Came across this only today. It’s from 2005.
Need to have CLN to travel Virgin
P Bowles from Littlehampton, West Sussex wrote
On September 27, I arrived at Heathrow to check in for a flight to Boston with Virgin Atlantic. As we stood in line, our passports were checked by an agent. I have a full British passport, but my place of birth is Baltimore. I was taken to see a supervisor, who asked whether I had proof I had given up my US citizenship. Apparently, a British passport is not sufficient proof. Virgin said it could not fly me unless I produced a “Loss of Nationality” letter.
@Outraged, I appreciate your support (of my not being racist)–two sets of rules is exactly right.
@twodogs, welcome to Isaac Brock; I see this is your first comment. Not the best start, though. Perhaps you could study a little bit of the history of this site and how we wanted open discussion. I have not been abusive in the slightest; indeed, calling someone by their full name, BHO, or John Fitzgerald Kennedy, Franklin Delano Roosevelt, George Walker Bush, is no sign of disrespect. I am sorry that you think it gives me away as a “birther”; if I am such a thing, there is no shame in that. It is a legal opinion about the eligibility of Obama–the name “birther” was give to such people as an ad hominem attack to discredit them without taking into consideration the merits of the argument or vetting the actual eligibility of the candidate Obama. No one here has offered a substantive reason as to why it is an incorrect position, not that it would matter one way or another–that wasn’t my point. As a legal argument, it would depend ultimately on the Supreme Court, and if SCOTUS decision on Obamacare is any indicator, the court would say that it is up to the electorate to decide if Obama is eligible, not the SCOTUS.
Ultimately my argument above is not racist because Obama’s own publicist promoted him as Kenyan-born with apparently Obama’s approval (or wasn’t the literary agent commissioned by Obama himself to promote his potential as an author?). It is not racist because my point wasn’t the eligibility of the POTUS, but that the POTUS is not required to show an original document–but we relinquishers are required, before we are allowed to enter the USA, which is the land of my birth, to show an ORIGINAL CLN. Thus, the burden of proof of loss of citizenship is greater than the burden of proof to become POTUS. That was my point all along, and no one has, despite all the bad words that have been used, has shown me to be incorrect on that point. But you cannot stop me from seething about it, can you? My Canadian passport alone should get me into US, just like any other Canadian. Please re-read the Expatriation Act of 1868.
Cornwalliscal is perfectly within his rights to withdraw his financial support of the website. He is definitely angry at people who question Obama’s eligibility for POTUS. I don’t think he will care ever to return to the United States in any case. But I would like perhaps one day to see my father again; to visit nieces and nephews. But I am not going to visit Obama’s America. I’ve become the target of a Tax Jihad, and my best protection is to stay in Canada. The 2009 OVDP was unleashed under tax-cheat Timothy Geithner, a BHO appointment–he’s done it with the full approval of the President. So yes, we have suffered under this man. But go ahead and vote for him, y’all. Yes, I don’t vote anymore in the United States. But I invite all you masochists who still vote to vote for the President Obama. I’ve have a large short position in the US dollar and President Obama’s success is my success.
“@twodogs, welcome to Isaac Brock; I see this is your first comment. Not the best start, though. “
Your condescending tone is unfortunate. It detracts from your otherwise substantial effort. And renders your very next sentence, about wanting ‘open discssion’ on your blog, a non-sequitur.
@twodogs, My claim that your first comment was not a good start towards contributing to the open conversation is based on this: “please. time to walk it back.” That is an attempt to steer the conversation away from a legitimate subject. I don’t think that was the best way to begin at a forum which was purposefully created in order to foster open conversation. My comment was not a non sequitur. On this thread, my alleged position has been called right-wing racist bullshit–I made a link to an article at the American Thinker which is a reputable right-wing web publication which is edited by former Harvard academic Dr. Thomas Lifson. I have also contributed to American Thinker. The linked article was by an Adobe product expert who believes that the digital layers in POTUS’s birth certificate show that it has been procured digitally and that it is not an authentic scan. Somehow that is racist bullshit. Somehow this is not worthy of Isaac Brock, to investigate the trustworthiness of the current POTUS who has done great harm to all of us here? Actually I think that the Isaac Brock Society lives for such moments. What if BHO is just a serial liar? What if he has presented a false birth certificate? What if he allowed himself for years to be considered Kenyan-born to sell his merits as an author? He may have been born in Hawaii, to be sure–and this could make him constitutionally eligible for POTUS, but I would think that the lies and false documents would disqualify him morally from being POTUS, but what do I care? I only was forced to relinquish my US citizenship on his watch.
I have defended my position against the accusation of racism, and I have also defended the right to hold the position that Barack Hussein Obama is not constitutionally eligible for the office. You said that I have given myself away as a “birther” and that I need to “walk it back” which I interpret to mean that it is something that no one here should talk about lest it taint or sully the otherwise good work that we do.
We erase hundreds of spam messages every day. We know the difference between something which is on topic and which is off topic. If someone wants to defend the “birther” issue here, well for the sake of open conversation, they would have the freedom to do that. It is a citizenship issue and it is certainly on topic. Discussing whether BHO is a natural born citizen is highly relevant to some, particularly those who were born during the same period to one or more foreign parents.
Yet it is abusive to call, in such a gratuitous manner, the “birther” position “racist”. That accusation is completely unjust and I have taken exception to it. Your first comment appeared to me to be an attempt to shut down a part of the conversation. That’s why I suggest you go back and read some of the history of this site (particularly this post).
Finally, I was not being the least bit cheeky by welcoming you. I’m genuinely happy to have you in the conversation. Thanks for that.
The ‘walk it back’ referred directly to your sweeping generalization that Obama has ‘hurt us all’ – – you chose to speak for everyone, and on reflection I am sure you will agree that it is not likely that each and every individual in this public square feels that way.
The birther claims deserve no further attention or comment.
@TwoDogs: I’m going to stay out of the debate about whether Obama is or isn’t a natural born American. As someone who left the US almost 45 years ago and has been a citizen of another country for four decades, I don’t care one way or the other.
In terms of Obama hurting all of us, I think you will be hard pressed to find anyone here who is not living this nightmare inflicted upon us under the administration of Obama and infamous tax evader Timothy Geithner. That includes those of us who had every reason to believe US when we were told decades ago we were “permanently and irrevocably” relinquishing US citizenship by becoming citizens elsewhere.
There was no mention at that time that we needed to obtain some obscure document called a CLN. Now, in order to visit elderly and ailing parents or siblings or attend family weddings or funerals, we’re being told we should have one. How does that make any sense?!?
I laugh at the idea I could ever be considered “right wing”–not that it is any business whatsoever of the United States of Arrogance. My finances are also none of their business.
@twodogs, I don’t speak for everyone here nor for their feelings about the current POTUS. Yet Obama has indeed hurt all US Expats who own bank accounts and who have over aggregate 10K in them, whether or not we all acknowledge it and feel that he has hurt us. This is an objective statement based on facts not feelings.
This website takes as its task to fight against the tax jihad of the United States that has greatly intensified since Obama became president; FATCA has greatly propelled the tax jihad, making the FBAR threats of 383% penalties much less than an idle threat: the IRS will get the information about you directly from your bank, and it will apply steep penalties against you if you have not already joined the OVDP. The OVDP is an abomination.
The OVDP and FATCA are both 100% the result of the Obama administration. FATCA was passed by a democrat-controlled Congress and signed by Obama. OVDP 2009 happened on Obama’s watch. He has done great damage to me, and any other expat who is paying attention. This is the objective reality. This website would not be approaching 1 million hits if it were not the case.
Before February 2012, the United States meant virtually nothing to me, certainly their president and their political parties were of zero interest to me. Now things have changed, and most certainly not for the better. I am being negatively affected by the current government in the United States – and Obama is their leader. I don’t give a crap whether he personally had anything to do with any of this – it’s all happened under his watch, and as top dog of the country, it falls on his shoulders. So, yeah, Obama is hurting me, perhaps not maliciously, but in an indifferent, uncaring, way, as just another inconsequential gnat that’s not worth taking notice of.
My hope is that if enough of us gnats get together and buzz loud enough we’ll reach an annoyance level that Obama and his administration will have to take notice of us. That’s why I’m thankful for this site, otherwise I’d be all alone, tilting at windwills, depending on some antidepressant to get through my days.
@Petros, were you able to roll out the hit counter from the old page to the new one?
Is the 1/4 million hit from when you created the site originally or when you transferred it to Canada?
@Christophe, the hits on the counter on the page is only since I added it, which was a couple days after we started this site–the number is slightly more than google analytics which started about the same time but obviously counts different things (and doesn’t count differnt things). We had 660K hits at the old site. So we are above 900K, and I would imagine, we will hit 1mm in early August.
Yeah, I can relate Now, of course, we’re keeping up with US politics on this issue. Actually I did used to watch CNN sometimes, but I haven’t watched any
US tv since last year because when I relax, I don’t even want to think about the US. Anything US can still trigger upsettedness and depression in me. I really hope that feeling will diminish and evaporate over time.
US meant travelling, friendly people, lots of interesting architecture to photograph, excellent ballet companies, musicians, that kind of stuff. Now it means the country that turned my life into a nightmare. I guess one could say I actually do have a connection to the US … I’m a pawn in its politics.
Any exception disproves a rule. Consider me an exception, I am sure there are others. So ‘Obama has hurt us all’ falls as a blanket assertion.
Any President’s policies will both be beneficial and harmful to any particular group / individual, and so must be weighed in the aggregate. The policies of Obama in getting us out of Iraq and Afghanistan – as opposed to his predecessor – have saved a great may parents their sons and daughters. How shall we value this? Not at all? A black man is elected 40 years after MLK and RFK are shot to death – how shall we value this, in the health of a nation less white each year? The list goes on.
Obama has shown he can think differently. Ending the wars, ending don’t ask don’t tell, supporting gay marriage, increasing drone funding, attempting to tackle health care. You may not agree with his approach on any of these issues. But they show he can approach an issue differently when the both the merits and the politcal situation dictate.
The challenge facing those who are affected by Facta is both existential and political.
– Political, in that the whole game lays in building public awareness, pressure, clarity about the issue. Assuming that it should automatically jump onto Obama’s radar is wishful thinking. It does no good to lambast Obama without that normal political pressure having been built. Until it is built, the issue does not ‘deserve’ his attention – it falls below an enormous plethora of other pressing issues. This is the way issues arise and fight their way on stage in the politcal process.
That process is not a moral process. Issues do not gain attention simply because they are ‘right’.
The Challenge is also Existential – in that like the original colonists, the odds are against a good resolution here – those affected are too few, too scattered – , so existental choices will be necessary for most.
@Twodogs, if you love Obama so much and you don’t blame him for putting you through a nightmare, then I invite you to vote for him. As I said, I’ve a large short position on the US dollar and his lack of budgetary restraint can only help me. Mind you, I don’t believe that Romney will make things better, so in the long run, my short position on the US dollar will be good.
Obama increased drone funding: Great! Now we can all worry about being shot dead by the US government.
Don’t love him. Just see a lot of weakly reasoned arguments here. Case in point: Republican administrations over the past 25 years have run far larger deficits (unfunded wars, tax cuts for the rich) than any democratic administration in the same period.
@Twodogs: Quite frankly, this is not a Republican/Democrat issue. It is not a racial issue. It is not left or right wing issue. It is not Kenya or USA birth issue.
For many of us, the issue is simple: Leave us alone. We have not lived, worked, earned money, saved or invested in US for years or even decades. Some were not born there. A few may have never even been there, but had US citizenship and IRS expectations imposed on them because a parent was born there. Many of us were told we were relinquishing US citizenship decades ago. Our allegiance and our taxes belong to another country.
All I want is for the US to get out of my life “permanently and irrevocably” as they assured me they would 40 years ago.
If the US—under whatever party they choose–wants to dig itself into the ground, so be it. Leave the rest of the world out of it.
@Blaze, wonderful. exactly.
@twodogs, one of my complaints with progressives, you know the types that vote for math dunces like Obama, is that they can’t do math. Obama has already increased the national debt more than Dubya, but I can guess your response, so you don’t have to bother: The Obama deficits are Dubya’s fault. There you have it. The universe is coming to end tomorrow. Women and minorities will be hardest hit.
*@Blaze, Exactly, Leave us alone for God’s Sake..
“Quite frankly, this is not a Republican/Democrat issue. It is not a racial issue. It is not left or right wing issue. It is not Kenya or USA birth issue. “
My point exactly. Which is why all the anti-Obama rhetoric is a waste of energy.
If the same amount of energy had been devoted to media savvy guerrilla actions the cause would be farther along.
math dunce …?
@Two Dogs: It is not anti-Obama rhetoric. It is a stand against the United States of Arrogance once again trying to flex its muscles world-wide. Right now, Obama is leading the US, so the frustration is directed to him and to anyone (i.e. Schumer, Casey. Levin, etc.) who supports this mission to intrude into our normal, honest, law-abiding lives elsewhere.
Leave Us Alone! We don’t belong to the USA!
@twodogs: math dunce is a person who thinks that there are between 57-60 states in the USA. A math dunce proposes a 3.5 trillion dollar budget with a 1.5 trillion dollar deficit and then proposes to cut 200 million. A math dunce thinks that about 10,000 people died in a storm in Kansas when it was about ten people.
Do you need more examples, or will that suffice.
Jeeze you are right. Obama is an idiot. Those three examples make it clear as day. Pity the people, they are blind …
Twodogs said: “Republican administrations over the past 25 years have run far larger deficits (unfunded wars, tax cuts for the rich) than any democratic administration in the same period.” What does that even mean? You didn’t offer proof of your statement. It sounds like a Democrat party talking point. When you consider that you have repeated something that is mathematically unsound, it seems that it is intended for an audience who gets average scores on math tests but scores well on confidence.
Consider this from CBS News: “The National Debt has now increased more during President Obama’s three years and two months in office than it did during 8 years of the George W. Bush presidency.” Obama said he was going to reduce the deficit. Instead, he’s become a biggest spender of them all.
Done chewing this bone with ya brother : – )