Patricia Moon mentions a potential $455,000 FBAR fine on her financial accounts in the recent article in the Wall Street Journal. Now it doesn’t take very much FBAR math to figure out what her financial assets are. She lives in Toronto, so on paper she is likely what I would call a middle-class millionaire; but she is house rich but not cash rich. A million dollars doesn’t make a person rich, since most houses in major Canadian cities are now worth over a million. But the alarming thing is that in the United States the average wage earner makes less than $27,000 and 46 million people are on food stamps. These are indications that the majority of people in the United States have dropped out of the middle class. On this, Charles Hugh Smith has written a definitive essay, “What does it take to be Middle Class?” His conclusion is that one needs a minimum of 100K income per year to even be considered middle class, and that greatly exceeds the median household income. In this light, even a large number of the so-called “one percent” are not rich but only middle class. Still the majority of American homelanders have little sympathy for the Patricia Moons of the world who renounce their US citizenship in order to save themselves from financial ruin. Obama also won the last election by over 50% of participating voters. Is that a coincidence? Hardly.
Since the advent of the One, the Messiah and Saviour, the President of Hope and Change, the IRS has threatened our unreported “foreign” financial accounts with 300% fines. Yet if we complain about this treatment, the majority of Americans don’t care or think that it is only fair and just to go after expats. We are, after all, rich FATCATS who shouldn’t have the right to live in luxury in foreign countries when we should be back in the homeland contributing to their food stamps. How dare we live in Canada? And now some of us have had the audacity to tell the author of The Audacity of Hope, “Take this United States citizenship and shove it up your food stamp program”–for which we aren’t even eligible unless we move back to the land of importunity.
Now many of you know that I am a particularly wicked rabblerouser, shit disturber, and the ring leader of this blog site, which is on the NSA list of websites (since they are literally listening to everything). I told the world that I will never file an FBAR–I for one would not submit to the USA’s importunate demand for financial information–this is in contrast to the recent capitulation on FATCA of the honourable eunuch, Prime Minister Stephen Harper. But this means I could be charged with a felony in the United States for willful FBAR violation, in addition to the 300% fines of my financial wealth. So if I don’t submit to their importunity, I could receive a penalty which would be a clear violation of the excessive fines clause of the US constitution–as I don’t see how 300% theft of a person’s financial wealth is not excessive. Now thanks to the statute of limitations, the potential damage to my middle class savings portfolio is diminished. Here is how it works, to the best of my knowledge:
I renounced the United States on February 28, 2011–actually, I relinquished my US citizenship by becoming a Canadian citizen. Six years from the day my last FBAR was due (June 30, 2011), I will at last have reached the statute of limitations on the FBAR requirement. Thus, on June 17, 2017, my last FBAR requirement will exceed the statute of limitations and I should be free and clear. Yet with each new June 30 that arrives, the requirement from six years earlier also reaches the statute of limitations. Thus, on June 30, 2014, my 2008 FBAR requirement will expire and I will only have my 2009, 2010 and 2011 FBARs to worry about. So that means I am only subject to 50% fines of my financial wealth for three years, which equals 150% of my financial wealth.
Now do you see why I was in hurry to rid myself of United States citizenship? The sooner I rid myself of my tush tatoo marking me as property of the United States government, the sooner the FBAR statute of limitations expire. I will finally be a free man. Well, not really. My final tax filings that took place in 2012 will exceed statute of limitations for an audit only in 2015, but if the IRS detects fraud in them, there is no statute of limitations. Oh well, the United States has to maintain its reputation as the Hotel California, “You can check out anytime you like, but you can never leave”.
The statute of limitations has also disappeared from the constitution. If I remember right, FBARs have none.
If not, Schumer will make a law to get rid of it anyways.
Ex-pats are in total agreement, we weren’t there when the USG overspent (not to mention two wars on the USGs credit card), so we’re not the ones who are going to pay it back. Homelanders should be footing the USGs bail in – not us.
Can pay, but won’t pay.
This article deals with the statute of limitations and some of the uncertainties. So there is no clear answer, is there? All the more reason to consider the United States the land of importunity.
http://www.forbes.com/sites/robertwood/2013/12/17/whats-the-fbar-statute-of-limitations/
That’s exactly how the 99% think. Their sense of entitlement to other people’s money is disgusting.
With the IRS telling Congress that “The dog ate my homework” and their clear criminal activities regarding groups and individuals in the US who disagree with the current admin politically it is more than worrying beyond comprehension that ANY information from any ex-pat be sent to them for any reason whatsoever. EVER. Even more reason to question just why our government signed an IGA in the first place. Just saying NO would have been so much more admirable than the obvious caving to the banks. Because, you see, they told our government that the US had “made an offer they can’t refuse” !
Either that or the big banks in Canada will find a horse’s head in the beds of their CEOs in short order.
@ FuriousAC
You are always perceptive. Deep in the shadows all around this world there is a heinous, criminal network which has control of things, for the moment, and the threats to world puppet “leaders” go far and beyond what we can imagine. Those leaders who do not require threats are simply the bamboozled ones. Peons such as we are only permitted to function at a micro level and the macro level is seldom revealed to us, even if we care or dare to look. Enough said.
@Petros, actually your final FBAR statutes of limitations would run out on 30 June 2018 for your 2012 filing for 2011, the year you relinquished. I understand that the criminal SOL is five years but is six years for non-willful non-compliance.
I worry that you are goading the IRS and DOJ to actually go after you, if just to make a point.
Ok, Monalisa, one more year of slavery. crap. You just made my day.
No, I think it’s not a full year in any case, because my FBAR violations would end on February, 2011, in any case. So the last date that they could prosecute me for an FBAR which could no longer be committed after February 28, 2011, is February 28, 2017. This is actually an interesting question.
@monalisa1776
I thought Fbar had no statue of limitations? Been reading too much that its becoming very confusing…. sigh
Hi Petros, I see what you mean but tonight that the statutes of limitation would start running after each year’s deadline, I.e. 30 June. I think they would have come after you by now if they were going to do so though.
IRS websites says:
The problem is that on June 30, 2012, I was not a US person. So I didn’t have to file a FBAR on that date for the preceding year, according to their definition of who must file one.
@US person foreigner, I understand it to mean that FBARs have a normal six year statute of limitations.
They do until they don’t. As we have seen in the past , things are what Treasury says it is. And according to the Senators discussing this issue, it can, may and ( mostly likely) will change at the whim of the IRS depending on just how many they can trip up or trap and catch.
Warrants? What? Warrants be damned. We want it ALL from everybody , everywhere, and their children and grandchildren and YOUR retirement and THEIR inheritance. They have not and will not stop at “U.S. Persons” and when GATCA implements in Sept of this year we will ALL see just how invasive and pervasive this thing really is.
@Furious, I fear you may be right though I’d like to think it’s not going to be as ominous as all that. I do share your concern that they may extend who they include as ‘US Persons’, including recent renunciants, for example. They could also pass retroactive legislation to our detriment in various guises. In an Orwellian world, we may have to learn to live with perpetual uncertainty.
@FuriousAC
And then they`ll not only make a new law, but they will have it apply RETROACTIVELY!!
HELP
My husband is attempting his first (and last) e-file FBAR and this is the message he is getting:
This Connection is Untrusted
You have asked Firefox to connect securely to bsaefiling1.fincen.treas.gov, but we can’t confirm that your connection is secure.
Normally, when you try to connect securely, sites will present trusted identification to prove that you are going to the right place. However, this site’s identity can’t be verified.
What Should I Do?
If you usually connect to this site without problems, this error could mean that someone is trying to impersonate the site, and you shouldn’t continue.
bsaefiling1.fincen.treas.gov uses an invalid security certificate. The certificate is not trusted because no issuer chain was provided. (Error code: sec_error_unknown_issuer)
If you understand what’s going on, you can tell Firefox to start trusting this site’s identification. Even if you trust the site, this error could mean that someone is tampering with your connection.
Don’t add an exception unless you know there’s a good reason why this site doesn’t use trusted identification.
He’s been on hold on the so-called tech helpline for a looooooong time and no one has answered yet. Has anybody else encountered this? If so, did you proceed without a valid security certificate?
Okay, after more waiting my husband got through to a tech guy on the helpline who said that message always comes up for Macs with Firefox but to ignore it and proceed. It didn’t feel very secure but he did go on to finally complete the form and then with great trepidation pressed “submit”. He actually removed our normal hard drive from the computer and replaced it with an alternate to do all this, just in case they sent back some kind of bug. I’m exhausted just watching this take place over the past 2 hours. HINT: For others about to go through this e-filing nonsense be sure to fill in COUNTRY first and then go back to fill in PROVINCE and POSTAL CODE, otherwise those fields will try to fill in a US state and zip code.
Just goes to show that without the help of our banks, they’d probably just leave us alone.
Umm… did you officially renounce your US citizenship? Becoming a Canadian citizen doesn’t cancel out your US citizenship; you must officially renounce it.
Sincerely, TG
Dual US/Canadian citizen (by default) since 2014
@TG re: ”
Umm… did you officially renounce your US citizenship? Becoming a Canadian citizen doesn’t cancel out your US citizenship; you must officially renounce it.”
Not sure where you got that idea but that’s not “might be wrong” or “could be wrong” or “probably wrong”, it is absolutely dead wrong. Becoming a Canadian citizen with the intent to lose US citizenship will result in immediate loss of US citizenship. If you don’t believe me, Google INA 349 and read it for yourself. Unlike a lot of US citizenship law, INA 349 is crystal clear on this point. If such a person later appears at a US consulate to document that loss by applying for a CLN, that document will show the loss occurred on the day before the person became a Canadian.
All of this hinges on intent and only the individual can know what that is. However, if said person does something to act like a US citizen after becoming a Canadian that will put his intent in question. Examples include traveling on a US passport, voting in a US election, filing US taxes, or other indications the person still considers themselves to be a US citizen. In such a situation you are right; appearing and swearing the oath of renunciation is the only sure way to lose US citizenship.