Presenter for this session: John Richardson, Citizenshipsolutions.ca
($20 to offset costs – payable at the door)
CALGARY, AB – Saturday, APRIL 19, 2014, 2:30 – 5:30 p.m.
http://www.kensingtonlegion.ca/ (free parking /Legion restaurant will be open)
Map: North Calgary Kensington Royal Canadian Legion No. 264, 1910 Kensington Road NW, Calgary, AB
This session comes with the “No one But Someone Who Is Going Through This Can Really Understand” element. John Richardson, like us who need information and SUPPORT, is a US Person in Canada.
A lot of grass-roots volunteerism by generous persons committed to this goes into these sessions. We don’t offer polish; we do offer information and support to help you come to the right decision for you and your family.
(John will be leaving for the airport right after the session as he will present at the Edmonton Information Session, Sunday, April 20, 2014, details to be announced.)
I hope to meet MANY Calgary and area persons on April 19th — this is your Alberta opportunity to attend ours in the series of Canadian and European information sessions.
All,
I highly recommend going to the session if you live in Alberta. I know it will be just John and not Andrew and Allison as it was in Montreal but I think you will learn a lot.
I’ll be attending!
Great, thanks Molly. Pass the word for this Calgary and area opportunity that is not likely to come our way again.
I’ll be there, I’ve also invited others .
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I just realized that this is Easter weekend. That may affect people’s ability to attend, especially the Edmonton session.
albertarose,
We thought of that. It works in with the schedules of organizers in Edmonton and Calgary, as well as the presenter who comes in from Toronto on his own dime. I put up an earlier post with that very question and there weren’t any objections to the session being on the Easter weekend. I hope the people who want to attend one of the Alberta sessions will be able to do a work-around. If not, our apologies.
I will be there.
Thanks Calgary411. I hadn’t read the your earlier post and just put 2 and 2 together yesterday that the session was Easter weekend for Alberta. I still plan on being there and am spreading the word to others who are unaware of Isaac Brock and this presentation.
Great, albertarose. Thanks!!!! I’m so glad you will be at one of the Alberta sessions and are spreading the word that they will take place a month from now.
My hope is that a good number of ‘US Persons’ in Alberta will take advantage of this unique opportunity for information that will help them in the tough decisions they will have to make for themselves and their families.
I just found this and so want to come. I need to find info on this subject. But it is my grandsons birthday party that same date and time.
Is there anywhere to get info on how to file for loss of citizenship.
Sorry there is such a conflict for you being able to attend this, Just me — that’s an important one for a grandma. The Alberta information sessions are not opportunities that will likely come around again — although you will find other information offered from time to time by those in the “compliance industry” — US tax lawyer and US tax account firms.
In the meantime, there is a ton of information on this site and at MapleSandbox.ca. The most important thing you can do right now is to read, read, read and become very informed of the consequences and options available to you and your family (i.e. will one of your grandson’s parents be affected?). No two situations are quite the same. There are several links on the sidebar to the right of the home page regarding relinquishment or renunciation of US citizenship. Depending on your individual circumstances, there are varying consequences. No one can comment on your situation unless we know how you became to be a “US Citizen or a US Person” in Canada.
So, start reading and after lots of that, come back to us with specific questions. You’ll find a lot of information within these pages, as well as a lot of very needed support for what you are experiencing — as the true support and understanding can only come from those who are also experiencing it.
@ Just me
Welcome! You’re new here so just to let you know, we have a longtime contributor called Just Me.
I was wondering if you can suggest someone in Calgary who does not charge to much that can help me file a Certificate of Loss of Nationality
I have been trying to research this but only seem to come us with USA lawyers that charge 5-10,000.00. Which I cannot afford to pay. I was only born in the USA lived there maybe three weeks until my mom could bring me home. I have lived I Canada all my life I have never tried to have anything to do with the USA. No social security number, no passport. I am Canadian my family is Canadian. I have a Canadian citizenship card. And I work for CRA. I do not want to file anything with the us. Please if you can help me find someone to get this done I would be so grateful.
Just me,
Please don’t rush to hire anyone until you have done some of your own research!!! You don’t need a US lawyer to help you with expatriation or enter into any “amnesty” program without full knowledge of whether it is right for you. There are those you can hire to hold your hand (at least a US lawyer to go with you to the US Consulate in either Calgary or Quebec, the only US Consulates in Canada that allow that as I understand). The Certificate of Loss of Nationality (CLN) is the important document that you may want to have to prove to your “foreign financial institution” (your local CANADIAN bank or credit union or insurance company, etc.) that you are not a US Person when FATCA kicks in on July 1, 2014. You will renounce or relinquish at the US Consulate nearest you; they will send all of the documentation to Washington, DC for final approval; the length of time to get your final approval and Certificate of Nationality varies. We just had a report of someone (not in Canada) getting their CLN in 10 days; many are taking up to a year to arrive.
You need to make an appointment with the US Consulate in Calgary, http://calgary.usconsulate.gov/service/booking-appointments.html, wait your turn for your expatriation appointment — but only AFTER you do your research on what is best for you. Here are good places to start your research while you wait for your appointment time to come up:
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/relinquishment/;
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/consulate2/;
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/department-of-state-forms-and-procedure-manuals-for-renouncingrelinquishing/;
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/relinquishing-acts-performed-prior-to-2004/;
http://maplesandbox.ca/2014/have-you-just-learned-that-the-united-states-considers-you-a-us-person/.
There are many stories like yours on this site. It is not a matter of paying someone to do this for you — you have decisions to make based on your facts.
I hope you will start some serious research to help you take the steps you need to expatriate and then to back-file (or not) US tax returns and FBARs (Foreign Bank Account Reports). Ask us any questions you have along the way in your learning process. (It is why the information sessions being offered are so valuable.)
@ Just me,
Great advice from Calgary411 to really educate yourself about this before acting and that you don’t need a US lawyer (or probably any lawyer — pretty much everyone here has been going DIY on this. Also one has to be really careful picking a professional in this niche area, because some are really taking advantage of our fear and scaring people into using their services when they are not needed and have caused more damage than help to the client.
It sounds like you would be eligible to get a CLN based on your having taken government employment, which is a relinquishing act if done with the intention of terminating one’s US citizenship (Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 349(a)(4)). If this is the case, your CLN would indicate your citizenship ended on the date you commenced your government employment. So, this post, Relinquishment of US citizenship by persons born dual or who naturalised in a foreign country may be of interest too.
After I learned about this awful citizenship mess and did the research, I opted to get a CLN, and as quickly as possible — but some persons, based their fact set and their evaluation of everything, are choosing to lay low and do nothing, or to do nothing at this time and see on how things develop in the next little while. Different people come to different conclusions. It’s really important to know the options and then make the choice/s that feel right for you.
Basically don’t rush into doing anything! So read up and feel free to ask questions and welcome to Brock!
Thank you for this info. I have been trying to do some research but I just get more and more confused. My parents were told when my not biological dad adopted me at two that if I did no live in the US when I was 21 I would lose dual citizenship. I never lived there never wanted to. So all this time I believed I lost any connection to the US. Only to find out very recently this may not be true. I already know I do not want anything to do with US anything. I just want to get rid of this curse. I do not understand what things to put on the form. That is why I wanted to hire someone to help me fill it out. I do not want to make any mistake that might cost me from getting the paper work that says I have nothing to do with the US
Just me,
If you were born in the US, you are a US citizen.
http://americansabroad.org/issues/citizenship/citizenship-requirements-faqs/
From a previous comment I made that you might want to start with to learn more about adoptions before and after the Child Citizenship Act of 2000:
I was glad to be able to give this important information to a fellow Canadian a few weeks ago (born in Canada; adopted by a US citizen dad and Canadian mom in Canada):
@ Just me,
Re:
I don’t want to sound overly anti-lawyer, because I’m generally not. But as well as professionals who are taking advantage of our fear, in this particular area of law there’s also a problem with honest professionals who just aren’t competent. This is a very niche area of law. Not only the general public, but a lot of lawyers have misconceptions about it; lawyers who, even though honest and well meaning, give the wrong advice. It’s not like when you need a lawyer for a divorce or because you got charged with theft, where pretty much any lawyer in that field of law is very likely to be competent and knowledgeable. This is a real niche area, and unlike family law or criminal law, the need to obtain proof of loss of US citizenship suddenly just popped up in the last couple of years.
They all seem to know what renunciation is, which is so cut-and-dried no really specialised knowledge is required anyway. But when you get to any other form of relinquishment, a truly knowledgable lawyer in this niche area is really hard to find. So – unlike family law or criminal law — you have to learn a certain amount of knowledge about this subject just to be sure the professional you’re hiring really knows more than you do. You’ll probably get the answers you need here from people who have gone through the CLN process with a fact set similar to yours.
@Just Me: This is going to be very confusing. There is another Just Me long time contributor.
Be very careful about the lawyer you choose. In August, 2011 when I first learned about this, I called a US Immigration lawyer in the city where I live in Canada. I told him the US Consulate told me quite clearly in 1973 I was “permanently and irrevocably” relinquishing US citizenship when I became a Canadian citizen.
He told me unless I had a Certificate of Loss of Nationality, I was still a US citizen and referred me to Deloitte to try to work through the tax issues. I never contacted them.
It was here at Brock that I learned I can go to a US Consulate and get a certificate dated the date I became a Canadian citizen. I personally refuse to go anywhere near a Consulate due to my experience in 1973 and another one in 2004. Plus, I am not prepared to have my name and address known to either US Dept of State or IRS. However, I have a copy of my signed renunciation of US citizenship from Citizenship and Immigration Canada witnessed by a CIC official. So, I consider that my restraining order.
As Pacifica has said, working for the CRA is grounds for relinquishing your US citizenship. If you want to get a CLN, I would suggest you ask for a copy of the Oath of Allegiance you signed when you began working for CRA from your personnel file. That is not required, but will help you indicate your relinquishment.
Did you begin working for the federal government before or after 2004? If it was before, that is great news. If it was after, things are a bit more complicated.
Even if you can’t attend the session in Calgary, you can contact John Richardson through his website http://citizenshipsolutions.ca/
I know Brock does not usually allow recommending professionals, but I hope the moderators will permit John’s website to be posted here as an alternative because Just Me is not able to attend John’s session.
I will soon be posting the Synopsis of the session in London Ontario at Maple Sandbox. John is now doing a final review of it.
Now, maybe you can help us. Is there much talk about FATCA and the IRS at CRA? Because you are a CRA employee, I assume you know CRA will not collect for IRS on any Canadian citizen?
You should also be aware many of us have a new-found respect for the professionalism of CRA since the IRS nightmare entered our lives. Now, when I do my income tax returns in an hour or so, submit them electronically, get my refund deposited to my account and receive a Notice of Assessment, I think how efficient, professional and respectful the whole process was.
New ‘Just me’ and the ‘Just Me’ we all know and love (as opposed to the old Just Me). Maybe the new ‘Just me’ could be ‘Not That Just Me’ (like we’ve done before)?
I will be attending either the Calgary or Edmonton session – probably Calgary. Thank you to @calgary411 for helping set that up.
@Blaze,
Re: “However, I have a copy of my signed renunciation of US citizenship from Citizenship and Immigration Canada witnessed by a CIC official.” Is that a document you received in 1973 when you naturalized as a Canadian?
Re: “You should also be aware many of us have a new-found respect for the professionalism of CRA since the IRS nightmare entered our lives.” Indeed. I am almost looking forward to filing this year! Almost. 🙂
Thank you all for this information. I just want to say that I am changing my name to save confusion. Hope that is okay.
I have not yet heard anything in CRA about this new development in regard to FATCA. I have been quietly trying to get info on this. I have not been telling anyone anymore where I was born.
I have flipped back and forth with I will just ignore it and see what happens to I have to deal with this. But cannot afford the financial hardship of it.
The continued stress is also not good for my health. If it were not for my passport I would just pretend I did not know anything about the US other than it has a couple of nice places to visit.
I am trying to figure out how to fill out the form to get the CLN. I am afraid to let any US department know about me. I am thankful I found all this information and so wish I did not have a conflict for your meeting. But as my mom is flying in from Ontario for my grandsons birthday. I have two with the same party date. I cannot miss the party.
@Canadian girl.403 (formerly Just me)
Take a breathe & it will work out. This site is full of people who are in the same boat so u will find alot of support & help. Take your time & read… u may find a solution u can live with. Don’t panic… it will not help… if u have any questions… feel free to ask.. many here are more then willing to aid in your solution & will point out where to go or do. As stated before… everyone’s situation is different… there is no one size fits all… As I learned from everyone here… the only way u can help yourself is to educate yourself… no one will help you better then yourself… So don’t let this wreck your health or sanity… u will figure it out..
Calgary411
Both my biological parents and my adopted dad are Canadian. I was born in 1960 in the US as my mom was not married and went to stay with an aunt until I was born. I was brought right back to Canada where I have lived my entire life apart from the two or three weeks after I was born. I do not have any close family left in the US. So no connection to anyone there for many years.
I have worked for CRA since 2001.
As I had said earlier the lawyer doing the adoption when my dad adopted me told them at 21 I would lose my dual citizenship. Which for all these years I believed to be the case. When my son turned 18 he thought he wanted to join the US airforce. I wrote a letter at that time to the US at that time I was almost 40 to see if he could based on the fact that I was born there. I have the letter that states due to him being born in 1982 he has no right to US citizenship. Again I felt that was also because I had lost my dual citizenship. So this is all a huge learning curve to get rid of something I never wanted or thought I had already lost.