FATCA Discussion Thread (Ask your questions) Part Two
Please ask your questions here about FATCA.
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I have been working in Canada all my adult life (never worked in the U.S.) and so there would be plenty to tax on, but I have paid all my taxes to the CRA (I work for a public sector institution so I couldn’t avoid paying every dime I owe them even if I wanted to). I just never occurred to me that I would have to pay taxes in a foreign country, never crossed my mind, why should it have? Nobody ever told me.
Well, the media has to get it out eventually….I think its a good thing, people need to know if its going to become a political issue.
@Rob
That is one way of looking at it.
But I can think of another one…..Brock and Maple Sandbox have been very very loud with emails to Media and also with flyers, brochures and protests. It is snowballing. Snowballs can turn into avalanches.
Friends and family are starting to see the light and word of mouth is now happening and non American persons are starting to call their MPs and the media
Posters are all over. Media is getting their FATCA packages. Senior clubs are being told about this, and Snowbirds…Many people unawares are now finding out.. We shall see.
Now @Me and @ Nick…. Please tell your family and friends.. If you want FATCA FACT sheets and brochures look at the side bar on right side near the top under Information. You can post and distribute them.
I give you both a big welcome hug to our family where you will find support and help.. It is stressful and even horrifying but you will be able to cope more being in our family. We are all in this boat together.
@Rob
Now you’re thinking like a Brocker!
I don’t think if what you said was true, we’d be cast in as good of a light. Besides that, the Canadian government wouldn’t disseminate information that risks causing a bank run. And have you read all the anti-Harper comments about this?
I guess it’s kind of late for the feds to control FATCA’s introduction to Canada now, and the opportunity to spin it as something good for the country. Now all they can do is act defensively, if they react at all.
@bubblebustin
At least we gave it a good fight…and maybe lessened the injuries.
FATCA is EU-approved ethnic cleansing
http://bit.ly/1alNMoh
Sweden & EU to update their Constitutions Accordingly
@ Me….slow down, relax, and breathe. We know, we’ve been where you are now.
One thing you need to know is the Finance Minister Jim Flaherty has stated, on the record, that CRA will NOT collect on IRS-imposed penalties and tax assessed while you were a Canadian citizen.
@badger
Thanks for the link to the CTV story. I had heard that it was also covered there, but had NOT seen the story. We need to keep these TV stories headlined as separate posts, I think.
@Rob, I think very simply that this is a big story and that CBC has finally figured it out. I figured it out over two years ago when I decided to become a Canadian citizen and renounce my US citizenship (in February 2010).
Also, CBC and the Tory government are at odds. CBC leans left and they don’t normally like the Tories. Perhaps they have figured out that this could bring down the Tory government? Well, giving away the keys to the Ottawa to the IRS should really piss off the average Canadian. Perhaps the CBC has figured this out.
My big fear is that the bank will attempt to freeze the account of a recalcitrant dual, or even attempt to take money out of it. I went on to the TD bank website and asked whether they would have the authority to do either of those things, and rather than answer no we certainly will not or are not permitted to do that, they said they could not answer my question ” at this time” !
@Rob
TD bank is more American than Cdn…They have more branches in the USA than Canada.
Do you have another bank you can transfer funds to?
I don`t bank with the TD. That is why I asked them the question. It was just hypothetical , and their lack of response frightened me. I am pretty sure they attempted to take money from a client in the 1980`s and were challenged, and subsequently lost, in court. ( Vandemark vs the TD Bank?)
@rob
This is what the Canadian Bankers Association has to say about that:
If you choose not to provide this additional documentation upon request, at a minimum, your financial institution may be required to withhold a tax of 30% on U.S. source payments1that you receive and send this money to the IRS.
http://www.cba.ca/en/consumer-information/40-banking-basics/597-us-foreign-account-tax-compliance-act-fatca-information-for-clients
FATCA: Hunting for indicia of US personhood
FATCA: Hunting for indicia of US personhood
I’ve heard bad things about so-called amnesty programs, but has anyone had any experience with the “streamlined” process below?
Seems like it would apply to many Canadian citizen “U.S. persons” like me who didn’t have a clue about about filing obligations or FBARs, have worked in Canada, paid all their taxes to the CRA and have no U.S. investments or income. I would resent even having to do this, as I consider myself a Canadian living in my own country, but it sounds like doing this (and then renouncing citizenship) would be a way of dealing with possible future problems. I’d like to hear other peoples’ experiences with this.
http://www.irs.gov/uac/Instructions-for-New-Streamlined-Filing-Compliance-Procedures-for-Non-Resident-Non-Filer-US-Taxpayers
Dear IRS,
l
Please read Nick’s comment above.
Most Canadians cursed with a US birthplace who are just coming to the life altering realization that they are US taxpayers, and are panic stricken to the point of entering the ‘Streamlined program’ will do so with the intent of immediately renouncing their unwanted US citizenship after getting the thumbs up from the IRS that their submissions are approved.
The only people who will make any money off of all this wasted energy, are the compliance lawyers and accountants. Remember that the streamlined program guarantees no penalties for those that are accepted as ‘low risk’, and it is doubtful that anyone who has a remote inkling that they might not be ‘low risk’ will even enter the Streamlined Program. Also, to enter the stream-lined program, a Canadian with a red, white, and blue stamp, should owe little taxes (I believe the recommended limit of taxes owed is $1500 or thereabouts per year for each of the past 5 years, though I hear this is not a cut and dried rule).
Thus IRS will not get much if any money from people like Nick. So, I have to ask, since people like Nick will not likely continue to be a US taxpayer after successfully making it through the Streamlined Program, and it will cost money for the IRS to process the pages and pages of forms sent for back filing 5 years of tax returns and 6 years of FBARS – what is the point?
Sincerely,
A Canadian living in Canada born on the US plantation who prefers not to contribute to the compliance industry
P.S. Did you do this just to appease the Canadian government? Are you really after the dumb asses like me, who refuse to bend over?
@nick,
I didn’t see that anybody mentioned this…
Please explain your “public sector” employment. If that means some level of government and you started before 1995 (or maybe even 2004), then we’ve just found your get out of hell free card.
Also, did you mention sone ciyizen oath? Did you naturalize in Canada? When and at what age?
And, when was the last time you exercized some US citizenship privelege?
I would still like to know how the IRS will database those of us they have CLNs for, that don’t have SSNs or ITINs. Since we’re all just numbers…
@WhiteKat You’re right, the IRS won’t get much money from me because I have a middle-class salary, a couple of back accounts under 50,000 and have been paying taxes to Canada since I started working. The only person who will make money is the guy I’ll have to pay to deal with this. Still, I just want this to go away so that my Canadian family never again have to worry about the threat of having our assests seized by a foreign state. I don’t trust Harpo and Flaherty to protect me either so I’m reluctant to wait and see what happens. So, again, I would really appreciate if anyone could share direct or secondary experience with the streamlined process (either alone or followed by renunciation). Is this a good strategy to make this go away?
@WhiteKat
LOL!
@ WhoAmI I worked for the government of New Brunswick, but only for a couple of years (2001-2003) and a short (few month contract) for Ottawa in 2000. I did take an oath (when I was 18) even though my mother is Canadian-born citizen. There seemed to be some confusion at the time about whether I was Canadian at birth, but they suggested I go through the ceremony. Have been in Canada ever since (22 years).
@Nick
I don’t know of anyone in Streamlined, but my lawyer said that of his 70 or so OVDI participants (I am one), about 1/4 have been moved to Streamlined by the IRS themselves. If you go to the NTA’s report to Congress, it will give you an idea of how well these amnesty programs are working.
http://www.taxpayeradvocate.irs.gov/userfiles/file/2013FullReport/OFFSHORE-VOLUNTARY-DISCLOSURE-The-IRS-Offshore-Voluntary-Disclosure-Program-Disproportionately-Burdens-Those-Who-Make-Honest-Mistakes.pdf
If you got your Canadian citizenship by naturalizing 22 years ago, then that’s your ticket. You can claim that you did that with the intention of giving uo your US citizenship and get a back-dated CLN. You don’t pay anything, and you don’t file any taxes or other forms. Have you exercised any US citizenship rights since then?
@Nick, if you took an oath at the age of 18 you have good case for having relinquished your US citizenship. Congratulations, you are probably not a US citizen (unless you want to be). Just go to a Consulate and inform them: See http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2011/12/12/relinquish-dont-renounce-if-you-can/ Also you don’t have to file anything because you haven’t been a citizen for years. You will get a back dated CLN to the year you pledged allegience to the Queen of Canada.