FATCA Discussion Thread (Ask your questions) Part Two
Please ask your questions here about FATCA.
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NB: This discussion is a continuation of an older discussion that became too large for our software to handle well. See FATCA Discussion Thread (Ask your questions) for earlier discussion.
@Badger
I signed Elizabeh May’s petition earlier last week.
I noticed at the Florida pdf
on chart.
Canada Imminent
@ badger
Thank you for posting that. I signed it a day or so ago but I didn’t think of putting it up on Brock. We have to make sure our best and steadiest advocate can do her job unimpeded. Something tells me Ms. May gets under some people’s skin on the Hill and good for her! I just got a notice that she wants us to send a letter to the Access to Information, Privacy and Ethics committee and I will do that too.
http://www.greenparty.ca/write-the-committee?utm_campaign=C13.ECL&utm_source=massmail&utm_medium=email
Oh, I should have mentioned that committee is meeting tomorrow to vote on Harper’s harpoon aimed at the Green Party and Independents — November 5th (Guy Fawkes Day for some countries).
@Em
I sent the letter. and I was in England last Guy Fawkes day. And I have V, the dvd
@ northernstar
So, another V fan! There’s all kinds of instructions on the internet on how to make a Guy Fawkes mask, if anyone should ever be so inclined. Ms. May has such an efficient office machinery set up compared to our other MPs. Sometimes it seems like I get a response on my e-mails before I even press SEND. 🙂
ok, this one is off to 2 Senators and one Representative. I am fortunate to be registered in the state with the least inhabitants, and hence I receive responses from the offices of the Senators however never receive an answer from my rep. I’ve given them one sound bite to keep.
—————————————————————
I would like to give you an update on how Americans like myself have handled the application of FATCA, the FBAR Foreign Bank Account Reporting Form, and the general concept where USA uniquely taxes its citizens anywhere in the Milky Way, in contrast from any other country who only taxes the people that live in their country and use their services. Here are the types of things that Americans do:
–Remove “US citizen” from Linked in profiles and resumes. Most international corporations realize that such a person brings extra-ordinary expenses for tax compliance and additional risks for financial spying such as what is required with FBAR and 8938 forms. Most US persons realize that such a label increases their chances of being singled out by FATCA reporting and also by NSA spying.
–Minimize contacts with their local bankers. No US person wants their local banker to hear their accent that they are Americans. If they should hear an American accent, they will be identified (KPMG & PWC –call it “due diligence”), and subjected to account closure and or extensiveIRS & FinCen reporting regimes.
–Eliminate consideration of working in the prosperous and politically important middle east regions.
Americans and individuals from Wyoming do not fare well in these regions, as all of their income is sequestered by the IRS in its incorrect usage of citizen-based taxation and ineffective tax credits. Therfore, eliminate any Wyoming influence and boots-on-the-ground presence for US and Wyoming products and services.
–Eliminate business ventures. With more than 700 hrs of reporting with such forms as IRS form 3520 and all other related forms, an American-by-birth would need to work a half man-year to fill out personal IRS forms.
–Eliminate contact with US suppliers and US franchises, such as Wyoming well intervention or reservoir-analysis services. These are poison. Selling US goods and being identified as a representative of USA will bring the full reign of the IRS and all of the other 3-letter USA agencies upon one’s self.
So, what is the result for USA? Whereas countries like Germany and Denmark encourage their citizens to prosper throughout the world and hence have huge trade surpluses, USA assumes all US persons are guilty-til-proven-innocent tax evaders. USA has had a trade deficit since 1976, when the first attacks with US dual-taxation upon its citizens began (reference multiple Roger Conklin submissions to Ways and Means over the years).
I am fully aware that Max Baucuc & his honchos will not only ignore the logical advice of eliminating citizenship-based taxation, but will also push to eliminate the Foreign Earned Income Exclusion. I am fully aware that his and other’s stance will be used to feed the masses without consideration of the US interest in a trade surplus. I am fully aware that your understanding is stifled by the illogical rhetoric necessary to quell the masses.
However, if you have a true interest in the success of Wyoming and the success of USA in the international marketplace, you will come to realize that support of US citizens and US persons wherever they live is a method of exponentially increasing the wealth of those who are able to remain in the homeland. It’s your understanding of these issues that is critical—Wyoming has the advantage that its legislators have the ability to think logically for a controlled number of constituents.
If you remember nothing else, remember that what is good for people from Wyoming is good for people in Wyoming.
I’ve given you my situation—multiply my situation by 7 million—the number of US citizens who had once believed that they should be working as a team with USA to promote US products and services. What can you do to help improve the lot of US persons and to help improve the situation of US Citizens and thusly to improve the US trade balance?
@Mark Twain,
Excellent.letter..Money talks ..Losing out for a draconian law would be folly. Did you send it to Dick Cheney?
You didn’t mention that many US Ex Pats have little choice but to give up citizenship.
Interesting you mentioned speaking as little as possible due to accents to not be identified as American. I still sound like Carmela Soprano….after all these years in Canada.
I like your letter. Money is a kicker and loss of it it is not welcome…Great letter
@ Mark Twain
You are so on a roll! You even sent a missive into the land of the Dark Lord, Cheney. Well done!
workin’ on it.
@ All
I got another e-mail from the radio host I mentioned above (November 3, 2013 at 2:39 pm). He’s a very busy fellow who has done over 3000 interviews. I sent him contact information for James Jatras … now we see what happens.
Another e-mail with these words, “I’ll get on it.” I am a very happy person tonight. 🙂
@Em
Great news. I hope it turns out well. My excitement was tweaked earlier this week with another journalist. I provided the info and contact but no word yet.
Two FATCA tidbits extracted from articles:
1.
http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20131106/business/business3.html
……..””This overarching FATCA law will strengthen the existing legislation for various sectors as concerns issues of privacy and constitutional rights in order to protect institutions from prosecution by clients when seeking to comply with FATCA,” Sykes said in a presentation delivered on behalf of BOJ senior deputy governor Myrtle Halsall.”….
NOTE this: “in order to protect institutions from prosecution by clients”
Thus a government (in this case Jamaica) deliberately re-designing their laws to accommodate FATCA – AND, officially blocking avenues of recourse if errors are made, and accountholders suffer under FATCA as applied by the banks/FFIs? Expect that other governments (Canada?) have thought of this – or had it thought of for them and lobbied for by the banks and FIs (ex. CBA) that are manipulating things behind the scenes to shift as much burden, cost and liability as possible onto their home governments, ALL accountholders and ALL fellow citizens/residents/taxpayers. What a thin veneer of faux democracy – even for those few who could possibly try to mount a legal challenge of an error made by their financial institution.
2. Example of expansion of the definition of “US person” for US tax purposes;
See; http://www.jdsupra.com/legalnews/treasury-and-irs-move-to-implement-fatc-71387/
….”.. Modify the definition of U.S. person to include a foreign insurance company that is not a specified insurance company and that elects to be subject to U.S. income tax as if it were a U.S. insurance company….”
Another FATCA tidbit – from a Saudi paper:
from http://www.saudigazette.com.sa/index.cfm?method=home.regcon&contentid=20131106185812
…”It can be argued that FATCA is just the beginning of a global phenomenon where every government might also require its foreign citizens to be monitored for their income.”…”…
Another BS pro-FATCA claim http://www.jolpress.com/fatca-etats-unis-evasion-fiscale-europe-ecofin-article-818842.html that made-in-the-US-for-American-benefit law is the necessary precursor/prerequisite for implementing an EU equivalent. Without noting that the US is NOT likely to provide any equivalent reciprocal information, and that since the EU countries in a broad sense tax not on citizenship, but on residence – they do not need to bend over for FATCA in order to come up with a Made-in-the-EU-for-EU-benefit solution.
The French original, “……Côté européen, deux étapes sont envisageables : la première consiste à encourager la coopération avec le fisc américain, comme préalable à l’instauration d’une FATCA européen.”
In translation the article concludes:
…”…European side, two steps are possible: the first is to encourage cooperation with the IRS as a prerequisite for the establishment of a European FATCA.”
Connection of FATCA with datamining on a global scale:
In translation the article concludes;
…”From current accounts to portfolio management, the trust-based relationships with credit cards, the transactions account to the extra-safe no more escape the Eye of the Treasury. A wealth of information even wider than that FATCA will power the U.S. and the European platform on which, in the era of “Datagate”, we must watch very carefully. ”
from http://www.ilsole24ore.com/art/notizie/2013-06-19/apre-immensi-database-tasse-063919.shtml?uuid=AbpGUH6H
‘Si apre l’era degli immensi database delle tasse’
19 giugno 2013
@Badger, and to think that apologist in the States deny a GATCA is in the making. These guys should do more than just watch very carefully, they should be raising the alarm!
@Em, Badger
It wasn’t so long ago that we felt we were voices in the wilderness – now we’re being approached by journalists on a regular basis – and although FATCA’s still far from front page, we’re seeing new coverage on a daily basis (and not only the FCC kind). Progress?
I wonder how many journalists are waiting on those overdue ‘name and shame’ numbers?
@Just Me, they’ll protest when the GATCA applies to them. Or just rely on US domestic opposition and abroad, US might to resist. Just like US representatives to an OECD event in France this summer pooh poohed non-US concerns about utter lack of transparency of the true beneficial ownerships of US incorporated entities, ex. “…Stiff opposition by state secretaries of state, whose offices derive substantial revenue from incorporation and maintenance fees, and business groups have combined to kill the bill in past years. The bill has yet to be reported out of committee in the three terms of Congress and has been introduced.” see http://www.acfcs.org/fatcas-crucial-sidekick-the-hunt-for-beneficial-owner-pushed-as-g20-nations-senior-us-senators-urge-action/ The revenue of whole states like VP Biden’s Delaware http://www.theglobalist.com/bidens-delaware-making-swiss-banking-look-hyper-clean/ , and Nevada are built on providing secret incorporation http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/09/26/us-shell-games-nevada-idUSTRE78P1Y020110926
See Wikipedia entry on Delaware and the importance of secret incorporation services to its economy:
“More than 50% of all U.S. publicly traded companies and 63% of the Fortune 500 are incorporated in Delaware.[39] The state’s attractiveness as a corporate haven is largely because of its business-friendly corporation law. Franchise taxes on Delaware corporations supply about one-fifth of its state revenue.[40] Although “USA (Delaware)” ranked as the world’s most opaque jurisdiction on the Tax Justice Network’s 2009 Financial Secrecy Index,[41] the same group’s 2011 Index ranks the USA fifth and does not specify Delaware.[42]”
On the topic of US income, US taxes and VP Biden in Delaware; http://p.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/nov/4/despite-sequester-rent-checks-still-flowing-to-bid/
This just came up on Lunked-In, during an Exchange about FATCA
Thank you for this link to the Foreign Ministry press release. In the original text, there is a strong undertow that ‘nothing new is happening here (Russia) … we’ve been talking with the Americans about government-to-government exchanges of relevant citizen taxpayer information – as equals, mind you – for a long time already.’ (Russians are extremely good at spin and at using tendentious language.)
On a broader plane, the Russian and Chinese central banks and finance ministries have in effect coordinated their positions vis-à-vis FATCA compliance. The Sino-Soviet Party line is: Nyet to FATCA, but we are prepared to consider entering into mutual exchange regimes for information on taxpayers living in the reciprocal country.
Toward this end, on 27 August 2013 China acceded to the OECD Multilateral Convention on Mutual Administrative Assistance in Tax Matters, a step that China had long resisted. This was widely interpreted as a gesture of flexibility – of Beijing’s willingness to consider committing to a FATCA-esque bilateral taxpayer information exchange mechanism.
By Vladimir B
———–
I Think the text means Russia giving info on Americans living in America, let’s see how it plays out.
Another blog recognizes that FATCA makes partnering with a ‘US person’ undesirable:
http://able2know.org/topic/226239-1
..”Btw I’d think tough before starting any business with Americans.”…
and concludes;
“…Who’s to pay the bill, I wonder? Try to guess just.”
The IIAC trumpets its advocacy for Canada to sign on to a FATCA IGA as one of its ‘mission’ ‘successes’ for 2012/2013
iiac.ca/wp-content/uploads/IIAC-2013-Member-Kit.pdf
…”FATCA
• IIAC efforts lead the U.S. Treasury to name Canada a jurisdiction with which it hopes to conclude negotiations by year-end 2012 on a
government-to-government approach to meeting FATCA requirements”…
What if we shift all of our Canadian registered savings to Canadian credit unions in protest? See page 5 for the IIAC member list.
The IIAC says this is the amount of our registered savings it handles:
THE CANADIAN INVESTMENT INDUSTRY
Helping Canadians Grow
• Investment dealers help manage $1 trillion for Canadians — an amount that has increased by 20 per cent over the past five years —
including:
> $280 billion in registered retirement savings plans (RRSPs).
> Over $65 billion in registered retirement income funds (RRIFs).
> $5 billion in registered education savings plans (RESPs)
> $13 billion in Tax Free Savings Accounts (TFSAs
@badger
doesn’t that mean small credit unions?
I don’t think mine is that small.
I wondered about Canada Savings Bond RRSPs..I have a small established account and thought of transferring some of my big bank RRSP to CSB RRSP…As long as you have established account you can do this with RRSP transfer. You can’t establish a New CSB RRSP account.
@badger,
Are you suggesting finding credit unions that are not IIAC members?
Is there any indication that they can ignore FATCA?
Northernstar: repeat after me…. RRSPs exempt from FATCA.
@northernstar, I don’t know if Canadian credit unions will be exempted from FATCA – and though perhaps the small ones will, the US can always change that. So I am only saying that our credit unions are not rubbing their hands in glee and celebrating a FATCA IGA prospect like the IIAC is obviously doing.
I refuse to reward any IIAC with my assets EVEN if all credit unions are forced to bow down to FATCA as well.
I don’t have to park my assets with an organization whose members consider a FATCA IGA to be one of their ‘mission’ successes.
There may be assets which cannot be moved, or ones which would cause significant tax harm and complications if they were dissolved now, but I am just saying, if it can be done, then why not consider it?
And I think the suggestion of a boycott, on signs outside the Banking and Compliance conventions will certainly capture the interest of all the CBA and IIAC members attending. We want them to know that we are aware of their secret lobbying behind the scenes against the best interests of all accountholders and all Canadian citizens and residents.
All accountholders will bear the costs of implementing FATCA and ALL Canadian taxpayers will foot the bill to put it into place and forever maintain it in Canada.
And the IIAC and CBA as FATCA collaborators know that. They just want to get on with making profits – no matter how much the bill or threat is for the rest of us.
We don’t have to help them willingly, and we don’t have to reward them with our business willingly.