71 thoughts on “1,759 published expatriates in Q2 2017 Federal Register list”

1. Washington TImes./ Congress must stop taxing income that U.S. citizens earn in foreign lands // Grover Norquist- IRS double taxes many Americans working overseas / RNC Resolution Supporting Territorial Taxation For Individuals

   http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/aug/24/ex-patriots-should-not-be-taxed-in-foreign-lands/?utm_campaign=shareaholic&utm_medium=twitter&utm_source=socialnetwork
   ____________________________________________________________________________________________________
   Republicans Overseas .
   The RNC Resolution Supporting Territorial Taxation For Individuals (TTFI) Replacing Citizenship-Based Taxation (CBT) adopted by the RNC Resolutions Committee unanimously yesterday is released for the entire RNC membership to review and vote tomorrow. Since the White House is on board with our Territorial Taxation for Individuals proposal, the resolution is expected to win full RNC approval on Friday.

   https://www.facebook.com/republicansoverseas/photos/pcb.726977897486008/726974060819725/?type=3&theater
   _______________________________________________________________________________________________________

   Grover Norquist on Twitter
   “Overlooked in much of the tax reform debates is how IRS double taxes many Americans working overseas. https://t.co/iQHseCSe6j”
   TWITTER.COM

2. 41,327 renunciants in NICS as of 31 August 2017 (+326 during August)
   https://web.archive.org/web/20170915144107/https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/active_records_in_the_nics-indices.pdf

   Report was much later than usual this month. Finally showed up sometime this week, not sure what day.

3. Renounced U.S. Citizenship 41,327 ??

   What time period ?

4. @Jak Dac: 41,327 is the total number of “renounced U.S. citizenship” entries they’ve added to NICS since NICS got started in 1998. In 1998 they added an initial batch of about 12,000 entries, then didn’t add anything more to the “renounced U.S. citizenship category” until 2005, then added about 29,000 entries since then. +326 refers to the latest monthly update (i.e. they added 326 renunciants during August 2017).

5. This has got to get out there that number will make people look

   May be worth rewording and put it up on FB Citizenship Taxation https://www.facebook.com/CitizenshipTaxation/

6. 41,676 renunciants in NICS as of 30 September 2017 (+349 during September, +1,004 during Q3)
   https://web.archive.org/web/20171005032642/https://www.fbi.gov/file-repository/active_records_in_the_nics-indices.pdf

7. Thank you @Eric for keeping us apprised of the numbers. Much appreciated!

8. I think the small number of renunciations proves that millions of accidentals know how not to be seen, staying under the radar. No wonder there were so few submissions to petitions and letter-writing campaigns.

9. Bingo. That’s why I’m not too interested in renunciation. Costs US$2350 and puts your name on a list sent to the IRS. Much easier to do nothing when you’re protected from penalties by your country of residence and citizenship.

10. Yup, the best way to ensure that CBT and FATCA fail is for millions of expats to continue to do exactly what they are already doing; totally ignoring the whole unworkable, unenforceable mess.

11. I doubt that millions of accidentals and expats are making a conscious, reasoned decision to stay out of the US tax system. I think they either have no idea, or when they do hear rumour of such things, it seems so patently absurd that they refuse to believe it.

12. It’s an interesting mismatch – estimated 9 million Americans, a million or so compliant, and zero enforcement actions arising as a result of FATCA.

    What a waste of (other countries’) money.

13. “the best way to ensure that CBT and FATCA fail is for millions of expats to continue to do exactly what they are already doing; totally ignoring the whole unworkable, unenforceable mess.”

    Unworkable and unenforceable, and likely to drift into the same undead status as CBT, but on its way to half-life FATCA has spawned all these damnable IGAs, which for some people in some countries are having all-too-real consequences.

    FATCA needs to go, and the US needs to agree to sign up to CRS and only get reports on accounts held in other countries by accountholders not resident in the reporting country. And not treat place of birth as grounds for reporting people as suspected criminals, like some hideous pogrom from the Dark Ages.

14. “That’s why I’m not too interested in renunciation. Costs US$2350 and puts your name on a list sent to the IRS.”

    The $2350 is the problem. Lists of non-US-resident non-US-citizens sent to the IRS are irrelevant.

    As are lists of non-US-resident non-US-citizens not living in the US, sent to the FBI so they can make sure none of us can sneak into America and buy guns and commit mass murder.

15. “FATCA needs to go, and the US needs to agree to sign up to CRS and only get reports on accounts held in other countries by accountholders not resident in the reporting country. And not treat place of birth as grounds for reporting people as suspected criminals, like some hideous pogrom from the Dark Ages.”

    The US should only get reports on people physically resident in the US. (US citizens living in one country and banking in a second should have their banking details sent only to the country where they physically reside). Unfortunately, CRS is completely compatible with CBT – if the US joins CRS (not likely) and continues CBT, they’ll just define all citizens as US tax-residents and banks will be required to treat all US citizen accounts as reportable, regardless of where the US citizen lives. The advantage of CRS, though, is in how it is enforced. Enforcement under CRS (and under some Model 1 FATCA IGAs) depends on local law, not US extra-territorial law. So, under CRS, banks aren’t worried about 30% US withholding if they are non-compliant.

16. Karen:

    “Unfortunately, CRS is completely compatible with CBT – if the US joins CRS (not likely) and continues CBT, they’ll just define all citizens as US tax-residents and banks will be required to treat all US citizen accounts as reportable, regardless of where the US citizen lives.”

    I should have been clearer. I would like to see changes to CRS also. I’ll rephrase and expand:

    The US needs to agree to sign up to CRS

    – and CRS needs to be amended so that only accounts belonging to non-residents of the reporting country are reported on. The obligation for banks in one country to sleuth out all countries of tax-residence should be dropped.

    Any individual CRS country can only have knowledge of whether an accountholder is or is not resident in that country. If the US signed up to CRS, it would need to sign bilateral agreements with each country it wanted reports from, and, more significantly, wanted to report to.

    If FATCA is repealed and the US still refuses to sign up to CRS, that would be ok with me.

17. Additionally, some newspaper articles stated that the eldest daughter of newly-appointed South Korean foreign minister Kang Kyung-hwa planned to renounce US citizenship, but I haven’t been able to confirm whether she’s actually gone through with this.

    Kang Kyung-hwa’s daughter appears to be actually planning to go through with giving up US citizenship. She applied to the South Korean government for restoration of citizenship, and got a police report from the US (a document required by the South Korean side) in August, says a news report from a couple of weeks ago. Once her South Korean citizenship is restored, she has to show her CLN (or at least proof that she’s applied for one and is waiting for it) to the South Korean government within two years.

    http://www.newdaily.co.kr/news/article.html?no=358076

18. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/6039G#d

    Notwithstanding any other provision of law, not later than 30 days after the close of each calendar quarter, the Secretary shall publish in the Federal Register the name of each individual losing United States citizenship (within the meaning of section 877(a) or 877A) with respect to whom the Secretary receives information under the preceding sentence during such quarter.

    Quarterly reminder: the IRS deliberately refuses to obey Subtitle F, Chapter 61, Subchapter A, Part III, Subpart A of the “Internal” Revenue Code
    https://www.federalregister.gov/public-inspection/2017/10/30

    But they expect you to obey it. Laws are for little people.
    https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/6038D

19. Again.

20. Q3 list is out. About 1,370 published expatriates.
    https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2017/11/02/2017-23885/quarterly-publication-of-individuals-who-have-chosen-to-expatriate

21. Thank you, Eric. By my calculations, that’s 4442 so far this year. With only 962 needed in Q4 to exceed last year’s total, 2017 promises to be another record-breaking year.