The following is cross-posted from Maple Sandbox, original post by Blaze:
Anne Frank over at Brock made a brilliant but simple suggestion on Friday for a proposed amendment to the enabling act for the IGA. Anne said:
Canada COULD unilaterally amend the IGA via the implementation treaty with a simple “notwithstanding” clause to the effect of “Notwithstanding any other provision of this Act or the IGA, no Canadian citizen resident in Canada or other permanent resident of Canada shall be considered to be a “US Person” for purposes of the Act or the IGA”. The IGA would be unamended – the implementation Act would simply gut it of its Charter-violating aspect…
The Act is amended by inserting after subsection 4(1) thereof the following:
“section 4 (1.1) Notwithstanding any other provision of this Act or the Agreement, for all purposes related to the implemenation of this Act and the Agreement, “US Person” and “Specified US Person” shall not include any person who is a Canadian citizen or is a landed immigrant ordinarily resident in Canada.”
That simple amendment, made to the implementing Act, would put the ball right back in Treasury’s court. They can deem all Canadian financial institutions non-compliant and bring their own financial house of cards down about their own heads (as withholding, while possibly lawful in the US, will not excuse the withholder in any other jurisdiction, including Canada). It would take a positive act on the part of Treasury to blacklist the entire country. They would not be able to point to 10 cents of revenue that they would be seeking to protect in so doing. Further, as pointed out above, Canada would have more than enough fodder to retaliate in kind given the far larger magnitude of US investments in Canada (most of which, unlike bank accounts, can’t be moved overnight). All they would have to do is pretend that the IGA is compliant and drive on. It would be a brilliant move by the Government were they to allow themselves to be backed into it due to a serious Charter Challenge.
BLAZE ADDS: I ran that idea by a few people and have learned that amendment would be best in the enabling law and not in the IGA because the enabling act can be amended in Parliament, but an IGA amendment would require Finance Canada to submit the revisions to US Treasury for approval.
So, Friday night I sent this e-mail to NDP Finance Critic Nathan Cullen and Liberal Finance and Revenue Critic Scott Brison who are vice-chairs of the Finance Committee with copies to Finance Committee members Murray Rankin (NDP) and Guy Caron (Liberal). I also sent a copy to Elizabeth May.
Thank you Mr. Cullen and Mr. Brison for your position and that of your NDP, Liberal and Green colleagues on FATCA in the House of Commons.
The Harper Cons and Finance Canada have been consistent in their unwillingness to listen to Canadians on this and many other issues.
I am writing to you as vice-chairs of the Finance Committee to suggest an amendment to the enabling legislation and/or IGA and to ask if you and/or your party would consider supporting Canadians on a possible constitutional challenge.
SUGGESTED AMENDMENT:
Here is a suggested amendment to the FATCA enabling legislation and/or the IGA.
“Notwithstanding any other provision of this Act or the Agreement, for all purposes related to the implementation of this Act and the Agreement, “US Person” and “Specified US Person” shall not include any person who is a Canadian citizen or legal permanent resident who is ordinarily resident in Canada.”
With a Conservative majority on the Finance Committee and in the House, I realize this amendment would be likely to fail. However, it may force Conservatives into voting against it, showing they clearly will not stand up for Canadian citizens and residents who were born in the United States.
POSSIBLE CONSTITUTIONAL CHALLENGE
You raised the Charter issue in the House. For your information, Dr. Stephen Kish and I have retained Joseph Arvay for a legal opinion on this. We were able to do this because we raised the money for this legal opinion in just six days from Canadians and people around the world.
If the Charter challenge proceeds further, we expect we will be able to raise the funds for that. Would you and/or your party consider supporting us in this?
Attached is a copy of a news release issued on March 10 regarding this.
Again, thank you for your efforts on this affront to Canadian citizens, residents, laws, rights and sovereignty.
****************
SCHUBERT’S COMMENT, POSTED ON SANDBOX:I sent a similar email to Nathan Cullen the same day that Blaze sent her email (in fact, we consulted briefly on this by private email), giving some further arguments for the political advantages of forcing the Conservatives to vote on the proposed amendment.
The next day as it happens I received a recorded voice-mail robo-message at home from Tom Mulcair (Leader of the NDP and of the Opposition in the House of Commons), reminding me he was giving a speech Sunday morning April 6 in downtown Ottawa to kick off the NDP’s 2015 election campaign, inviting me and my wife to attend that speech. The venue is an easy walk from our home.
I decided it was important to reinforce the emails with some personal contact, taking advantage of the meeting and hoping that Cullen might be in attendance (he wasn’t, as it happens). So I printed copies both of my email and Blaze’s and stapled the copies together.
I attended the speech. Immediately prior to the speech, I had a brief opportunity (which I took) to introduce myself to Mulcair (who was waiting for an elevator next to me) and to hand him a copy of the emails. I said I’d hoped to give the emails to Cullen, but he wasn’t there, and giving them to the Leader of the Opposition was so much the better. Mulcair smiled, accepted the pages, and said his caucus had repeatedly raised FATCA and the IGA problems in the House earlier that week. I said I knew that, and thanked him profusely for the NDP’s support on this. He gave me two thumbs up and disappeared into the elevator, 20 minutes or so before giving his speech.
After the speech, I saw my MP Paul Dewar (NDP Foreign Affairs Critic) at the back of the audience. I spoke briefly with him, confirmed with him that Cullen is the NDP’s “point person” on the omnibus budget bill and related matters including FATCA, and gave Dewar my backup copy of the emails. Dewar told me he would deliver the printouts to Cullen himself.
So that’s two independent and very senior by-hand routings of the draft amendment to Cullen, in addition to his email inbasket which may or may not get a lot of attention in the next few days. I think we can reasonably assume those in the NDP who need to, will read the draft amendment and the rationale for it. What they do with this is, of course, up to them and their strategy and priorities under the tight time deadlines the Conservatives are imposing on Parliament for debating and voting on this complex and fundamentally anti-democratic omnibus “budget bill” (which isn’t a true budget bill, but an abomination and an abuse both of the budget and of parliamentary procedure).
Thanks to “Anne Frank” for suggesting the draft amendment in a post a few days ago. Once again, we’ve all shown how we Canadians can support each other in this battle, on short notice.
@steveklaus; Spot on.
It was discussed on IBS this year
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2014/03/05/obama-administration-asks-congress-for-fatca-reciprocity-in-latest-green-book/comment-page-1/
Here is a budget document, go to page 202 and we see Dual US/fill in blank, are safeguarded and not thrown under the bus.
@Bubblebustin.
Small world eh? I bet you gave that cab driver something to think about!
When a person is emigrating from their old country and Immigrating into Canada … he or she first gets Landed Immigrant Status on arrival in Canada with the requisite pre-approved immigration documents in hand. That Landed Immigrant Status is an Official condition and allows the Landed Immigrant to remain in Canada, obtain a Social Insurance Number, work and pretty much do all things that a Citizen can do and then after a period of 3 (?) or so years of actual residency entitles the holder to apply for full Canadian Citizenship. I stand to be corrected on this … but I think that if that Landed Immigrant already has citizenship of another Commonwealth country then they are even able to vote. I think of Landed Immigrant Status as the equivalent of Green Card Status (in the south-land) on steroids.
Just a follow up …. a Green Card is intended to allow a foreigner (LOL … an alien) to have the ability to legally reside and work in the US. Landed Immigrant Status in Canada is an official, transient condition pending full citizenship.
The proposed amendment is fantastic! Thanks, Anne Frank, and to all who have conveyed it to the opposition members. This amendment is exactly what we need!
While we can take comfort in the fact that CRA will not collect on behalf of the IRS from any Canadian citizen, the agreement the Conservatives have signed clearly allows the IRS to try to do so by itself!
They will likely plug their ears and hum. The IGA they have signed will keep the USA happy while tossing innocent people to a foreign government for prosecution. What do they care? If the way they have shown their loyalty to Canadians so far, I wish anyone luck in reaching our PHONY politicians. There appear to be very few who are willing to stand up for the victims. The leaders have simply, knowing the consequences to the victims. simply caved.
@MuzzledNoMore, “While we can take comfort in the fact that CRA will not collect on behalf of the IRS from any Canadian citizen, the agreement the Conservatives have signed clearly allows the IRS to try to do so by itself!”
Its the slippery slope argument, the camels nose under the tent.
With all the data the USA is going to get, does anyone think they are going to stand back and not demand bags of tribute?
Someone will do some Washington math and figure that billions and billions of dollars are being cheated away up in Canada.
Mark my word, the WILL pass another law threatening 50% cross border withholding if your Government does not change its laws to help the US “get its money.”
@Brockers, the reality is that the 30% threat by the USA is not good will negotiating amongst 21st Century allies.
Its plain old extortion. The promise made by Flaherty will be broken!!
You must win under a Charter Challenge.
We are taught to never forget history;
” On September 27, 1943, one of the Nazi commanders in Rome demanded that the Jewish community pay one hundred pounds of gold within thirty-six hours or three hundred Jews would be taken prisoner. Despite the payment of the ransom 2,091 Jews were deported on October 16, 1943, and most of them died in Germany. “
Wonderful work Anne Frank, Schubert & Blaze!
Last night I copied my March 10 Finance submission to MP’s Mulcair, Cullen, Brison & Rankin. I encourage everyone to contact opposition MP’s about trying to achieve this amendment, especially if you live in a riding that is not Conservative.
Dear Opposition Members of Parliament Mulcair, Cullen, Brison & Rankin:
Please see below the letter that I submitted to Finance Canada regarding the IGA that the ruling Conservatives signed with the United States regarding the planned implementation of the foreign US law “Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act”. I know that you have recently been contacted by concerned Canadian citizens of US origin about a simple amendment to the enabling act that would make the definition of “US Person” or “Specified US Person” exclude any Canadian citizen or permanent resident who is ordinarily resident in Canada. I urge you to support such an amendment. I am a Canadian citizen from birth and I have lived my life in Canada. Yet I am potentially affected by this IGA and FATCA. Please stand up for all Canadian citizens and residents against the disgraceful conduct of our current Conservative government. Thank you for your attention to this very important matter.
Tax Policy Branch March 10, 2014
Department of Finance
Canada
Dear Sir/Madam:
I wish to voice my strongest objection to the proposed information exchange between Canada and the USA for tax purposes. This agreement allows Canada’s sovereignty to be surrendered to the United States by allowing the US to enforce (through the foreign American law “FATCA”) their system of citizenship-based taxation. The United States believes that it has the right to tax “US Persons” around the world. There are thousands of innocent hard-working Canadian citizens of (often distant) US origin who live in Canada, earn income in Canada, pay taxes in Canada and have no economic connection to the US. It is immoral and unjust that these people should be pursued by the United States IRS for taxes and penalties. It essentially amounts to extortion.
It is outrageous that the United States, which prides itself as being the home of “freedom, truth and justice”, would try to exert control over people around the world in this way. No other country, save for Eritrea, acts in such a manner and no other country would be allowed to act this way were it not for the economic clout that the US wields. It is very disappointing that Canada would plan to comply with this American aggression, breaking its own privacy laws in the process (having the CRA be an intermediary in the transfer of confidential account information still amounts to a loss of privacy). It is also a violation of Canada’s Charter of Rights and Freedoms, whereby Canadian citizens of US origin are going to be discriminated against on the basis of national origin.
It is sad that the current Conservative government is planning to betray many loyal Canadians. Compliance with FATCA will result in a weakening of Canada, as Canadian capital will be extracted from Canada and deposited in the US Treasury. The United States’ threat of a 30% withholding penalty on US source income should be tested on the basis of principle in upholding Canadian sovereignty.
I urge Canada to reconsider this planned complicity with the US and either reject the agreement or ensure that it is amended to only apply to residents of the United States with Canadian financial accounts. It is hypocritical for Canada and the United States to claim that this is a reciprocal agreement, as Canada does not practise citizenship-based taxation and the United States is not agreeing to provide financial account information on US residents.
Thank you for your attention to this matter.
Just a small comment: – are the politicians in Canada not motiviated the same as US politicians? All about reelection? If so – does this make a significant impact on their constituency? I am not a Canadian so I have no idea, but in my experience politicians only fight self-serving battles. Where they see votes they act – where they don’t they stay silent. In know that there must be many accidental Americans in Canada by virtue of proximity, but does it make a difference anywhere? Does any Canadian politician’s electorate hold a significant number of people affected by FACTA? If not – are there any Canadian politicians willing to take on a minority cause?
@p33t
Some Canadian politicians are US Persons themselves like Elizabeth May and Bruce Hyer. Other have large numbers of US Persons as constituents such as May again, Jean Crowder, and a bunch of others in BC and New Brunswick especially. I have been told by others there is also a substantial number of US Persons in Toronto who are unreported in the census.
This particular electoral riding has a LOT of US Persons. Its is directly adjacent to the San Juan Islands of Washington State if you have ever seen the movie Another Stakeout with Richard Dreyfus.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saanich%E2%80%94Gulf_Islands
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Another_Stakeout
Our registered savings accounts will never be safe until they are included in the tax treaty between the two countries. Until then, they can, and should be considered future revenue for the US government. Without a permanent fix, the IGA is just window dressing for the benefit of the banks and the IRS.
@Em
Everyone should enjoy the benefits of Viagra!
They are saying… they won’t collect for the US.. but once the US has all our info… what will stop them to just raid what we own.. with electronic banking.. its not that hard… then discuss… How will our gov’t be able to stop them… Sir.. sir… we really don’t appreciate u doing this… umm… umm.. we want it back… a half hearted attempt…
Since US/Canada will be sharing border crossing info… what other country will they share that info with & who knows what info will be available to them… Even though Canada says they won’t collect… how do I know I am not in a database flagged… hold until all taxes/penalities are paid to the US… if crossing any customs with an agreement with the US…
Yes I am paranoid… I admit it… I am not trying to scare anyone.. I am just saying… once the foot is in the door this easy… what can be done to stop them if they just change & want more… I don’t trust either gov’ts… both lie to suit themselves…
@Bubblebustin
Your taxi cab driver story was recollected when I read this. I found this on facebook;s https://www.facebook.com/aaro.org I commented \ I wrote:
Darlene Hall Read what the american law FATCA will do to you. Choose carefully. Read isaacbrocksociety.com
It was for http://www.fvap.gov/citizen-voter/reside
Never Resided in the U.S.?
In some States, U.S. citizens, 18 years or older, who were born abroad but have never resided in the United States, are eligible to vote absentee. The following States allow these citizens to vote absentee:
Otherwise known as lying by omission: http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2012/07/23/shadow-raider-is-rewriting-the-united-state-internal-revenue-code/comment-page-19/#comment-1381861
For god’s sake, it’s a trap: don’t do it!
bubblebustin,
One person at a time — you gave the cab driver a great education, one-on-one advice he could not better get elsewhere — especially as it wouldn’t even occur him to be looking for it.
Yes, Calgary. You’d think it would be a hot topic within the US-Eritrean community. As I’ve said before, we have one thing to our advantage – bad news travels fast.
I don’t know where to stick this…. but what I read in this article is that the USA is doing a “FATCA” extortion threat to NATO nations…Notice the word “Secret”.
“bama’s US Trade Representative, who has been negotiating secret “trade agreements” in Europe and Asia that give US corporations immunity to the laws of all countries that sign the agreements, has threatened WTO penalties if Europe’s communications network excludes the US companies that serve as spies for NSA. Washington in all its arrogance has told its most necessary allies that if you don’t let us spy on you, we will use WTO to penalize you.
So there you have it. The rest of the world now has the best possible reason to exit the WTO and to avoid the Trans-Pacific and Trans-Atlantic “trade agreements.” The agreements are not about trade. The purpose of these “trade agreements” is to establish the hegemony of Washington and US corporations over other countries. ”
http://www.opednews.com/articles/Obama-Issues-Threats-To-Ru-by-Paul-Craig-Roberts-NATO_Obama-Effect_Russia_Threats-140407-729.html
@northernstar:
“So there you have it. The rest of the world now has the best possible reason to exit the WTO and to avoid the Trans-Pacific and Trans-Atlantic “trade agreements.” The agreements are not about trade. The purpose of these “trade agreements” is to establish the hegemony of Washington and US corporations over other countries. ”
And NOW the REST of the Story! Ala Paul Harvey.
Thanks, northernstar.
“I wish anyone luck in reaching our PHONY politicians.”
Exactly. Not going to happen IMO. Hate to bring up the SS comparison but I think all the Nazi regime would offer Jews is whether they wanted to die by starvation or gas.
I don’t know why many of us even bother. They will never listen anyways. I’d like to do a poll here and invite lurkers to vote.
How many of you think appealing to government will have any effect and how many don’t.
Anybody interested in modern art?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1epve6Az0Ho
Hey Mr Arvay. Where art thou brother?
Interesting discussion on CBC radio,The Current this morning:
“Has transparency in politics gone too far or do we need more accountability from politicians”
http://www.cbc.ca/thecurrent/episode/2014/04/07/has-transparency-in-politics-gone-too-far-or-do-we-need-more-accountability-from-politicians/
How’s THIS for accountability?
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2014/04/06/obama-issues-threats-russia-nato-paul-craig-roberts/
I’m posting this in its entirety so people here will settle down and stop worrying. Read it and you will understand the paper Tiger we face. The USA is self destructing before our very eyes, nothing to be afraid of and not a country that anyone takes seriously anymore so……why should we? FATCA will die along with the rest of the neo NAZI legislation. We can now safely say that the overwhelming majority of the worlds population hates the USA and is ready to take action. We can also safely say that many world leaders that are appeasing the NAZIs have lost their minds or their very will to live as free people. and are enslaving their people into the Prison Planet of the New World Order
——————————–
Obama Issues Threats To Russia And NATO — Paul Craig Roberts
April 6, 2014 | Categories: Articles & Columns | Tags: European independence, NATO, NSA, Russia, war, | Print This Article Print This Article
Obama Issues Threats To Russia And NATO
Paul Craig Roberts
The Obama regime has issued simultaneous threats to the enemy it is making out of Russia and to its European NATO allies on which Washington is relying to support sanctions on Russia. This cannot end well.
As even Americans living in a controlled media environment are aware, Europeans, South Americans, and Chinese are infuriated that the National Stasi Agency is spying on their communications. NSA’s affront to legality, the US Constitution, and international diplomatic norms is unprecedented. Yet, the spying continues, while Congress sits sucking its thumb and betraying its oath to defend the Constitution of the United States.
In Washington mumbo-jumbo from the executive branch about “national security” suffices to negate statutory law and Constitutional requirements. Western Europe, seeing that the White House, Congress and the Federal Courts are impotent and unable to rein-in the Stasi Police State, has decided to create a European communication system that excludes US companies in order to protect the privacy of European citizens and government communications from the Washington Stasi.
The Obama regime, desperate that no individual and no country escape its spy net, denounced Western Europe’s intention to protect the privacy of its communications as “a violation of trade laws.”
Obama’s US Trade Representative, who has been negotiating secret “trade agreements” in Europe and Asia that give US corporations immunity to the laws of all countries that sign the agreements, has threatened WTO penalties if Europe’s communications network excludes the US companies that serve as spies for NSA. Washington in all its arrogance has told its most necessary allies that if you don’t let us spy on you, we will use WTO to penalize you.
So there you have it. The rest of the world now has the best possible reason to exit the WTO and to avoid the Trans-Pacific and Trans-Atlantic “trade agreements.” The agreements are not about trade. The purpose of these “trade agreements” is to establish the hegemony of Washington and US corporations over other countries.
In an arrogant demonstration of Washington’s power over Europe, the US Trade Representative warned Washington’s NATO allies: “US Trade Representative will be carefully monitoring the development of any such proposals” to create a separate European communication network. http://rt.com/news/us-europe-nsa-snowden-549/
Washington is relying on the Chancellor of Germany, the President of France, and the Prime Minister of the UK to place service to Washington above their countries’ communications privacy.
It has dawned on the Russian government that being a part of the American dollar system means that Russia is open to being looted by Western banks and corporations or by individuals financed by them, that the ruble is vulnerable to being driven down by speculators in the foreign exchange market and by capital outflows, and that dependence on the American international payments system exposes Russia to arbitrary sanctions imposed by the “exceptional and indispensable country.”
Why it took the Russian government so long to realize that the dollar payments system puts countries under Washington’s thumb is puzzling. Perhaps the answer is the success of US Cold War propaganda. Cold war propaganda portrayed America as the shining light, the great observer of human rights, opponent of torture, upholder of liberty, defender of the downtrodden, lover of peace, and benefactor of the world. This image survived even as the US government prevented the rise of any representative governments in Latin America and while Washington has bombed half a dozen countries into rubble.
Russians emerging from communism naturally aligned with the propaganda image of “American freedom.” That the US and Europe were also corrupt and also had blood on their hands was overlooked. During the years of anti-Soviet propaganda, Washington was murdering European women and children and blaming communists. The truth came out when President of Italy Francesco Cossiga publicly revealed Operation Gladio, a false flag terrorist scheme run by the CIA and Italian Intelligence during the 1960s, 1970s, and 1980s that targeted European women and children with bombs in order to blame the communists and thereby prevent European communist parties from making electoral gains. This is one of the most well-known false flag events in history, having resulted in extraordinary confessions by Italian intelligence.
Now that the Russian government understands that Russia must depart the dollar system in order to protect Russian sovereignty, President Putin has entered into barter/ruble oil deals with China and Iran. However, Washington objects to Russia abandoning the dollar international payment system. Zero Hedge, a more reliable news source than the US print and TV media, reports that Washington has conveyed to both Russia and Iran that a non-dollar oil deal would trigger US sanctions. http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2014-04-04/us-threatens-russia-sanctions-over-petrodollar-busting-deal
Washington’s objection to the Russian/Iranian deal made it clear to all governments that Washington uses the dollar-based international payments system as a means of control. Why should countries accept an international payments system that infringes their sovereignty? What would happen if instead of passively accepting the dollar as the means of international payment, countries simply left the dollar system? The value of the dollar would fall and so would Washington’s power. Without the power that the dollar’s role as world reserve currency gives the US to pay its bills by printing money, the US could not maintain its aggressive military posture or its payoffs to foreign governments to do its bidding.
Washington would be just another failed empire, whose population can barely make ends meet, while the One Percent who comprise the mega-rich compete with 200-foot yachts and $750,000 fountain pins. The aristocracy and the serfs. That is what America has already become. A throwback to the feudal era.
It is only a matter of time before it is universally recognized that the US is a failed state. Let’s pray this recognition occurs before the arrogant inhabitants of Washington blow up the world in pursuit of hegemony over others.
Washington’s provocative military moves against Russia are reckless and dangerous. The buildup of NATO air, ground, and naval forces on Russia’s borders in violation of the 1997 NATO-Russian treaty and the Montreux Convention naturally strike the Russian government as suspicious, especially as the buildups are justified on the basis of lies that Russia is about to invade Poland, the Baltic States, and Moldova in addition to Ukraine.
These lies are transparent. The Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov has asked NATO for an explanation, stating: “We are not only expecting answers, but answers that will be based fully on respect for the rules we agreed on.” http://rt.com/news/lavrov-ukraine-nato-convention-069/
Anders Fogh Rasmussen, Washington’s puppet installed as NATO figurehead who is no more in charge of NATO than I am, responded in a way guaranteed to raise Russian anxieties. Rasmussen dismissed the Russian Foreign Minister’s request for explanation as “propaganda and disinformation.”
Clearly, what we are experiencing are rising tensions caused by Washington and NATO. These tensions are in addition to the tensions arising from Washington’s coup in Ukraine. These reckless and dangerous actions have destroyed the Russian government’s trust in the West and are moving the world toward war.
Little did the protesters in Kiev, called into the streets by Washington’s NGOs, realize that their foolishness was setting the world on a path to armageddon.
In most cases, Europe is fully willing to drink the US koolaid. As far as FATCA goes, they want it more than US wants it. And despite all of the obviousness of the reciprocity myth,, they want to believe that they are getting something that they are desperate for—-to identify their US persons to USA so that the USA will tell them about their resdident US persons’ IRA’s and Fidelity accounts. In the case of many countries in Europe, they are looking for a one-to-one exchange of info for the identified individuals.