The up-to-date database resides in Part 2 (link at the bottom of this page).
Above is a link to data we are compiling on Relinquishments and Renunciations — a work in progress. This corresponds with the Consulate Report Directory (in sticky post below), tracking individual experiences for each Consulate, along with a timeline chart.
Note: We are using numbers instead of blog names for this public posting so there will be no compromise of private information. Your facts will help give a snapshot of relinquishment and renunciation activity and where that occurs.
Please submit information in the comments here (or someone can contact you privately). Thanks for all your help on this.
COMMENTS ARE CLOSED FOR Relinquishment and Renunciation Data (as reported on Isaac Brock), Part 1.
Part 2 is now open for your comments. Thank you.
Thanks, notamused, for the information you’ve provided. What Embassy / Consulate did you renonce at (is it listed in the link, which is the database that we maintain on renunciation and relinquishment experiences reported here)? Let us know your progress and we hope your CLN arrives pronto.
@calgary411 – I’ll be happy to provide more details once I’ve received my CLN, but as the process is not going as smoothly as I had hoped, I’m reluctant to publicize too much at this point.
@notamused,
We understand completely — we are not amused about your situatio either. Good luck. Let us know how it goes for you. Thanks again for the update you provided — all we get here will help others.
@calgary411 – Thanks for your understanding and good wishes! I’ll keep in touch.
*The Toronto consulate is back in business for relinquishments and renunciations. The on-line appointment reservation tool is now offering 14 more appointments for December. In January they now offer 12 days with 16 appointment each, for a total of 192.
Thanks for noting that @AnonAnon, and @All, does it look like there are far more apt slots in January than usual?
*@badger, the fact that appointments are now available in the quantities you have quoted is a good indication that the actual number of citizenship renunciations around the world is probaby several orders of magnitude greater that what is being revealed by these lists of names being published quarterly for those who have renounced.
Thanks, AnonAnon!
@ Badger and all, Toronto is one of the consulates I’ve been particularly tracking the schedule of through this past year. I can’t remember exactly, but my impression is they were in the range of 48 maybe up to 72 per month, something like that. I’m not sure, though, just my impression. I’m going to see if I kept any details of this in my notes. I may have, and will post here if I have. But all those 16 slots per day looks high to me. When I saw AnonAnon post 192, my first thought was, holy crow, I’ve never counted near that high.
Update 8.25pm. I’ve been thinking. I’m pretty sure they used to have 2 appts per quarter-hour, not 4.
@All,
Wow! Has anyone here (besides myself) looked at the appointment calendar for Vancouver. They are presently showing no appointments available (for notarial services) until early May. Does anyone know – is Vancouver a much smaller consulate than Toronto or Calgary. I was sure it would be smaller than Toronto’s but the fact that it covers both B.C. and the Yukon, I did not think it would be that much smaller than Calgary. And yet both Toronto and Calgary offer many appts almost every day. The most appts I have seen in any one day at Vancouver’s consulate (at least for notarial services) is two.
It is now almost one week since it was posted that consulates were all to do relinquishments in one appointment. I was hopeful that I might hear from Vancouver’s consulate. But nothing. I certainly don’t want to ‘pester’ them if that could jeopardize my eventually receiving my CLN.
Tiger:
I too am trying to get an appointment in Vancouver; however, they answer none of my emails, the last sent five days ago. They invited me to try for interview #2 last August and I answered within minutes. Since then, nothing.When I applied for my first interview in May, they answered in one hour and I had that interview in about ten days. What’ ‘s with these people?
Cir*
Hi Tiger,
According to DFAIT, Vancouver has 29 employees – Toronto has 31 – Calgary has 6 (Calgary only seems to list officers).
A very rough indicator of USCs in their respective cachement areas is the number of USCs who register with a consulate (very rough because obviously a lot of USCs don’t register, and a lot of us Brockers wouldn’t have because we weren’t USCs in 1999!) Unfortunately the only year I could find data for is 1999.
But FWIW, in 1999 — 250,000 USCs were registered with Toronto – 200,000 were registered with Vancouver – 105,000 were registered with Calgary.
@All
Further to my comment above, one thing I noticed when I was at the consulate in September, was the very long separate line, outside the consulate for people applying for visas. As most Canadians know, Vancouver has a very large immigrant population from Asian countries, such as, India, China and Korea, and Japan. Vancouver also has many, many Asians studying English at our more than 50 “English as a 2nd Language School’s” in Vancouver. At one time, after my husband died and prior to moving to an apartment, I provided room and board to many of those students from Japan, and Korea. When those students wished to take a short trip to the U.S., as a tourist, they were required to obtain tourist visas from the U.S. consulate. I guess I am now wondering if that is the issue with this consulate having so few appointments available for ‘notarial services’. Certainly the day I was there in September, the waiting room was full of persons applying for Visas to the U.S.
@tiger, @Cir,
It seems impractical to have renunciation and relinquishment appointments within all the other traffic at the Vancouver Consulate.
I did not schedule our Calgary appointments from the Consulate’s website. All my communication was through email.
1) my email to the Calgary US Consulate advising we wanted to schedule appointments;
2) quickly hearing back by email with attachments of documents to read to acquaint ourselves with the seriousness of what we wanted to do, along with a brief questionnaire that they asked be filled and and sent back (from this they had all paperwork ready for today’s appointments) and a tentative date;
3) my acceptance of dates / times and transsending back the questionnaire;
4) confirmation from the Consulate of the date and confirmation of what documentation would be required for the actual appointment; security details, etc.
The whole process was straight forward, good communication back and forth, knowing exactly the reason for the appointment, etc. Simple procedure / good communication on requirements / details — it seemed to all work well.
This needs to be a similar experience for everyone!
Me again, Tiger,
I just went to Vancouver bookings. They’re showing every available timeslot from Nov 19th to May 8th in blue as “fully booked,” and no timeslots available yet from May 8th on.
I can’t recall any consulate in Canada taking bookings six months in advance — that seems weird, like maybe a software problem, but maybe not if they’re only doing 1 or at the most 2 expatriations a day. If the latter, this is grossly unfair! And if so, might be time to take a winter vacation to, say, some Canadian city east of Vancouver.
*Japan is now part of the US Visa Waver program, so Japanese students in Canada shoud now be able to travel for a weekend in the US without obtaining a US visa. Korea and India are not on the list. Taiwanese passport holders have recently been added to the Visa Waver program.
http://travel.state.gov/visa/temp/without/without_1990.html#countries.
@Pacifica
You found exactly what I have seen. As mentioned earlier, I started to access their online booking in August and I have never seen more than 2 appts for notarial services on any given day and of course there were never appts every day.
You are right, it could be time to look at a winter vacation east of Vancouver. I do think that I would need to let Vancouver know that I want the file moved. The last experience I need is to fly somewhere and then have that place tell me, they can’t deal with the issue without the Vancouver consulate being aware of it or something like that.
Hi Tiger,
Doubt it. Sounds like the scene at Toronto with a l-o-n-g line for visas, but you get in in minutes in if you’re on the very short “American Citizens Services” line. I scoped the place out before I actually went to get an idea how early I’d need to show up. No line for ACS either time. ACS is a separate department. Lots of foreigners in Toronto, too, with several universities and a large percentage of TOs population being foreign-born.
@Roger
Thanks for that info. I read recently that the majority of the ‘foreign students’ in Vancouver today are from mainland China and Korea. Back in the 90’s, when I was providing room and board to students, the majority were from Japan and Korea.
@Pacifica
Back in September when I went through the ordeal of that first appointment, I mentioned that I thought the consulate was completely inefficient. Why would they even require 2 appts for a ‘long ago’ relinquishment. I am now convinced. It sounds like Toronto and Calgary have it figured out.
@ Tiger,
Halifax also runs their ship very efficiently and with excellent customer service. We’ve got several reports from there, all very positive. They even phoned a Brocker last winter to say, “We’ve got a cancellation. Would you like to have an earlier appointment?”
I don’t know why Ottawa and Vancouver are the way they are. They are certainly not doing the country they represent any favours, just giving a poor, and sometimes very bad, impression of it.
I’ve said it before, “I walked out of the Toronto Consulate feeling positive about the US, and that’s pretty impressive after living with this mess all these months.”
*Korea is now also on the list of US Visa Waver Countries. I missed it when I first read the list because it is listed as South Korea. So South Korean students studying in Vancouver should be able to enter the US for a weekend with their valid South Korean passports. No visa required.
@Roger, yes that is what I was thinking too about the # of apts. set aside at the Toronto consulate – that the increase in slots will surely indicate increase in demand, and also continue to more starkly underline and highlight the discrepancies in the number of names on the Register – as more and more are able to be processed.
*badger, so, more renunciations are being processed and less is being reported. Sounds like something is being hidden. What is the government trying to hide? What does it fear? How can one be afraid of reporting something as simple as an innocent renunciation? My bet is that the American expat is voting with the renunciation, making a difference and being noticed while being repressed, since their vote is not supposed to count.
I have read the different reports here from individuals who receive no response from the consulates to their email enquiries. While it was relatively easy to obtain the first appointment here in Sweden, I am not getting anywhere when it comes to the second appointment. I have sent reminders to the embassy but receive no more than the automatically generated receipt which is sent out in response to all of their incoming mails. Perhaps I am being paranoid but it seems that they are stalling now that I have confirmed my decision to renounce. It is very frustrating and I am wondering to whom I can complain and if it will help anything. Has anyone here ever complained to the Consul General or to the State Department? If you complained to the State Department, where did you send your complaint?
@Roger – On Nov 11 you asked me how long ago I received my CLN and commented: “We have not been able to figure out whether there is an intentional
or uninteentional delay in the publishing of renunciants names in the
Federal Register, or whether there is deliberate action, for whatever
reason, to not report some names at all. It is a question to which
nobody as yet been able to supply an answer.”
Roger, in browsing through Phil Hodgen’s Blog today I stumbled upon the following and it might possibly explain why there is a delay, at least with some of the names:
“by Phil Hodgen on April 28th, 2012:
I think the explanation for the omissions is in the careful wording at the top of the list:
This notice is provided in accordance with IRC section 6039G of the Health Insurance Portability and Accountability Act (HIPPA) of 1996, as amended. This listing contains the name of each individual losing United States citizenship (within the meaning of section 877(a) or 877A) with respect to whom the Secretary received information during the quarter ending March 31, 2012. For purposes of this listing, long-term residents, as defined in section 877(e)(2), are treated as if they were citizens of the United States who lost citizenship.
The emphasized text tells it all. This is the list people that the Secretary (of the Treasury) heard about in January, February, and March of 2012. It is not the list of people who actually terminated their citizenship or green cards in the first quarter.
I happen to know several people who pulled the plug in Q1 of 2012. They are our clients. They won’t file their final tax returns–with Form 8854 attached–until sometime in 2013. Filing tax returns is the way you notify the Secretary of the Treasury of anything tax-related.
So even though our clients are former citizens at this time, the much-maligned Treasury Secretary legitimately has no clue about these people. And he won’t know until next year. Therefore they are not on this list.”