Renunciation Questions Thread
Ask your questions about Renunciation here.
This thread will be focused closely on renunciation questions and answers. If the conversation starts to ramble, those comments will be moved to another thread.
Sub-topics (more will be added as they occur):
Farrell v. Tillerson. Plaintiff is contesting Bern Embassy’s rejection of his CLN application due to his not having appeared in person at the embassy and his having been issued a passport after the relinquishing act.
Renunciation Spin-Off Conversations. Conversations that spin off from questions asked on the main Renunciation Questions thread are moved to this one.
Previous Renunciation Threads:
Renunciation and Relinquishment of United States Citizenship: Discussion thread (Ask your questions)
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@Confused
Or you just ask to renounce without filling out the form, which should not be required for straight-up renunciation.
If you’re planning to renounce rather than relinquish, the 4079 is not required. Some embassies ask for it anyway.
You could go back to the Embassy to let them know that you plan to renounce, that you’re not trying to claim a relinquishing act, and therefore you won’t be completing the form.
I am planning to renounce. From the questions on the form it appears that I would not be eligible to relinquish anyway as I lacked intent. I want to renounce. I would not like to refuse to fill in the form but I will explain I am confused by it.
Excuse me, I had meant to thank all who responded for their replies.
I spent several hours last night googling/reading information and felt I had made some progress.
This morning, back on the computer where I came across a comment by a commercial service saying I could not use the FEIE on my final tax return. Which has presented me with something else to research. I have limited my reading in the past as I got to the point where it was not helpful, especially as I have read conflicting advice, as well as advice which is incorrect, at various places on the internet.
I will be relieved when I have found my way through these issues and renounced.
A lot depends on when you performed the potentially relinquishing act. If it was before June 2004, then it would be greatly to your advantage to claim that it was your intention to give up your us citizenship. If it can be established that you relinquished before then, you would have NO tax filing obligations.
If that is not the case, many here would argue that it Is silly to file final tax returns anyway.. Every situation is different.
As others on this site already know, I’ve never filed a US tax return in my life, and I certainly shan’t be now that I’ve renounced. But my entire financial life is in the UK. If someone has US assets or income, they might want to take a different path.
Does anyone have any advice in terms of whether it’s a good idea to provide a statement or not? If it is advisable, would it be detrimental to use my disagreement with the IRS’s requirement for citizens abroad to file yearly as a reason for wanting to renounce? Or, should I just use the statement as an opportunity to acknowledge the ramifications and to solidify my intent?
@ DJ,
People generally do not provide a statement. I recommend not doing so as in not writing one, you don’t have to worry about writing anything “wrong “or something that could be taken the wrong way.
Re: “Or, should I just use the statement as an opportunity to acknowledge the ramifications and to solidify my intent?”
There’s need to acknowledge the ramifications in a statement, as you’ll do that in the DS-4081 (Statement of understanding of consequences), nor a need to solidify your intent as “I have the intention of relinquishing my United States nationality is also in the DS-4081.
Best to not include a statement. Keep it simple
@DJ
I wouldn’t mention anything in connection with taxes on a statement.
I did provide a written statement which mentioned the difficulty in keeping a simple bank account ( which was the situation in Switzerland at the time). The Consul said it was not necessary but I included it anyway. You really don’t need to as they know why we are all leaving the plantation.
Thanks for the information. I’ll keep it simple as suggested.
Have any of you had any trouble with banks after providing your CLN (perhaps in terms of ignorant employees)? Just curious how smooth everything has been for you guys after all…
I only had to supply my CLN to the investment company which holds my Unit Trust ISA (my own bank, I believe, has no idea that I was a US citizen). They confirmed in writing that they had amended their records to show that I was no longer a US citizen. At any rate, ISAs are not reported under FATCA, so it probably didn’t worry them very much.
I received my CLN today, one month after my appointment. Thank you again to everyone who gave me such helpful advice and support.
@Rose pleased to hear it.
I scanned mine and have a copy on my iPhone in case I need to show it when entering the USA.
@ Rose,
Glad to hear, especially that it’s arrived within a month. Congratulations on getting it all wrapped up
Thanks both! Good idea about scanning onto my phone. I’m not sure if I should tell my bank, or wait for them to approach me. My only contact from them was a pop up on my online banking which asked me to confirm I was born in US. I suppose it would be best to just tell them.
My main bank never asked me, but I think it’s because I’ve banked with them since 1986 and they simply didn’t know I was born in the USA. As for the company which holds my unit trust ISA, I sent them a copy of the CLN and they confirmed in writing that they’d removed the US marker from my account. I know that ISAs are not reported under FATCA, at the moment, but I wanted the marker removed in case that changed in the future.
By the way, when I entered the US in October last year, the border guard waved away my offer to show him my CLN, even as the London Embassy official did when I had my interview for my US visa. I guess just the fact that you are willing to show it to them is enough.
Thank you BirdPerson. I’ve had my account 42 years, and they do know I was born in US, so probably best to just clear the slate! It’s such a relief to get it over with.
I’m pleased to say I got my cln today (i was the one asking all the questions!).
I experienced a few differences at the place I renounced:
1.The ds 4079 wasn’t destroyed at my appointment
2.I was brought into an office at the consulate to sign ds 4079, statement of consequences and the CLN.
3 The consulate provided the self addressed tracked envelope and posted it out to me
It was very informal and friendly service
Going for a long nap and having a large glass of wine after all the stress.
Congrats, I’m glad it’s all done for you!