Robert Woods at Forbes, May 3rd: Record Numbers Renounce U.S. Citizenship—And Many Aren’t Counted
Related: Time for #Americansabroad forced to renounce citizenship to pursue legal remedies in US courts
The Canada Challenge is discussed:
Can you envision the possible fallout to the US if the constitutional challenge being launched in Canada has a positive outcome. It is a global world now, there are other places to invest. Yes, the US has a massive economy and everyone wants to invest there. But what if these foreign governments collectively wake up, maybe have the courage to follow Canada in the event of a win. (The US must remember Canada has water, abundant natural resources and electricity) Maybe China will be the first to say “no thanks” and others follow. The moral arc of the universe bends at the elbow of justice (MLK), FATCA-IGAs and CBT are simply immoral.
· Author, Robert W. Wood, Contributor
I agree that watching the litigation in Canada (has it been filed yet?) will be quite interesting. I agree that if it comes out against FATCA, the ramifications could be large. We’ll see.
The challenge has been vetted and deemed viable by constitutional lawyers, the team to launch the challenge is in place, the donations account is established (though not accepting funds at the moment but will be soon. Please follow Maplesandbox and The Issac Brock Society for updates.) It is hoped that everyone affected around the world will contribute, even those who are not directly affected but are concerned about the sovereignty of their country and the horrific effect it will have on their local economies.
As an aside the opposition parties in Canada have now fully grasped the implications of this misdeed. Like the US this atrocity was hidden within another bill to hopefully avoid scrutiny. They are calling for it to be a stand alone bill and fully debated as it should in any true democracy. Unfortunately the Conservatives currently hold the majority, all march in step in fear of Dear Mr. Harper, they hopefully won’t be around long. Might I be so bossy to ask the US to do the same?
Will you donate Mr. Wood? We have enjoyed debating with you, delighted you have stayed on topic and I am getting the sneaky feeling you are starting to “get it”.
· Author, Robert W. Wood, Contributor
Thanks, I will check this out. Perhaps it is a stupid question, but I wonder if this will be strictly Canadian litigation or if the U.S. government will somehow also play a part.
If the US has the audacity to interfere with Canadians and their government it will make the US bully look even worse. If the Canadian government allows them to interfere there will be mutiny. Especially now that the opposition is on our side. The probable arrogance of the US looking down upon the Canadian constitutional lawyers as mere fools will hopefully be their undoing. You have brought that up before Mr. Wood, are you trying to scare us? (As I was just starting to warm up to you, shucks). You forget we are Americans living abroad…. we don’t scare easily. The American revolution was fought by our ancestors for the same reason. This is just a reincarnation and if history repeats itself, we know the outcome.
· Tricia Moon
Thanks Robert. Something discussed after the forum on Friday was how quickly events in Toronto had progressed from the first FATCA Forum on Dec 15, 2012 followed by a meeting focusing on the psychological difficulties involved in June 2013; a mini-protest in Toronto Nov 2013 (as well as others in Ottawa & Calgary); Solving US Citizenship Issues Info Sessions (given all across Canada as well as UK, DE & CH) from Jan 2014-present and then the event Friday. We are all at a very different place than when we first came together in late 2011 and though it didn’t seem so at the time, things have moved from being terrifyingly unclear to testing the waters with info perhaps outside the mainstream perceptions of requirements to now, where some things are reasonably predictable and the shift to larger groups taking large actions that inevitably will push solutions to the forefront. The Canadian Charter Challenge Fund managed to raise enough funds for a legal opinion as to the viability of the IGA/forced change in Canadian law being illegitimate due to the Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms. We recently incorporated a non-profit organization in order to raise funds for proceeding further with a legal challenge. I am hearing from peers in the EU, wondering as to how they also might move in similar directions. Republicans Overseas has indicated they will be launching a legal challenge to FATCA. We are all up against a very large problem and sometimes it is very depressing but there is nowhere to go but forward and that does bring hope! How American is that!!
· Author, Robert W. Wood Robert W. Wood, Contributor
Very interesting. I don’t know enough about the way in which the legal challenge will be brought or framed. I presume it is asserting that Canada’s IGA must be changed or abrogated. If that challenge is successful, it will be very interesting how or if the U.S. responds.
and Blaze reminds:
The American Ambassador to Canada said in 2011 “We are going to work together to see if we can’t find a way to accommodate Grandma — and others — here in Canada…My message on this one is to sit tight. We are not unreasonable. We are not unsympathetic. We are not irresponsible.”
Since then, the US has done nothing for Grandma, Grandpa or anyone else. They have shown themselves to be “unreasonable, unsympathetic, irresponsible” and worse!
Ambassador Jacobson is now Vice-Chair of Scotia Bank. How cozy. It took ages to appoint a new Ambassador. He is silent on FATCA.
This Canadian Grandma does not “sit tight.” She is front and centre (Canadian spelling) in the FATCA legal challenge and other FATCA battles.
We look forward to your donation to our legal challenge fund.
Well done! We would love to get a contribution from Robert Wood for the ADCS fund.
“You forget we are Americans living abroad…. we don’t scare easily. The American revolution was fought by our ancestors for the same reason. This is just a reincarnation and if history repeats itself, we know the outcome.”
Tarring and feathering?
@Brockers, “You forget we are Americans living abroad.”
I rememeber as a young boy people in Europe often saying those that emigrated took with them a certain DNA, almost a fighting spirit.
Today, I think that DNA is simply going home and leaving the USofA floundering.
Our forbears were bold, very bold, and so are we.
The American Spirit is the diaspora and it is leaving the lower 48 heading north and crossing the great oceans.
I’ve got LOTS of pine trees at my place. I’d share.
My favourite quote from the comments to this Forbes article is from “FromPatriotToExPatriate”:
“Barack Obama promised ‘change we can believe in’. What he delivered was ‘change we could never imagine’.”
I added comments by Tricia and Mr. Wood’s reply as well as another relevant by Blaze in the above post.
and Blaze reminds:
Related and important: Time for #Americansabroad forced to renounce citizenship to pursue legal remedies in US courts
And still WHERE THE HELL IS OUR LOCAL MEDIA ON THIS??? I’m seeing and learning of unbelievable media mind control here… They tell you only what they are told to tell you… wow!!
@NativeCanadian, we ARE the local media. The internet killed local journalism. I’d hate to be a journalist these days. Newspapers are a dying business model. Where does a local journalist go to find a job that actually pays when citizen journalists are willing to do the job for free. This website has hundreds of citizen journalists working for free. We’re giving first hand accounts of what’s happening in real time not only in our local jurisdictions but all over the world.
The comments from Brockers on Robert Wood’s article are excellent! I’ll bet its the best real insight he’s ever received on the issues affecting expats.
We really need to keep this up as much as possible with a focus on as many prominent journalists/columnists from the mainstream media. As much as I generally don’t like or trust mainstream media (too superficial and politically correct), they are really the key for educating both the public and the policy makers who are screwing us.
Once again, really great comments!
They are great comments. He also wouldn’t have many without Brockers participating, it seems.
He does seem to sound a little less homelanderish. Perhaps we ARE getting to him…
My take on Mr Wood is that he as mastered the art of polite passive aggression. Unlike the Mr. Hunters of the world you don’t actually get what Mr Wood is saying until an hour later. But he does keep the subject in the news. For that I am grateful. It is funny that not many yahoos read Forbes, thank the Lord. They actually get boring. I haven’t met one with a creative, intellectual thought.
After you get what Mr. Wood has said an hour later do you often find yourself still feeling hungry? 🙂
Wall Street Journal also covered this over the weekend, 3-4 May, page B8. Very nice article.
As usual, don’t know where to put this.
I just received a big long email from John Weston, you all probably got the same.
….blah blah blah……No doubt there are aspects of FATCA and this IGA which do not favour Canadians who are also U.S. citizens. However, one way or another, FATCA was on its way. Hopefully, your input and mine helped strengthen our Finance Minister’s position in his negotiations. Over time, we saw from the previous U.S. Ambassador an increased understanding of the unfairness that the IRS was visiting upon Canada/U.S. Dual Nationals.
I encourage you to seek advice on your specific circumstances from an independent tax advisor with appropriate experience.
If you all didn’t get it I can post the whole POS. You’ve heard it before.
@Charl, yes I got it too. I am in a foul mood so replied with two letters: “B.S.”