46 thoughts on “Classic Mr Smith Goes to Washington filibuster against Drones and CIA nomination @SenRandPaul #StandwithRand”
Rand Paul epitomizes everything that is wrong with American politics. One could not imagine a more incompetent or ignorant politician than him. How he ever got a medical degree is beyond my comprehension.
@John Green…
With all due respect, I don’t think that is a fair comment. He obviously is not incompetent or ignorant just because he does not agree with you or me. You might disagree with him on policy or POW, but his stand against Drones is EXACTLY right, IMHO. 🙂 He has been one of the few in the Senate opposed to FATCA, so show some intelligence, not ignorance like the other Senators. You really should be listening to his filibuster, it is fascinating . This is the way a filibuster should work.
Anyone can disagree with him on other subjects, but this truly is a “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington” moment in all the glory it was meant to be! He’s even acknowledged, as you know, how he isn’t doing this to actually hold up or deny Brennan his position but purely out of his visceral disagreement that Obama has simply usurped the power of life and death of US citizens without so much as any Constitutional considerations. As Paul said on the use of drones: “I don’t much like rapists and murderers in our country, but at least we provide them with the rule of law because if they are ever denied that, what becomes the rest of our rights?” Sadly most of the people I speak with inside the USA simply see it as killing bad guys overseas and nothing to do with our rights in the USA.
10 hours now without a teleprompter. This is truly an amazing example of how our government and the filibuster is supposed to work. If you haven’t listened to at least some of it, you are missing a Senate experience unseen in our recent history. Again, you don’t have to agree or even like Rand Paul and still respect this effort. This is not Red State vs Blue state, or Dem vs Rep, in my opinion. This is a debate on Drones and 5th Amendment rights that needs to be had. More Americans should be watching.
It is other subjects I disagree with him on and the very poor and at times hokey research he does on a variety of issues. On most topics I find him ignorant and ill informed. My comments were not in relation to the filibuster.
Paul is dead on about the drones and the complete disingenuous stance that Obama is taking on the subject of indefinite detention of US citizens and his supposed right to kill US citizens anywhere for reasons he doesn’t have to disclose to anyone and without any due process or judicial oversight. Even if the US weren’t hellbent on making life for expats impossible, the continuing slide down the slippery slope of suspension of the constitution whenever the hell and for whatever the hell reason is reason enough to want to be a citizen of some other country.
I applaud this filibuster and now I’m hooked on watching it. I know it is only symbolic but it is so good to see some much needed questioning on the floor of the Senate of the abomination called drone strikes. Oh this is cool — tweets are being presented by Sen. Cruz from Texas. Sen. Paul apparently is not allowed to look at a cell phone while filibustering. STAND WITH RAND
This is indeed a fascinating moment in American politics. Obama has completely misread the public zeitgeist on the drones issue and how these cowardly weapons have come to symbolize the steady erosion of respect by the U.S. government for both domestic and international law and due process for over a decade. Far from repudiating the Bush/Cheney years, Obama has instead doubled-down on some of their very worst unconstitutional excesses.
But, as so many have mentioned today, this really isn’t about left or right, democrat or republican – it’s about Americans of all stripes squaring-off against their own federal government. Who knows where this may eventually lead, or how it might affect our own situation – might some kind of libertarian awakening in the homeland engender a bit more understanding and support for Americans abroad, or will we simply be forgotten in the ensuing insurrection?
Some of the tweets are quite thought-provoking:
Strange… Obama wouldn’t use drones to kill Benghazi terrorists but wants to use them on US citizens
Amazing how the admin hasn’t stopped it all by simply saying they will not target Americans without due process. Wow.
@Deckard1138, @Em
Indeed it is fascinating. 12 hours and still going. It is also interesting to see some Democrats standing up and asking the questions that Rand Paul is putting forth. IE, Does President Obama believe he has the authority to use drones to kill Americans on American shores? Not, that he doesn’t plan to do it, not is it not appropriate, but does he believe the Constitution restricts his power and he can not do this without due process as laid out in the 5th Amendment. It was a question you could have asked of George W Bush too, so we need to have this type of debate. This is what the Senate is supposed to be about. Real debate. All they need to get an answer to that simple question, and the filibuster ends and the Senate can vote for Brennan.
Good honest exchanges between Rand Paul and Senator Durbin. Also, this is the first I have seen Senator Ted Cruz in debate, and he is good! I might not agree with some or any of his social positions, but on issues of sovereignty, he was unassailable when he was in opposition to George W Bush. Fascinating stuff. I can’t turn it off. 🙂
Darn…. Rand ended his filibuster. The question remains.
Well it’s over but having 12 hours of relatively free speech was impressive. Nuts, Sen. Graham is spewing his usual propaganda to limit liberty in a replay now. Time to turn off C-Span.
I had sent a letter to my Senator against drones, telling him I live 300m from the sea, it would be easy to get me.
In fact with a short swing around the neighborhood they could probably get 10 US persons and a couple of Canadians to boot.
@Mark Twain; re “In fact with a short swing around the neighborhood they could probably get 10 US persons and a couple of Canadians to boot. See “…..The U.S. Department of Homeland Security flies some drones over American air space along remote patches of the Canada-U.S. border – including one that stopped suspected cattle rustlers in North Dakota last year
And last month, it was widely reported that U.S. drones were being secretly dispatched to Mexico to assist that country’s efforts to curb a bloody drug war that’s claimed thousands of lives.
Ottawa has been less eager to embrace drones for surveillance on civilians.
The Canadian Forces use some unmanned planes in foreign war zones and to patrol the coast and some domestic police forces have recently purchased “micro-drones” to help gather evidence at crime scenes.
Yeah, lucky for the US, they could ‘kill two birds with one drone’ as most Canadians live clustered around the shared border, which means they could just use the border patrol ones they already have – and save that money to pay down the US debt.
@John Green, Rand Paul is an exceptional senator who has consistently stood against FATCA. His father was the only congressman who wanted to eliminate both the Federal Reserve and the IRS. That is why I endorsed Ron Paul and no other candidate in the last US presidential election. Ron Paul is the only US politician that I can stand listening to, and he can speak for many hours without making a fool of himself. Ron Paul has been a clarion prophetic voice in Washington against the incontinence of US federal government and central bank which has led to insolvency. In many respects, Rand is a chip off the ol’ block. So far, the only thing I see against him is that he is an American.
But as far as I can see, your statement that he is essentially a boob, is a throw away comment that has no merit because it doesn’t give any specific reasons why you disagree with him or any examples of his poorly researched opinions. You are welcome to make such comments of any political figure if you want, but it is not very helpful when Paul is one of the few potential allies that alienated expats have in the US Congress.
“The U.S. Department of Homeland Security flies some drones over American air space along remote patches of the Canada-U.S. border – including one that stopped suspected cattle rustlers in North Dakota last year”
John Wayne – YES! Drones NO!
@Petros. It is good that Rand Paul opposes FATCA. There are several areas where his positions are at variance with evidence. I haven’t detailed them because they are not FATCA related. His free market position on health care is not supported by any international evidence. I disagree with his position on gun control which is also not supported by evidence. His civil rights positions are very retrogressive. His positions on animal rights, animal welfare and immigration are archaic. His position on civil rights out of date. He supports the rich at the expense of the poor. His position on energy and climate change fly in the face of evidence and his ill founded rant about gun running conspiracy through Turkey to Syrian rebels was based on the flimsiest material. His father is an incoherent rambler who makes it up as he goes along. His recent speech in Canada was a joke.
Does anyone really believe that surrendering our civil, legal and sovereign rights – and allowing drones to fly over the US, or over Canadian territory is going to stop incidents like 9/11, or the Unibomber? Does anyone believe that we’d have any recourse or could get any information from Homeland Security in the event of an ‘unfortunate’ incident or ‘collateral damage’? We’re supposed to think that detecting ‘suspected’ cattle thieves is a tradeoff? We’re supposed to think that there would be any ‘transparency’ or accountability? See: http://www.nowtoronto.com/news/story.cfm?content=191224 …”get ready for all the questions now being raised about the legality of such missions to start migrating north, as the Harper government decides how to acquire armed drones under the Department of National Defence’s Joint Uninhabited Surveillance and Target Acquisition System (JUSTAS).
While the reported $1 billion program is way behind schedule, it’s being closely monitored by the Ottawa-based Rideau Institute, which has just launched a petition and public education campaign aimed at scuttling the idea of armed drones in Canada’s arsenal.
A year ago, then-associate defence minister Julian Fantino dismissed reports that Canada might acquire such vehicles as “mere speculation,” but RCAF spokesperson Holly-Anne Brown confirms to NOW that the force is still on track for the purchases.”…. It appears that there is already a lack of transparency and accountability.
Badger, I hear ya. My smart assness is on your side. I truly wrote my Senator and told him to oppose the nomination because I was 300 yards from the sea and drones could reach me.
I can picture the Minot base getting chummy with the local border Control. THey probably eat donuts at the same coffee shop together. With all the new drilling up there they probably are thinking its a national security crisis and that a jihad might be initiated on an oil pump.
The Portal crossing has a 50 year reputation for being Nazis. My uncles’ favorite story each year was about the agent who had to search the entire trunk and delved Deep into the Dirty diaper bag.
Rand Paul is doing it the old-fashioned way—talking all day and night. And while he may not stop John Brennan’s CIA nomination, he’s taking a stand on principle, not partisanship, and shaming Democrats over drones.
@Mark Twain,
The benefit of the drones is that they avoid the Deep Diaper Bag Dive. Handsfree!
Seriously, re ; “With all the new drilling up there they probably are thinking its a national security crisis and that a jihad might be initiated on an oil pump”…. I hadn’t thought about the connection to ‘preserving US energy independence’.
I just assume as a default that anything they tell us isn’t true, and that there is lots they’re never going to tell us.
I hope I never have to cross at Portal
16 of these are out, too, of 1700 being demobilized from Iraq & Iran. Another war is needed on someone in order to put these assets to good use. The refurbishments over to civilian use is good new business for the military Contractors.
This one is El Paso. No doubt they need a few to guard Niagra Falls from an internal terrorist attack.
whoops, look like I pasted in the wrong war. This is the war I was thinking about
Rand Paul epitomizes everything that is wrong with American politics. One could not imagine a more incompetent or ignorant politician than him. How he ever got a medical degree is beyond my comprehension.
@John Green…
With all due respect, I don’t think that is a fair comment. He obviously is not incompetent or ignorant just because he does not agree with you or me. You might disagree with him on policy or POW, but his stand against Drones is EXACTLY right, IMHO. 🙂 He has been one of the few in the Senate opposed to FATCA, so show some intelligence, not ignorance like the other Senators. You really should be listening to his filibuster, it is fascinating . This is the way a filibuster should work.
As one tweeter said, https://twitter.com/dpmcgarry/status/309487793871147008
A comment I just received via email…
Anyone can disagree with him on other subjects, but this truly is a “Mr. Smith Goes to Washington” moment in all the glory it was meant to be! He’s even acknowledged, as you know, how he isn’t doing this to actually hold up or deny Brennan his position but purely out of his visceral disagreement that Obama has simply usurped the power of life and death of US citizens without so much as any Constitutional considerations. As Paul said on the use of drones: “I don’t much like rapists and murderers in our country, but at least we provide them with the rule of law because if they are ever denied that, what becomes the rest of our rights?” Sadly most of the people I speak with inside the USA simply see it as killing bad guys overseas and nothing to do with our rights in the USA.
10 hours now without a teleprompter. This is truly an amazing example of how our government and the filibuster is supposed to work. If you haven’t listened to at least some of it, you are missing a Senate experience unseen in our recent history. Again, you don’t have to agree or even like Rand Paul and still respect this effort. This is not Red State vs Blue state, or Dem vs Rep, in my opinion. This is a debate on Drones and 5th Amendment rights that needs to be had. More Americans should be watching.
https://twitter.com/DanStlMo/status/309490535108841475
It is other subjects I disagree with him on and the very poor and at times hokey research he does on a variety of issues. On most topics I find him ignorant and ill informed. My comments were not in relation to the filibuster.
Paul is dead on about the drones and the complete disingenuous stance that Obama is taking on the subject of indefinite detention of US citizens and his supposed right to kill US citizens anywhere for reasons he doesn’t have to disclose to anyone and without any due process or judicial oversight. Even if the US weren’t hellbent on making life for expats impossible, the continuing slide down the slippery slope of suspension of the constitution whenever the hell and for whatever the hell reason is reason enough to want to be a citizen of some other country.
I applaud this filibuster and now I’m hooked on watching it. I know it is only symbolic but it is so good to see some much needed questioning on the floor of the Senate of the abomination called drone strikes. Oh this is cool — tweets are being presented by Sen. Cruz from Texas. Sen. Paul apparently is not allowed to look at a cell phone while filibustering. STAND WITH RAND
This is indeed a fascinating moment in American politics. Obama has completely misread the public zeitgeist on the drones issue and how these cowardly weapons have come to symbolize the steady erosion of respect by the U.S. government for both domestic and international law and due process for over a decade. Far from repudiating the Bush/Cheney years, Obama has instead doubled-down on some of their very worst unconstitutional excesses.
But, as so many have mentioned today, this really isn’t about left or right, democrat or republican – it’s about Americans of all stripes squaring-off against their own federal government. Who knows where this may eventually lead, or how it might affect our own situation – might some kind of libertarian awakening in the homeland engender a bit more understanding and support for Americans abroad, or will we simply be forgotten in the ensuing insurrection?
Some of the tweets are quite thought-provoking:
@Deckard1138, @Em
Indeed it is fascinating. 12 hours and still going. It is also interesting to see some Democrats standing up and asking the questions that Rand Paul is putting forth. IE, Does President Obama believe he has the authority to use drones to kill Americans on American shores? Not, that he doesn’t plan to do it, not is it not appropriate, but does he believe the Constitution restricts his power and he can not do this without due process as laid out in the 5th Amendment. It was a question you could have asked of George W Bush too, so we need to have this type of debate. This is what the Senate is supposed to be about. Real debate. All they need to get an answer to that simple question, and the filibuster ends and the Senate can vote for Brennan.
Good honest exchanges between Rand Paul and Senator Durbin. Also, this is the first I have seen Senator Ted Cruz in debate, and he is good! I might not agree with some or any of his social positions, but on issues of sovereignty, he was unassailable when he was in opposition to George W Bush. Fascinating stuff. I can’t turn it off. 🙂
Darn…. Rand ended his filibuster. The question remains.
Well it’s over but having 12 hours of relatively free speech was impressive. Nuts, Sen. Graham is spewing his usual propaganda to limit liberty in a replay now. Time to turn off C-Span.
https://twitter.com/NRO/status/309545372198531072
I had sent a letter to my Senator against drones, telling him I live 300m from the sea, it would be easy to get me.
In fact with a short swing around the neighborhood they could probably get 10 US persons and a couple of Canadians to boot.
@Mark Twain; re “In fact with a short swing around the neighborhood they could probably get 10 US persons and a couple of Canadians to boot. See “…..The U.S. Department of Homeland Security flies some drones over American air space along remote patches of the Canada-U.S. border – including one that stopped suspected cattle rustlers in North Dakota last year
And last month, it was widely reported that U.S. drones were being secretly dispatched to Mexico to assist that country’s efforts to curb a bloody drug war that’s claimed thousands of lives.
Ottawa has been less eager to embrace drones for surveillance on civilians.
The Canadian Forces use some unmanned planes in foreign war zones and to patrol the coast and some domestic police forces have recently purchased “micro-drones” to help gather evidence at crime scenes.
But unlike their U.S. counterparts, Canada’s border guards are not known to be using any drones to keep an eye on land crossings. Should they start, or team up with U.S. border guards to do so, such measures could raise a litany of privacy questions.”…. from http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/politics/ottawa-notebook/privacy-czar-sounds-alarm-on-drones-patrolling-us-border/article610512/?service=mobile
Yeah, lucky for the US, they could ‘kill two birds with one drone’ as most Canadians live clustered around the shared border, which means they could just use the border patrol ones they already have – and save that money to pay down the US debt.
@John Green, Rand Paul is an exceptional senator who has consistently stood against FATCA. His father was the only congressman who wanted to eliminate both the Federal Reserve and the IRS. That is why I endorsed Ron Paul and no other candidate in the last US presidential election. Ron Paul is the only US politician that I can stand listening to, and he can speak for many hours without making a fool of himself. Ron Paul has been a clarion prophetic voice in Washington against the incontinence of US federal government and central bank which has led to insolvency. In many respects, Rand is a chip off the ol’ block. So far, the only thing I see against him is that he is an American.
But as far as I can see, your statement that he is essentially a boob, is a throw away comment that has no merit because it doesn’t give any specific reasons why you disagree with him or any examples of his poorly researched opinions. You are welcome to make such comments of any political figure if you want, but it is not very helpful when Paul is one of the few potential allies that alienated expats have in the US Congress.
“The U.S. Department of Homeland Security flies some drones over American air space along remote patches of the Canada-U.S. border – including one that stopped suspected cattle rustlers in North Dakota last year”
John Wayne – YES! Drones NO!
@Petros. It is good that Rand Paul opposes FATCA. There are several areas where his positions are at variance with evidence. I haven’t detailed them because they are not FATCA related. His free market position on health care is not supported by any international evidence. I disagree with his position on gun control which is also not supported by evidence. His civil rights positions are very retrogressive. His positions on animal rights, animal welfare and immigration are archaic. His position on civil rights out of date. He supports the rich at the expense of the poor. His position on energy and climate change fly in the face of evidence and his ill founded rant about gun running conspiracy through Turkey to Syrian rebels was based on the flimsiest material. His father is an incoherent rambler who makes it up as he goes along. His recent speech in Canada was a joke.
@Woofy; http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/03/06/classic-mr-smith-goes-to-washington-filibuster-against-drones-and-cia-nomination-senrandpaul/comment-page-1/#comment-216780
Does anyone really believe that surrendering our civil, legal and sovereign rights – and allowing drones to fly over the US, or over Canadian territory is going to stop incidents like 9/11, or the Unibomber? Does anyone believe that we’d have any recourse or could get any information from Homeland Security in the event of an ‘unfortunate’ incident or ‘collateral damage’? We’re supposed to think that detecting ‘suspected’ cattle thieves is a tradeoff? We’re supposed to think that there would be any ‘transparency’ or accountability? See: http://www.nowtoronto.com/news/story.cfm?content=191224 …”get ready for all the questions now being raised about the legality of such missions to start migrating north, as the Harper government decides how to acquire armed drones under the Department of National Defence’s Joint Uninhabited Surveillance and Target Acquisition System (JUSTAS).
While the reported $1 billion program is way behind schedule, it’s being closely monitored by the Ottawa-based Rideau Institute, which has just launched a petition and public education campaign aimed at scuttling the idea of armed drones in Canada’s arsenal.
A year ago, then-associate defence minister Julian Fantino dismissed reports that Canada might acquire such vehicles as “mere speculation,” but RCAF spokesperson Holly-Anne Brown confirms to NOW that the force is still on track for the purchases.”…. It appears that there is already a lack of transparency and accountability.
Badger, I hear ya. My smart assness is on your side. I truly wrote my Senator and told him to oppose the nomination because I was 300 yards from the sea and drones could reach me.
I can picture the Minot base getting chummy with the local border Control. THey probably eat donuts at the same coffee shop together. With all the new drilling up there they probably are thinking its a national security crisis and that a jihad might be initiated on an oil pump.
The Portal crossing has a 50 year reputation for being Nazis. My uncles’ favorite story each year was about the agent who had to search the entire trunk and delved Deep into the Dirty diaper bag.
Rand Paul Is Giving Us a Filibuster Tutorial, So Let’s Pay Attention
by Peter Beinart Mar 7, 2013 4:45 AM EST
Rand Paul is doing it the old-fashioned way—talking all day and night. And while he may not stop John Brennan’s CIA nomination, he’s taking a stand on principle, not partisanship, and shaming Democrats over drones.
@Mark Twain,
The benefit of the drones is that they avoid the Deep Diaper Bag Dive. Handsfree!
Seriously, re ; “With all the new drilling up there they probably are thinking its a national security crisis and that a jihad might be initiated on an oil pump”…. I hadn’t thought about the connection to ‘preserving US energy independence’.
I just assume as a default that anything they tell us isn’t true, and that there is lots they’re never going to tell us.
I hope I never have to cross at Portal
16 of these are out, too, of 1700 being demobilized from Iraq & Iran. Another war is needed on someone in order to put these assets to good use. The refurbishments over to civilian use is good new business for the military Contractors.
This one is El Paso. No doubt they need a few to guard Niagra Falls from an internal terrorist attack.
whoops, look like I pasted in the wrong war. This is the war I was thinking about
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nxn1GT2NIPY
le’s try that again. The others can be erased, hopefully this works