Until now, I’ve been cheeky and sarcastic in my tone. Now I just want to say a few honest words about what has happened, and the history leading up to it.
To the great sadness of many who participated at the Expat Forum, the Tax Forum was closed two days ago. The Tax Forum is now open again, but with such draconian rules as to make it impossible to have any meaningful conversation. Apparently, some of the important threads have also gone the way of the dodo bird. I saw this coming over a month ago.
I started to participate at the Expat Forum in November–partly because I saw so many people struggling with issues on which I had done some fairly interesting research. In my first post on the subject, 25 February 2010, I announced my intention to relinquish my United States citizenship, and I’d had already written my first article, with Monty Pelerin, at the American Thinker. So I hoped that the other participants at the Expat Forum, who had come lately to the subject, would benefit from my participation.
Then, around the beginning of December a few things happened at the Expat Forum that alarmed me. First, all the threads related to US tax, FBAR, FATCA, and renunciation of US citizenship were shunted to its own sub-forum, taking it off the main page of the Canadian Expat Forum. Secondly, the Expat Forum completely erased two threads: (1) Nobledreamer started a thread, critizing American exceptionalism; (2) the second (if memory serves) criticized a new law which would endow the President of the United States with the power to arrest terrorist suspects, even US citizens, and to suspend their habeas corpus rights. When I saw these actions by the moderators, I concluded that the Expat Forum was an unworthy venue for our discussion. We were bringing a lot of traffic to the Expat Forum, and traffic means money in the internet world, when you run a commercial site like the Expat Forum. But they were determining the limits of the conversation.
That is when I began to contact other members about creating this website, so that we would have a safe place to carry on the conversation. On December 12, we launched the Isaac Brock Society website.
Now let’s be clear. The issue isn’t one of some rule breakers, as Bob Sheth, the Expat Forum owner, has announced. It is about censorship. If ignorant moderators, who know far less about our concerns than we do, have the right to come into the threads of our conversation, insult us and our concerns as “hysteria”, and they also have the right to determine that our conversation is “off topic” and eliminate or marginalize our threads, then the Expat Forum is obviously not a safe place to hold any conversation (even about Nanaimo cookies), much less one as important as ours. As a writer, I will not tolerate the arbitrary editing or elimination of my posts by a moderator or a forum owner. Moreover, I will not place myself in voluntary submission to anyone who knows so little about my problems and/or who disagrees with me on political or commercial grounds.
I believe that the Expat Forum has made a tactical error. Perhaps it would lose certain sponsors offended by our conversation, but then it could have gained others, e.g., lawyers and tax accountants or alternative vacation resorts outside the United States, who would have been able to exploit the conversation with content-related advertising. Instead, it has damaged its own business reputation and has lost the trust of many people; it did this by creating an internet space for an open conversation but then arbitrarily censoring it. Such an action is repugnant to all free people everywhere.
There are plenty of venues on the internet where this conversation can take place. This site, the Isaac Brock Society, is one. But the Expat Forum can no longer be the place for any conversation whatsoever, not even Nanaimo cookie recipes. It is time to move on and forget about any grievances that we have with the Expat Forum.
What can we learn from this? Someone has suggested we move the Isaac Brock Society off of our WordPress host and onto a server outside the United States. Frankly, we have no idea why the owner, Bob Sheth, has done what he has done: is it complaints from the United States government, from expats loyal to Obama, or from commercial interests with ties to the US Federal Government? The real reason can’t be my telling Expat Forum Moderator jokes,–can it? Since they have not told us the real reason, I think we need to be careful about ever trusting a third party host again.
This thread is now open for comments.
Also, there is definitely a ban on political discussion related to the US in that forum: I started a thread about the dangers of the NDAA which disappeared and also criticised the US ratings agencies in another post that I can no longer locate. Nothing to do with US taxes or renouncing citizenship.
@DonP Yes, it was one of your new threads with political content (I couldn’t remember exact details) that you created in late November or early December that I was referring to in the main post above.
@DonPomodoro: Noticed that. Sent Lovecheese a note.
@416 : Lovecheese’s thread on renunciation is now gone.
New Joke:
How many Expat Forum Moderators does it take to censor a post? Just one, but she has to find it first.
The Expat Forum reminds me of the Ministry of Magic, and Bevdeforges is Dolores Umbridge. J. K. Rowling understands human nature–I didn’t think something this ridiculous was possible.
I have a list of threads that somehow have remained and am keeping track…..some even have the “R” word! Some on the general forum, before we became the exit tax section…..
In any private message I use “R” word for you no what. Also refer people to this site by advocating they seek Canada’s hero of 1812 for assistance
I’ll be brutally blunt and honest. I think I will be taking my leave of the Expat forum. They’re all advocates of the “IRS will be lenient”. when what ACA has seen has been nothing of the sort. I think I will be pulling my wife (the US expat in the family) off that forum and mentioning the Isaac Brock Society to her as well. I don’t want my family’s finances going to hell in a handbasket. After getting censured for commenting on the family situation and why we need to watch where we step, I ,like Petros here, no longer feel that it’s a safe place for frank and unbiased discussion of the situation at hand.
Furthermore, my question is that Bevdeforges, a US national living in France is trying to counsel Canadian expats on US taxes and becoming compliant. What may work for her in France (where there’s an ocean between her and the United States may not work for us who have just an invisible border at the 49th paraellel. For those of us spouses of US citizens, you kind of have to wonder if they really take our concerns seriously. Or are we to go along our merry way like rats into a trap?
As an interesting aside I found several obscure bloggers in the US that were knowledgable of and favorible to FATCA. I posted several responses outlining all of the issues raised here and await with great anticipation whether my posts are responded to, deleted, etc. I will let everyone know what I hear back.
@the_Animal Do you mean you were censored? “Censured”, well that seems stronger and weaker at the same time, if you know what I mean. What exactly did you write that got censored? Tell you what, you can say it here if you like.
No one on the Expat Forum is now allowed to contradict Bevdeforges, and so she is pretty much the Queen bee over there now. “Oh, ask bevdeforges, she knows everything”. But she has written that renunciation of citizenship is off limits–I have nothing to say to her except Expat Forum Moderator jokes.
Free discussion is permitted here and at the Isaac Brock Forum. Indeed, I say that if you wanted to use the forum to do a coup against this site to take traffic away from us, you would be welcome. But that is a not allowed at the Expat Forum. Once they realized that Isaac Brock could take away their traffic, they kiboshed all the links to this site (even in private messages!). We get no more hits from them.
OK, this gets weirder. There’s a healthy thread at the moment, with Bev participating, on – form 8854 and tax issues related to renunciation. I got nothin’.
http://www.expatforum.com/expats/expat-tax/100737-us-taxes-form8854.html
@broken: “I got nothin'” — What do you mean?
= I have no further idea
Bevdeforges should be very careful counselling Americans that it is illegal to renounce and relinquish because that is completely FALSE. Moreover, imagine the consequences for her and the site if someone heed her advice suffers a huge financial loss to her advice.
Once again, ExpatForum thread CLOSED.
@calgary411, yeah somebody asked if it was now no longer a banned subject. That seems to have kiboshed the discussion; now this guy’s comment has been removed.
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This is a great blog. Having just been banned from the Expat Forum I feel right at home (lol). I found it interesting that they monitor (spy on) the private messages for that site. I only joined up because i though it was about helping people, asking questions, getting support. I found some of the moderators and a couple of the members to be bullies and rude. We also found that advice that is given isn’t always correct. The super moderator who threatened to sanction me because I pointed out that one of the moderators was condescending and rude, stated that they DO NOT GIVE IMMIGRATION ADVICE. Well, for a forum that doesn’t give immigration advice, they sure as heck do and it is a very My Way or The Highway attitude.
When I pointed out that one of the mods was condescending, that naturally led to others posting to me in protest. When I replied back to them giving examples and it was politely done, I was threatened to be sanctioned right on the actual thread. Of course I responded back with another polite question asking if the members who had responded to me were going to be treated the same way. My hand was slapped and my posts removed. I was also “sanctioned” and received penalty points. (OH MY).
I was offended to be treated like a five year old on a public forum so I sent a private (not so polite and highly colorful) message to the super moderator.
But because I had befriended a couple of people I tried to sneak back and give them an update on my status but apparently the private messaging is monitored (spied on) and I was promptly banned forever.
Oh wow, sorry, I am still laughing. They take themselves way too seriously on that forum. The moderator I was having an issue with was given the pleasure of banning me (lol) as a reward, I am sure, for enduring my brutal attack. Snarky Cow that she is.
I am a free lance writer in my spare time (of which I have a lot of these days) and I am going to have a field day with this one.
I highly suggest anyone looking for expat advice on any issue to seek out friendlier waters. If you do not punctuate correctly on the Expat Forum you will get your hand slapped and perhaps even sanctioned. Heaven help you if you cannot spell or English is not your first language because you are then tagged as writing nonsensical garbage that gives the moderators and their member worshipers a headache. And as for bringing up taboo subjects, such as what is listed here, yes, this would make the mods at Expat Forum go into instant BANISH THEM ALL mode.
Hunger Games, anyone?
Cheers Banished Annie
…And the beat goes on. Welcome here, Annie, from one other who was banished — the reason there is an IsaacBrockSociety.ca.
Thank you Calgary411. Amazing, a door closes and one opens (lol). I am fascinated with this site and haven’t stopped reading since I got here.
Interesting–I didn’t know the history of this website.
I think there is clearly some censorship going on with regard to ‘mainstream’ websites that address these issues. As I noted once before, I fairly recently tried to sign up for Canadian Money Forum:
http://www.canadianmoneyforum.com/
In my request to the moderators there to activate my account, I quite innocently said that I was there to talk about FATCA. This was a quite innocent request and I did not expect my desire to talk about FATCA, by itself, would be controversial–as there was already a discussion going on there about FATCA and conversation about FATCA seemed quite welcome at that site.
However, it has been about six weeks and my membership was never activated–I sent a follow up request but there was never any reply. People joining the site much more recently have been allowed to post (about topics other than FATCA).
This topic seems to scare people.
Wow. Don’t think I’ve read the history regarding the Expat Forum before. I found it about the time I found Maple Sandbox, so I guess I was clueless. I do go back, on occasion, and look to see what ole’ BBCWatcher is up to. And I do recognize a few from there here on occasion. I’m a wee bit of a rebel over there, so I’m a better fit here. 😀
@Dash1729, I have posted on FATCA at Money Topics, with no problem. Not sure why your membership hasn’t been approved. I slip in references to IBS in the hopes of bringing awareness of this website.
Had no idea of the history either. Found IBS very soon after my OMG moment. Very thankful the site was up and running at that time! IBS has been wonderful as a resource and as a support. Can’t imagine where I would be in all this mess without all of you!
If I haven’t said it before – thank you all so much!!
@Anne
It may give you great pleasure to know that Brock was formed directly from a group banned, or censored at Expat Forum.
We’ve been there too! Welcome, LOL!
@Tricia
Thank you so much. I think this was a great idea. There are such important things to discuss and information that needs to be shared. I think the Expat Forum is a very controlled environment where everything goes merrily along if everyone behaves themselves and does what they are told. I am sorry, I am too much of a Q & A kind of gal. I want to learn. I want to have an educated view on things. When I ask a question I don’t expect the answer to be “Because I told you so.” I also do not care to be “spied” upon. I found that to be completely unacceptable. You have a certain expectation of privacy when you send a “Private Message” to someone. So I was completely shocked to find that the mods are “watching” – are they Big Brother or something? Seriously? Again, it is a power trip kind of mentality for sure.
I am relocating to the UK from the US and I need to know what I am getting myself into. This group has a lot of what I am looking for and I thank you for your kindness here and the chance to learn.
Cheers Annie