FATCA Discussion Thread (Ask your questions) Part Two
Please ask your questions here about FATCA.
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NB: This discussion is a continuation of an older discussion that became too large for our software to handle well. See FATCA Discussion Thread (Ask your questions) for earlier discussion.
Yep, so they are probably going to end up being taxed twice because of ignorance.
Senior Deputy Governor of the Bank of Jamaica proposes a reverse FATCA ‘countermove’ re Jamaican nationals in the US.
http://afroedge.com/latest-news/lets-do-the-reverse-of-fatca-for-jamaica-halsall
James Jatras discusses FATCA and its effect on Israelis and American duals
How U.S. Tax Laws Affect American-Israelis.
http://www.israelnationalnews.com/Radio/News.aspx/4823#.UgA1IayLWkc
I haven’t listened to it, but am providing link for those interested.
“IRS sees the use of FACTA as helping in its compliance effort as the ‘new gold mine’ where billions will be extracted easily and the consequence of non-compliance may very well be a person’s worst financial sin.”
http://jamaica-gleaner.com/gleaner/20130807/lead/lead7.html
well, I guess it is almost over. FATCA should be ready by the time Obummer arrives.
http://www.thelocal.se/49510/20130807/
@Mark Twain
It’s remarkable that Obama would choose to engage in international diplomacy on a talk show with a comedian, but then he is the Hollywood president. For all Harper is, I believe he has enough respect for the Canadian people and his office not to do such a thing.
@Mark Twain,
from the article you linked to about Obama’s upcoming visit to Sweden:
http://www.thelocal.se/49510/20130807/
“…The first, and so far last, time a US president visited Sweden was during the 2001 EU-US summit in Gothenburg, but George W. Bush and his fellow world leaders sparked extensive rioting across the western city – leading the police to detain almost 700 people and to shoot several demonstrators….”
Sounds like the US could use some ‘goodwill ambassadors’ in Sweden.
FATCA isn’t winning the US any US citizen or other friends abroad. Way to antagonize your own citizens AND their non-US families.
Where is that cost/benefit analysis? What will be the actual real world pricetag for FATCA – in dollars and in diplomacy?
‘US and Japanese issues statement on FATCA
08 Aug, 2013 12:52 ‘
http://www.finextra.com/Community/FullBlog.aspx?blogid=8014
On the FATCA and FBAR interrelationship;
http://www.acfcs.org/do-you-think-fatca-affected-the-number-of-fbars-filed-how-about-doubling-them/
http://www.acfcs.org/fincen-opens-new-route-to-file-fbars-as-fatca-dragnet-for-same-foreign-accounts-nears/
Commentary on issues raised by FATCA’s delay:
http://tax.org/taxcom/taxblog.nsf/Permalink/JSCT-9A3LWD?OpenDocument
July 29, 2013 12:21 PM EDT
‘The Power to Delay’
by Jeremy Scott
“…Treasury and the IRS have appropriated to themselves the power to delay legislation. By broadly interpreting its authority to promulgate regulations, Treasury has twice in recent days decided that it could simply ignore a statutorily set implementation date. It should disturb observers that the two pieces of legislation that the executive branch is delaying just happen to be two of the most controversial pieces of legislation Congress has passed in the last few years: the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act and the Affordable Care Act. …”
This looks interesting, but only some will have fulltext access.
Alberto Gil Soriano, ‘Toward an Automatic but Asymmetric Exchange of Tax Information: the US Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA) as Inflection Point’ (2012) 40 Intertax, Issue 10, pp. 540–555
“This article describes the most recent trends in the field of the international exchange of tax information and also pretends to guess whether the initiatives taken have lead to a more neutral, fair and homogenous global tax system. In particular it analyses the current OECD policy on international exchange of tax information, made under request and the recent international provisions setting up new mechanisms of automatic exchange of that information, either unilateral or bilateral. It also focuses on the new US Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA), the subsequent Joint Statement made by the US Treasury and five European Countries and whether it represents an inflection point in the US and world policies of international exchange of tax information.”
Copyright © 2012 Kluwer Law International
All rights reserved
ISSN: 0165-2826
ID: TAXI2012054
The abstract wording is odd re; “pretends to guess…”
Article was cited in footnote FN41, “[FN41] Unless institutions have a specific clause in the terms of business they have signed with their existing clients, it is not possible to hand over information to the IRS, in so far as the Data Protection Directive (Directive 95/46/EC, OJ L 281 of November 23, 1995, pp. 3150) prohibits transferring personal data to other entities without the explicit consent of the data subject. Moreover, if a financial institution breaches a contract without a contractual right, then they run the risk of legal action by the client for reinstatement of the contract and damages and sanctions by regulators. See Alberto Gil Soriano, Towards an Automatic but Asymmetric Exchange of Tax Information: the U.S. Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA) as Inflection Point, Intertax, 40:10 (2012) at p.553.”
from here:
http://web2.westlaw.com/expo/linkviewer.wl?VR=2.0&SV=Split&FN=_top&MT=Tax&RD=TAX&standalone=Y&rs=ACAN2.0&vr
See also footnote; “[FN43] For details about the Proposed Regulations, the corresponding concerns, and the G5 Framework, see Albert Gil Soriano & William H. Byrnes, FATCAs February 2012 Proposed Regulations with Softened Compliance: Carrots But Mostly Sticks, in Mertens Law of Federal Income Tax Developments & Highlights 8-21 (Thomson-West Mar. 2012).”
Thanks for another find, badger.
How can any initiatives taken lead to a neutral, fair, homogenous global tax system the way countries’ tax systems now stand? Mixing Citizenship-Based Taxation with Residence-Based Taxation does not give a level playing field — it mixes apples and oranges. Let’s at least have every country at the same starting point. Then ask if initiatives that can be taken can lead to a neutral, fair, homogenous global tax system.
“”If my co-workers knew that I was American, I would most likely lose my job,” my friend, whose mother and father hail from Wyoming and British Colombia respectively, said to me one day.
I expect I rolled my eyes in response, assuming such a statement to be nothing but further proof of my friend’s penchant for exaggeration. After all, he was a bank employee not in Iran or Cuba but in expat-friendly Geneva, Switzerland.
One week later, however, I received a letter informing me that my own Swiss bank account, which I had used throughout my eight years of working in Geneva, was being closed for the simple fact that I was an American citizen…
…While it may not be within Congress’ mandate to protect expats’ interests from FATCA, though, it is something that they should be doing; for the legislation is equally damaging to the relations and interests of the United States as a country. By enforcing FATCA, the US fulfills its worst stereotypes, giving credence to those that would portray us as a hypocritical bully on the world stage.
When I speak with my friend who is fearful to mention his American nationality at work, I feel angry at such blatant discrimination. My first recourse in such a situation would be to turn to the U.S. government for support, to my guarantor of rights.
Americans the world over are looking to Congress to put in place a fairer and more effective means of curbing tax evasion. Let’s hope Washington listens.”
http://washingtonexaminer.com/fatca-and-the-american-expat-taxation-without-representation/article/2534065
The not-so-factual facts on FATCA:
http://www.bangkokpost.com/news/investigation/362929/the-facts-on-fatca
The latest policty laundering–this is the EU version, Jack Lew ought to be freshening up USA’s plan for capital Controls under the guidance of Obamifart . New EU rules for what happens when the banks fail:
“New EU rule savers need to fear credit under 100,000 euros”
“In the case of bankruptcy of the bank also those customers will get massive problems for which the balance to be guaranteed by the official deposit insurance. The current EU proposal provides that customers can withdraw a maximum of only 100 to 200 euro in case of a collapse of its banking daily. This state may last for up to three weeks. Anyone planning major purchases should think in time, as he will get his money.
Largely unnoticed by the public, the EU is pushing forward the concrete steps in the event of a banking collapse. A few weeks ago it was decided to carry out banking bailouts surprise attack on a weekend (here) and savers over 100,000 euros and shareholders and holders of bonds with a compulsory levy on the banking bailout to participate (here).
Now the Lithuanian Presidency presented the first details of how a bank bailout will actually look like.
It is extremely unpleasant for those savers who now predominate because of the deposit insurance in safety and believe it will only make “the rich”, ie those investors who have more than 100,000 euros.
The Lithuanian proposal shows that if a bank goes bankrupt, get the small depositors their money not immediately. Up to four weeks – 20 working days – the savers will have to make do with just the bare necessities: You may withdraw 100 to 200 euros a day – no more. The EU Council under the direction of your chosen anyone in Europe President Herman Van Rompuy originally had proposed to let the saver wait four weeks for their money.
The Parliament was then but this time a little long, demanding deposits of 100,000 euros should be paid within five days.
However, because the technology is not possible – no bank has so much real money – is the compromise now look like this: 20 days wait for that you get daily 100 to a maximum of 200 Euros from the ATM.
Three weeks should fear it, as the stock market newspaper quoted from the paper to be up to 2020 for the case in which national supervisors arrive to the conclusion that it does not go faster. In the event that the supervisory authorities have some understanding with the investor or the investor recruit mostly of armed Russians, it will be faster: first 15, then 10 and finally in 2023 seven working days.
In fact, this development means that even those savers who today rely blindly on the commitment of Angela Merkel and Wolfgang Schäuble, that deposits of 100,000 euros are sure to have to tremble or beg their savings. If they want to keep their money actually in hand, need it, or run a business, the nature of higher spending than 100 euros a day for major purchases – then these savers should consider before, as in the case of a crash of their bank to their money will come.
The current plan shows that in the event of a banking collapse, no one will be able to rely on government commitments. Actually always be “exceptional circumstances” can lead to the savers can also be subject to a penalty tax if they have less than € 100,000 in the bank.
The Germans, this issue wisely nor denied: The governor of the Lithuanian Central Bank, Vitas Vasiliauskas, told the Reuters news agency that he was aware that the parliamentary elections could delay the process somewhat. But the banks’ Union was “the EU a super-priority”.
There is still no agreement on the question of the contribution of banks to pay into the deposit insurance. Here, the EU argues primarily about who calculated the risk presented by the individual banks and the amount of which depends on the post. Here is a remarkable intensification of officials was brought into the document: The contribution “is” now depend on the hazard, while it was said earlier, the contribution “may” be based on the risk.
Be calculated that the contribution to the risk of not “must”, as common sense would suggest, is because that national governments will in future be excluded from the calculation of risk. The banks want to control the risks with each other and can therefore set by the European Banking Supervision EBA – that institution that the Belgian Dexia was awarded in a “stress” test as a particularly trustworthy Institute a few months before its spectacular crash.
The EU’s plans for the first European bank failures in the age of derivatives and turbo boil down speculation that the crash especially for small investors and savers an existential stress test. For indeed, there are three weeks of dithering, especially for older citizens who have their savings in the bank, a disaster. The failure of a bank is a very grueling process for savers – According to the EU proposal, savers will now have to wait for weeks until they can be sure if they will ever see their money.
The EU intends to adopt the Banking Union later this year in the most important details.
It will be tight for the savers.
And, as we now know, not only for the rich.”
But they better hurry.
http://deutsche-wirtschafts-nachrichten.de/2013/08/07/neue-eu-regel-sparer-muessen-um-guthaben-unter-100-000-euro-bangen/?inf_contact_key=2dbbd4cf3f4f2b28ea967f1e781100b737111d702fe1ea470c4ddd12314ce951
The 2001 meeting in Goteborg was a real hoot. As a first, I happened to be Walking home from the train station as the Bush cavalcade came by —quite small prior to the feerdom necessary after 9-11, only about 8 cars. I then proceeded un noticed through Town on a back street and found myself inside the blocked off Square, in the middle. I had to come up the main street, and knock on a cop’s shoulder to let me out through the blockade — which caused him a bit of bewilderment.
The next Days in Goteborg were an exercise of cluelessness. The police had pretty much gotten their training by watching TV. The rioters with hoods had traveled in from everywhere. The local kids had traveled in and were sleeping in a school.
Bands of blackhooders periodically gathered and struck with the paving stones upon the police, then retreated, regrouped, and showed up elsewhere. The police who had been brought in from the countryside were totally unprepared. Horses were driven into the crowds, who responded with barrages of paving stones. McDonalds got wasted by stones.
There are edited videos by the police, where supposedly a blackhooder had cornered a cop on the ground. Actually, he was retreating and had gotten shot in the stomach, whilst a number of bullets whizzed by others heads.
The day after, the police reined in on the school and rounded up the students for an overnight in the Gulag.
MEanwhile, the administrators of my Company had locked themselves in the basement of the office which was addressed #1 on the Aveny, the main drag, where all the action was.
They will have learned their lesson, will have changed their tactics, and SAPO and CIA will have Everything locked down appropriately when he arrives. The Nobel Prize Winner will again be able to remind us that War is indeed Peace and we shall all be feerer and safer when the global elites are all reigned in.
Perhaps the safest thing to do is to invest in gold and silver rather than the stockmarket or savings in the bank, or at least diversify
Perhaps the safest thing to do is to invest in gold and silver rather than the stockmarket or savings in the bank, or at least diversify one’s investments.
Yesterday, a UK guy told me that UK does not allow ownership of more than 20,000 GBP gold. However, there is not a restriction upon currency such as Krugerands or Liberty Dollars or Australian or whatever gold coins. I had Always wondered why coins were still so intensely popular.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/fatca-and-the-american-expat-taxation-without-representation/article/2534065
‘FATCA and the American expat: Taxation without representation’
By Robert Held | AUGUST 9, 2013 AT 9:45 AM
“,,,If all members of Congress were aware of the full consequences of FATCA, it is unlikely that the bill would have passed the House. The reason few representatives leapt to defend the interests of American expats is that there is no congressman elected to represent the interests of American expats. Americans living abroad are only permitted to vote in Presidential elections.
While it may not be within Congress’ mandate to protect expats’ interests from FATCA, though, it is something that they should be doing; for the legislation is equally damaging to the relations and interests of the United States as a country. By enforcing FATCA, the US fulfills its worst stereotypes, giving credence to those that would portray us as a hypocritical bully on the world stage.
When I speak with my friend who is fearful to mention his American nationality at work, I feel angry at such blatant discrimination. My first recourse in such a situation would be to turn to the U.S. government for support, to my guarantor of rights.
Americans the world over are looking to Congress to put in place a fairer and more effective means of curbing tax evasion. Let’s hope Washington listens.
Robert Held is a financial consultant currently based in Geneva, Switzerland…”
Could those who are under the FATCA situation put their money in ounces of gold and or gold and silver coins without a FATCA penalty?
Sorry administrators, re http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/fatca/comment-page-37/#comment-482420 I see that bubblebustin has already posted the same link to the Washington Examiner letter. Can you delete mine, which is a duplicate?
http://www.moodystax.com/trick-or-treaty-are-canadians-next-as-irs-takes-historic-first-step/
@NORTHERNSTAR “could have put their savings into gold”, I assume the answer is yes as I have seen nothing else indicating no. One should have been doing it for the last 6 yrs, but it ought to be hard to get caught going backwards. I believe the requirements upon the banks used to be from 1 Jan 2013 to be identifying all over $50,000 but I believe that that has been pushed til Jan 1, 2014. So, the FATCA dragnet is required to find people with more than $50,000 after that date. However, there doesn’t seem to be a requirement that they cannot report ANY suspected US person with ANY amount.
On June 30, 2014 one is supposed to self-declare FBARs for income year 2013 and also one is supposed to self declare form 8938.
Look at the history of gold and the discussions of gold and the 3% spread and think about it all. I assume capital gains on its sale should also be self-reported.
One also needs to consider if one can eliminate the cash bound up in retirement accounts, which can be more than the 50,000 barriers.
People in the worst situation are those who bought at the gold height in April.
Here comes the awaited jailing of Bitcoin participants and confiscation of assets.
“State and federal officials are starting broad investigations into shortcomings in the oversight of upstart virtual currencies like bitcoin.
The Senate’s committee on homeland security sent a letter this week to the major financial regulators and law enforcement agencies asking about the “threats and risks related to virtual currency.” These currencies, whose popularity has grown in recent years, are often used in online transactions that are not monitored by traditional financial institutions.
“This is something that is clearly not going away, and it demands a whole government response,” said a person involved in the Senate committee’s investigation, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because the inquiry is…
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2013/08/13/officials-broaden-inquiries-into-oversight-of-bitcoin-and-other-currencies/?nl=todaysheadlines&emc=edit_th_20130814