Liberty and justice for all United States persons abroad

The Isaac Brock Society

Posted on by Posted in Issues regarding US persons abroad 162 Comments

If you are a Canadian citizen, you have the opportunity, and IMO the responsibility, to vote in the October 19 Canadian federal election. Certainly if you reside in Canada, and (with some restrictions I won’t go into here) even if you don’t.

This is Canadians’ opportunity to pass judgment on whether the government of Stephen Harper has stood up for Canada, for Canadian values, for Canada’s Charter of Rights and Freedoms, and for Canadian citizens. And to decide whether maybe some other party should be given the chance to govern our country, for the better (we all hope).

My personal advice is to vote for anyone other than the Conservative in your riding, either the candidate most likely to defeat the Conservative candidate, or if you can’t figure out who that might be, perhaps the party leading in the national polls as of today (the Liberals) and hence with the most credible chance of getting more seats than the Conservatives and hence forming our next government. Or, if you have an incumbent MP who isn’t a Conservative and whom you respect and like, vote for that incumbent.

If you can’t bring yourself to vote for anyone other than a Conservative, but are appalled at Stephen Harper’s idea of governance of Canada, take former Progressive Conservative Premier of Newfoundland and Labrador Danny Williams’ advice, and just stay at home and don’t vote this time around. Ignore that absurd recommendation by the Globe and Mail, which said the Conservatives deserve another mandate but Harper doesn’t. In our parliamentary system you can’t make that distinction, it makes no sense. Harper is the Conservative leader, if the Conservatives really wanted to they could have deposed him but didn’t, and trying to say the Conservatives aren’t to blame for Harper’s style of governance is utterly ridiculous. They’re all joined at the hip.

But VOTE. If you’re eligible to vote in this election and don’t, IMO you’ve lost any right to complain about the outcome.

I was born and educated in the US. After completing my post-graduate education, I entered Canada on a temporary work permit, moving to Canada because of the Vietnam war. Shortly after unpacking, I applied for landed immigrant status. A few months later I received in the mail an induction notice from the US Army; I drew a peace symbol on it in felt marker pen and mailed it back. As a result, I was indicted and a warrant was issued for my arrest (both were quashed in 1977 by the Carter amnesty). I became a Canadian citizen in 1975. In 1976, for the US Bicentennial I wrote a political letter to Henry Kissinger, then Secretary of State. In it I mentioned that I had "renounced" (I didn't then know of "relinquish") my US citizenship on becoming a Canadian, explaining in several pages my reasons for leaving the US. I also mentioned the fact that on my mother's side I am a descendant of a soldier who fought in Washington's army during the US rebellion, but now I was declaring my personal independence from the US and rejoining the British Commonwealth. Within six months, I received by mail a CLN recognizing my having expatriated myself from the US in 1975. I filed away my CLN and forgot I had it, until I found it after searching for it upon learning of FATCA and OVDI in August 2011. Since then, I proudly keep a photocopy of it with my passport (which is Canadian; I have never had a US passport in my life, nor will I ever). As a Canadian who long since ceased being an American and who has a CLN, I am not directly affected by FATCA or other US taxation outrages. However, my wife and several of her friends are affected, until their relinquishment CLNs (dating from 30-40 years ago) are issued. Also I have several close friends who were born in Canada of US parents and are considered by the US to be US citizens, though they have never lived in the US, worked there, earned income there, held property there, held US passports, or in any other way excercised USC and are horrified they might be considered US. I am active on this website and in writing my elected Canadian politicians about these issues, on their behalf. I am a retired former employee of the Government of Canada who faithfully and proudly served his adopted and adoptive country for many years. Updated September 2, 2012: earlier this week, my wife finally received her relinquishment CLN, State Department formal recognition that (in their exact words on the CLN) she "ceased to be a US citizen on" the date she became a Canadian more than 35 years ago. Mission Accomplished, to borrow words from my least-favourite contemporary/contemptible American. I will continue to monitor this website from time to time to see if I contribute useful information or opinions, but my wife and I are determined to regain our lives after the past twelve months of angst. Best wishes to all of you on this website in your odyssey toward freedom from the US.

162 thoughts on “October 19 is Election Day in Canada”

  1. I agree with you, Tricia. How can anyone of us know or assume what will happen? I think that it’s prudent that each eventuality brought forward is checked. Responsibly, only after checking can we then, with confidence, cross it off as a possibility of what might happen and be a problem for someone. To me, litigation including against CBT itself, seems the most logical means to protect citizens and permanent residents of countries outside the US. There is a whole lot of money being spent by the US, other governments and the US tax compliance industry to identify persons. It seems (what’s another word for silly?) to spend all that without means built into the whole process to collect with the data collected. It remains (in my mind at least) that many of us can be caught in this if we just ignore it all and think we’ll be OK.

    That underlines that some of us have a whole lot more risk tolerance than others and we all must make our individual decisions. Thanks again for pursuing this.

  3. “To me, litigation including against CBT itself, seems the most logical means to protect citizens and permanent residents of countries outside the US.”

    It doesn’t matter how logical it is. A repetition of the Bopp suit will accomplish nothing.

    By the way Carol, is your son over 18? If he is, then I think even the IRS cannot register your son’s birth at a US consulate. If he’s younger than 18 then he can get trapped against his will, but if he’s over 18 then he’s the only one who’s allowed to choose whether to trap himself. I don’t know if the same law that prevents him from untrapping himself would allow him to trap himself, but still, if he doesn’t trap himself he’s free. He has an unexercised claim to US citizenship, which no one has registered at a US consulate, so he isn’t a US citizen.

  4. Norman Diamond,

    A repetition of the Bopp suit isn’t what a suit against CBT would necessarily be.

    My son is 41 and he was never registered as a US Birth Abroad at a US Consulate. As I understand it, though he acquired US-deemed US citizenship by birth in Canada to two US parents, he would have to travel to the US to register for a SSN, etc.

    No, I ain’t taking him there, and he would not be able to accomplish that himself. To renounce his supposed US citizenship, he must not have the influence or the assistance of anyone to determine that he would want to renounce a citizenship that would be FOREIGN to him since he was born and has lived his life in Canada and never had any benefit of anything from the US.

    Further the only reason, anyone in their right mind would have this happen, is to be able to then be able to renounce that US citizenship, which he can’t do because of *lack of requisite mental capacity*. Go back to START / DO NOT PASS GO.

    (All of the above does not negate the fact that his name and the accounts I hold for him, including the RDSP on which I paid US$3,661 US tax to the IRS – as the Holder of the RDSP / my son the beneficiary – for the bonds and grants the Canadian government (read Canadian taxpayer) matched with the funds I contributed to the Canadian registered account, are delineated on FBAR yearly forms that I submitted to the US Treasury.)

    What it all means when I die and the small estate (mainly my home) will go to my children, I don’t know. A Canadian law firm / Provincial government / Canadian banking and trust persons would then be involved.

  5. “As I understand it, though he acquired US-deemed US citizenship by birth in Canada to two US parents, he would have to travel to the US to register for a SSN, etc.”

    Yes, but as a prerequisite, BEFORE doing that, if he wants to acquire his US citizenship, he has to register himself at a US consulate because he’s over 18. Even if you go insane and decide you want to register his birth at a US consulate, you can’t any more because he’s over 18. So as long as he doesn’t register himself, he can’t even go get an SSN or anything, he’s still free. Whether or not he might hypothetically be allowed to renounce, he doesn’t have to renounce because his birth hasn’t been registered. His acquisition of US citizenship is still potential, not accomplished, and he’s free.

    Your declarations to the US, whether they were a mistake or not, are not a declaration to the consulate. Since your son is over 18, the IRS can’t register him at a consulate either. You don’t have to make more mistakes, just stop filing stuff that assumed he was a US citizen.

  6. ND,

    I stopped filing all I had to file, including FBARs listing all of my financial accounts and Forms 3520 and 3520A’s for the foreign trusts that the Canadian registered accounts, the RDSP and TFSA, are considered to get out from under my US suffocation the year after my renunciation in 2012.

    I have not, and never did, ever consider my son’s (or my daughter’s) registration as a US citizen, either after his birth or now, many decades later. As far as I’m concerned….

  8. Calgary411, I thought you were still filing and paying US tax on some amounts due to the assumption that your son is a US person. That should stop. If it stopped, good. The only person who can make your son a US citizen at his age is himself. Let’s hope no one tricks him into doing it.

  9. I have just posted the following at the Jamaica Gleaner – which frequently does not allow comment out of moderation. http://jamaica-gleaner.com/article/commentary/20151023/editorial-trudeau-and-caribbean
    __________________________________________________________
    LOL. If Trudeau’s new Govt does NOT reverse (or facilitate the de facto reversal) of the Abuses of the Canadian Charter of Rights (which is very similar indeed to our own here) imposed by former PM Harper … such as the Bill 51, the Devaluation of Canadian Citizenship by creation of different classes of citizenship, the Abuse of the privacy of some classes of Canadians due to FATCA and the proposed CRS, the abuse of Native Canadians and Missing Women etc ….. then his term in Government will likely be short as the same Canadian Voters who have “Heaved Steve” and “Dumped Harper & His Hooligans” reject him too in turn. Let no one be fooled. MANY Canadians (including many traditional conservative voters) voted in this last election on three issues and those were the Abuses of the Charter of Rights, the Imposition of Unjust Laws & Legislation in Secrecy behind closed doors pushed through in Omnibus Bills. The Canadian electorate will not stand for Harperite like destruction of Canadian Principles and the erosion of Canadian Sovereignty in Canada.

  10. Amazingly useless government representative for many of her constituents. Fortunately, Michelle Rempel is no longer my representative as the riding boundaries changed. The Liberal candidate in my riding almost beat out the Conservative here — close but no cigar. He would have been a good MP and I did have good conversation going with him. Alas.

    The good news is that Calgary now has two Liberal MPs — the first time it has not been completely Conservative since 1968.

    One of the two new Liberal MPs, Kent Hehr in Calgary Centre, has stated he will represent all Calgarians — eventually I hope to meet with him along with one other Brocker here who has been conversing with him on Facebook. It would be great if any other Calgary Brockers be able to join us at that eventual meeting. I have had some discussion with Kent on FATCA and other issues, so his learning curve has started.

    Darshan King from Calgary Skyview is the other new Liberal MP here — I am looking for contact information for him. Congratulations to both of them — and Matt Grant in my riding — who carried out a strong campaign in Conservative territory.

  12. Still not a lot to work with in Calgary, but we have made some progress with now two elected Liberal MPs.

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