The new Quarterly Publication of Individuals, Who Have Chosen to Expatriate, As Required By Section 6039G was released today, two days later than required by law. It contains the names of 238 former U.S. citizens and long-term non-citizen residents, far lower than 403 for the same quarter last year, but back up from 189 in the second quarter of 2012.
The completeness of this list is in doubt, given that South Korea alone reported 2,158 people returning to South Korea and giving up U.S. passports or green cards in 2011, against only 1,781 people of all nationalities reported by the Federal Register in the same period. Peter Dunn’s name has finally been published, more than half a year after he received his CLN and almost two years after he first committed a relinquishing act (acquiring Canadian citizenship with the intent of losing U.S. citizenship) in February 2011. Other names of people known to have given up U.S. citizenship during that time are not present, such as:
- Belizean anti-crime activist Yolanda Schakron (Wikipedia);
- Jamaica’s ex-Customs Commissioner Danville Walker (Wikipedia);
- Peruvian presidential candidate Pedro Kuczynski (Wikipedia; article about renunciation);
- Republic of Korea Air Force Lt. Noh Woo-song (previously discussed on Isaac Brock);
- Belgian citizen Genette Eysselinck (interviewed by Atossa Abrahamian back in April).
Many renunciants from earlier years have also not had their names included in the Federal Register, among them Korean actress Han Ye-seul (Wikipedia), Hong Kong actor Jaycee Chan (Wikipedia), Jamaican politician Daryl Vaz (Wikipedia), Japanese ice dancer Cathy Reed (Wikipedia), Taiwan environmental activist Robin Winkler (Wikipedia), and poker player Adam Bilzerian (previously discussed on Isaac Brock).
Update: Another oddity in this month’s list is the dearth of Hong Kong names. Unlike past lists which regularly featured dozens of Hong Kong professionals whose names showed up in Bar Association, Securities and Futures Commission, or Companies Registry filings, this time I see only four identifiably-Cantonese names, and only one gets a hit in the usual public records. I see five names which are probably Singaporean or Malaysian Chinese, four names which are probably mainland Chinese (spelled in Pinyin), and twenty-five which are Chinese but which don’t give a hint to their specific geographical origin. Twenty-nine names, or about 12% of the list, are Korean, a similar proportion as in the past.
And finally, the IRS has officially entered its fifteenth year of misspelling the acronym of the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act as “HIPPA”.
*
I renounced on Jan 12 2012 and CLN approved in July. I am not a covered expatriate, have yet to file 8854. I don’t think Petros filed an 8854 either. Cannot fathom what they are doing.
I meant to include that I was not on the list.
@ShadowRaider and AnonAnon
“For purposes of this listing, long-term residents, as defined in section 877(e)(2), are treated as if they were citizens of the United States who lost citizenship.”
It would seem it could include green card holders.
@nobledreamer, Petros relinquished in 2011 and filed a form 8854 in June 2012. If you renounced in 2012, your form 8854 is only due in 2013. I think the consulates only inform a small sample of expatriates to the IRS, but the IRS probably lists the names of all people who file form 8854.
@ShadowRaider Thanks, thought Petos had not filed it but guess I am mixing up not doing the FUBARs.
@AnonAnon,
It seems they have the lists all the way back to 1994:
https://www.federalregister.gov/quarterly-publication-of-individuals-who-have-chosen-to-expatriate
I have a rather haphazard start on this from months ago-do you want to split it? đ
@nobledreamer, See Petros’s comment here.
*Eric and nobledreamer, thanks for correcting me. It does appear that former green card holders who were long-term residents of the U.S. are to be included in the list. That certainly doesn’t include all green card holders, however. I know one personally who had a green card but was not a long-term resident. He gave it up a year or so ago, and his name has not appeared on the list.
*nobledreamer, sure, we could share the work of compiling a cumulative list. I’m not sure what’s the best/simplest way to go about it. Suggestions?
@Nobledreamer, yes, Shadowraider is correct. I did file an 8854. It was due June 15, 2012, whereas for you it is due, really, because you had 12 tax days in 2012, June 15, 2013. I don’t think that you can file before then, unless for tax purposes you considered your date of expatriation as 31 December 2011, but I am pretty sure that’s not allowed.
So if Shadowraider’s theory is correct, the treasurer will wait to hear from the IRS to find out if you filed 8854 before you end up on the list.
*ShadowRaider
There currently and outstanding regular request comment under the Paperwork Reduction Act for form 8854 in the Federal Register. Interestingly enough it is claimed that only 100 people file Form 8854 every year.
*@nobledreamer, I see that I can easily combine and collate quarterly expatriation lists with a spreadsheet, adding a column to indicate the year and quarter and then sorting on the surname column. It shouldn’t take long that way to produce a combined list for the past several years and update it as each new quarterly list appears. I can work on that sometime in the next few days.
@ShadowRaider and Petros, thanks
I am not confused about when I am to file an 8854 and have always thought one would not make the list until the 8854 was filed. Some people have doubted this but I am sure I read it early on in our research of all things expatriation. đ
@AnonAnon,
Great. I notice what I had done was simply to copy/paste the lists so I did the same to make a complete set from 1st quarter 2009-present. The earliest list is from 2nd quarter 1998 and the earlier lists are pdf only.
Do you mean that you would combine all the lists into one column for surname, one for date, etc? If so, I have a mess so far! Assuming there are 13 full years 1999-2011 + 3 quarters each for 1998 and 2012, how bout we split? I can start with ’98 and do up to 2005 and you can do 2006 to date? Then we can combine and have one list and whoever wants to continue it can take over from there?
*Unless there is another person with my name that has renounced, I am on the list, and have yet to file form 8854.
@Petros
so you are finished and the FUBARs are not considered part of the filing requirements for the 5 yr certification?
I goofed-my date is Jan 20 so I understand I have to do 1040 for 19 days, probably a blank 1040NR for the rest of the year and 8854 all due on June 30, 2013. Question-still FUBAR and 3520 for those 19 days and also 8891? UGH
I renounced in February 2012 and I am not on the list. I won’t be filing the 8854 until January, though. It is interesting to hear that Patricia is on the, list but hasn’t yet filed the 8854. I’m not sure there is any logic to the method!
*@rødgrød
Two possibilities for my name to appear on the list
1) in my cover letter with the 5 years of back taxes, I wrote that I renounced my citizenship March 1, 2012. The letter was passed up the chain of commant where my name was matched to a list of CLN’s issued by the DOS.
2) the IRS is monitoring this site and other expat sites where taxes and renunciation are discussed. In one thread, I stated that although no longer able to vote, have one more chance to stand up and be counted; to insist that my name appear in the federal register. I used my real name to close my comment
*Folks, ignore the silly list. It is nothing but a piece of propaganda designed to fool the masses so that nothing will change. This is evidence that the situation for Americans living abroad will not improve anytime in the near future since stateside Americans won’t have an honest and realistic view of the situation.
*Correct me if I am wrong, but I am not aware that this list is supposed to include green card holders who cancel their US residence status. It is my understanding that its only purpose is to list those former US citizens who have renounced US citizenship. Is this correct?
@SwissPinoy. You are right. Propaganda indeed. But it is propaganda as much by what it fails to report as by what it decides to include. Selection of data is an essential aspect of any propaganda.
*@nobledreamer, I don’t know that there’s much point in making a combined list all the way back to 1998. I was thinking just for the lists since all this s*** hit the fan — maybe since 2009 or 2010. In that case it won’t take me long to do it myself, and I can update it each quarter. The result will be sorted by surname and will have an entry beside each name for the year and quarter in which that name appeared in the Federal Register.
I’m not sure how to post it here at IBS — probably a link like the one for Relinquishment and Renunciation Data — but someone who can edit the web page would have to do that.
@Nobledreamer, I heard a saying once: What the government (fill in the blank agency or department, e.g., CRA, IRS) doesn’t know can’t hurt you. So therefore, I would say you should supply information on a need-to-know basis. If they don’t need to know it, don’t report it. If the form is required (e.g., 1040), then only put such information as necessary.
Before the implementation of FATCA, the only way that the US government is going to find out about any bank accounts in Canada that person in Canada might have is if the person tells them. So if you are already out the door with your CLN, I don’t see any advantage to anyone, either the US government or to yourself, to report bank accounts. If you have already filed an FBAR that’s another thing. Then you have to file because they already have an idea of your total net worth and the bank accounts that you have.
The other question is constitutional rights. The FBAR law is a severe violation of almost all of your constitutional rights–though thanks to evil courts in the US, rights don’t really amount to anything today except in theory. Yet a person may voluntarily cede any of their constitutional rights: so beware that entering OVDI or filing quiet or noisy disclosures amounts to a voluntary ceding of one’s rights (4th, 5th amendments). I refuse to cede these rights, even in the face of Federal courts which use the “required records doctrine” to abolish the 4th and 5th amendments.
@Petros
I agree with you totally. If I were in your position, I probably would do exactly as you describe.
The only reason I filed everything (meaning FUBARs) was the fact that we have a son, who is dual. When you have children and your actions (or lack thereof) can pose a burden on them, you do what you might not do otherwise. Now he has changed his mind again and does not want to renounce as chemistry positions are hard to find right now and US may offer more possibilities. I am not thrilled about this but it is his life. He is doubly at risk for anything I do/do not do if he does not renounce. Does this make sense to you?
@AnonAnon
Ok.
*Today’s New York Times includes a story about a retired US university professor who, at 89 years of age, has become a naturalized citizen of Japan.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/11/03/world/asia/with-citizenship-japan-embraces-columbia-scholar.html?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20121103.
The article states “To become Japanese, Dr Keene, who is unmarried, had to relinquish his American nationality.” Is a US citizen permitted under US law to “relinquish” US citizenship in order to become a citizen of another country which does not permit dual citizenship, or is “renunciaiton” requred in such cases?
The article also quotes Dr. Keene as stating “You cannot stop being a US citizen after 89 years.” I wonder if he was speaking figuratively, or if he was somehow allowed to retain his US citizenship, which would appear to be a violation of Japanese Nationality Law for persons becoming naturalized citizens of Japan.
Was Dr. Keene’s name included on this latest list of US nationality renunciants, or has it appeared on prior recent lists?
@Nobledreamer, The point about your son actually would make sense only if you have signing authority with him on accounts with sufficient funds to trigger an FBAR requirement.
Otherwise, here is how I see it: If your wealth is essential to your son’s welfare, then NOT telling the US government what you have is perhaps the least risky thing to do and the best way to protect his future welfare.
*Roger, according to wiki, he is not listed in the federal register: