glad you highlighted it
I read this on another site: “At some point you just realize your country is not quite yours anymore”
Atticus: What a powerful statement you have made on behalf of all of us who have supported the U.S. in its darkest moments over the years. As a small child, newly arrived in Canada back in 1960, I endured American-bashing on the school playground and I made a point of standing up for “my” country. As I grew up I refused to allow anti-American rhetoric to go unchallenged either with my peers or with my elders. After I fully adopted Canada as my home and became a citizen I continued to defend my American heritage amongst my colleagues, friends and acquaintances. Social gatherings could be quite interesting when somebody who didn’t know my origins got talking about Americans in a derogatory fashion.
That’s over now. I have been betrayed by the land that I loved and I cannot defend her any longer. I realize now that much of how I felt about America was taught to me by my mother who saw the country through a pair of very thick rose-coloured glasses … the America of the storybook. I now see the United States for what it really is. She will get no further support from me.
@Muzzled, I’m so sorry you too find yourself in the “rude awakening” category of Americans abroad. They are losing a lot of FREE supporters which they so badly need but, are too shallow to know it.
Frankly, this is like a long drawn out bad divorce. Ten months and still no CLN for me. As painful as this all has been, I think an expedited way to relinquish/renounce needs to be put in place and give us a no fault divorce and allow us to be law abiding citizens of our adopted countries.
Some have no choice in this matter. The U.S. divorced me not the other way around so why can’t we please, dear god get this over with, with as little drama as possible. I bet State would agree something needs to be done here to expedite these matters for those they have given no choice. I discussed this with my consulate officer and she said “Some people find they cannot be dual.” So that’s just the way it is. They know it. State needs help to expedite the coming flood of relinquishment/renouncement papers. I feel for them, I feel for us and this entire situation was not necessary at all. They could have just re defined “off shore” to mean an account where you do not live. They won’t so here we are.
I agree, Atticus. Why can’t they just “grandfather” us and let us go?
Because the IRS is incapable of providing a definition of just what “us” is.
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