Consulate Report Directory (Brockers Describe their Consulate Meetings) and CLN Delivery Time Chart Part 2
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Wonder what really happens at the consulates? Find out in the Isaac Brock Society’s Consulate Report Directory, currently 279 pages of first-hand accounts of renunciation/relinquishment appointments, arranged by consulate location, along with further information and links to the required Dept of State forms and the Dept of State manuals used by the consulates in processing CLN applications, with an appendix containing a timeline chart (booking-meeting-CLN) as reported by consulate location.
The Directory is updated as consulate visit stories are posted on the website.
You can post here or elsewhere on the site (we’ll keep an eye out for them). Some comments may be excerpted or condensed slightly in the consulate reports. The original posts and comments remain on their threads are not edited.
Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences…and keep ’em coming! It’s a new experience for everyone and your information is really helpful.
To change or delete your report in the Directory, you can post the change as a comment on this thread or e-mail Pacifica@isaacbrocksociety.ca
Click here for the Consulate Report Directory
Notes:
Consulates are listed alphabetically by country and the Directory’s table of contents links to each section (they don’t look like links, but they are.)
This thread is a continuation of Consulate Report Directory Part 1, which contains earlier discussion on this topic, 929 comments from its inception in March 2012 through February 2013.
To Book an Appointment and/or Request Information from your Local Consulate:
This post by Eric, Almost No US Citizenship Renunciation Appointments Left During 2016 in Dublin, contains a chart of links to the consulates’ website pages on renunciation/relinquishment, for info on booking appointments and/or requesting information at your location. (The title highlights Dublin, but the charts, article and discussion cover consulates around the world.)
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@lagoon,
Congratulations. It sounds like all went well and confirms the professionalism of the Calgary Consulate.
Congrats, lagoon – you must feel as light as a feather now!
I’m hoping to renounce in the not too distant future. I’ve read some negative comments concerning the Vancouver Consulate and even though it is located very close to me and wondering if I should go through the Calgary Consulate despite the fact it represents an additional cost in money and time.
Can anyone hazard an opinion on this? Once I submit my renunciation request, am I likely to experience a significantly longer delay with Vancouver vs Calgary? Any advice/opinion/etc welcome.
TIA
Congratulations on your CLN, Medea! It sounds especially hard to live a normal life in Switzerland without one, so it must be a double sense of relief to have it in your hands. Thanks for sharing your story and providing details of your experience at Bern Consulate, which sounds like a very positive place to deal with. Enjoy your freedom!
Congratulations, Lagoon!
A shame you had to travel so far, but great to now be over and done with it. Thanks very much for posting your very detailed report. Calgary sounds like an excellent consulate to deal with. Glad to hear you had a very positive experience and hope you get your CLN soon!
Re:
It seems logical they would read it, eh, given that one’s statement provides evidence that a relinquishment had occurred — but your mentioning it struck me in light of Vancouver telling Tiger they didn’t look at relinquisher’s statements. Got me thinking Vancouver most definitely should read these statements — might give them a better understanding of what s.1 relinquishment is, because they sure seem to have some difficulties grasping the concept there. How Vancouver can think that someone who relinquished 40 years ago needs 2 appts 7 months apart (to think things over) is beyond me! Such people are trapped in an awkward retroactive limbo without the now-required CLN and just want their normal life back as soon as possible.
@tdott
the reason I went to Calgary was that I could not get an appointment in Vancouver, there were simply none available through to the end of August, and that was as of the time I booked back in February. And, brocker’s report that Vancouver is requiring two appointments for a relinquishment. So, Calgary was much easier to get into, and they deserve top marks for professionalism. It was a worthwhile expense, time is of value to me, both in terms of when I get my CLN and how many trips I need to make to get to the consulate.
@tdott,
Lagoon is correct about the difficulty of getting an appointment in Vancouver. As I reported in the Consulate Directory, they acted in a professional manner at my second appointment however, the bottom line is they do require 2 appointments and there were 7 months between my appointments. If I had known the process would take so long, I would have booked in Calgary. And I live within 20 minutes of the Vancouver Consulate
thanks tdott, tiger and pacifica777, it does feel good to be on the other side of my appointment.
@pacifica777, I’d say the vice consul spent at least 20 minutes or more reading my statement, or asking me questions about my statement – that was half or more than half of the 40 minutes I was there.
Of course, this made me wonder if I’d said the ‘right’ thing, but everything I said was true. Our lives are complex, and I tried to describe all of the considerations that influenced by becoming a Canadian. While I was questioned about what I wrote, I think I have given evidence to support my claim that I voluntarily and intentionally became a Canadian, and have ‘lived’ as a Canadian since taking the oath.
I am looking forward to putting my efforts to contacting politicians about the issues related to citizenship for people born in the US, and being able to stop thinking about what I need to do.
@ Tdott
I would go out of town. I get the feeling Vancouver is not really interested in doing expatriations. I was last in contact with Vancouver in December and they were still requiring 2 visits. This was a month after they’d been told they could and should do it in 1 visit. Throughout last year consulates around the world were switching to 1 visit – makes sense, they’re swamped with this. But Vancouver stuck with 2 visits.
Lagoon or Calgary411 or someone else can let you know about booking for Calgary. I don’t think Calgary books on-line. But in terms of Vancouver’s interest in doing expatriations, here’s an interesting comparison. Vancouver and Toronto both do on-line booking. You book through “Notarial and Other Services.” So, presumably not all these appointments are for expatriation. Nevertheless, in this category:
Vancouver has 2 appointments per day usually 6 days per month. 12 per month.
Toronto has 16 appointments per day usually 12 days per month. 192 per month.
Vancouver’s staff appears to be about only 80% that of Toronto’s.
Vancouver makes available only 6% the number of appointments that Toronto does.
And it’s only 1 visit at Toronto.
The only positive that comes to mind about Vancouver is that people report the staff very pleasant to interact with – but people report the same about Calgary. And it can take forever to get an appointment at Vancouver – and then the second one
Even if Vancouver has changed to a one visit procedure since I was in contact with them, I’d still recommend going somewhere else, though, because it takes months to get any appt at Vancouver.
the email address to book an appointment in Calgary is:
Calgary-ACS@state.gov
@ Lagoon
Congratulations! I’m surprised you even needed an airplane to fly back to Victoria. Waiting for a backdated CLN should be pretty easy because you don’t have to worry about post-renunciation form filing. 🙂
@ Medea
That’s great news about receiving your CLN. It sounds like Bern is good place to go, like Calgary. I imagine you are feeling very well indeed right now and I hope your OH is too. 🙂
To Lagoon and Medea,
My sincere congratulations to you both as well. Hopefully, I will have the database updated over the weekend or by late Tuesday at the latest — after I get prepared for and have had my meeting with my MP regarding US citizenship-based taxation, FATCA and all that is happening to US Persons Abroad.
Thanks pacifica777 and calgary411. It’s certainly a relief to know that our bank accounts are no longer threatened with closure. I was so lucky that I renounced when I did as I received the waiver forms from our bank the Friday after I renounced so only 4 days to spare! I contacted them immediately as the forms had to be back with them by the end of March and they agreed to allow me more time to wait for the CLN to arrive. Whew. The first thing I did after I collected the CLN on the 11th April was e-mail a copy off to the bank. They then sent me a new substantial American presence form to sign (all no’s ticked apart from the fact I was born there) for their files. I also sent them another copy of the CLN with the form too. Overkill possibly, but I’d rather they had too many than not enough. I haven’t heard anything from them since so I assume it’s all okay, although I’ll be happier once I get the tax side done and dusted. But they’ve never queried me on tax compliance so I hope it’ll all be sorted before they think to. Now I’m an “ex” it’s not so much of an issue for them anyway I don’t think, it’s just me worrying.
@Lagoon, congrats on your renunciation too.
@Em, thanks. I feel so good now.
@tdott – Calgary seems the place to go over Vancouver. It can take years to complete the process if you use Vancouver as sometimes the 2nd appointment has been a year or more after the first one.
I picked up my CLN yesterday at the Halifax consulate. 53 days after renouncing. I’m not looking forward to the paperwork next year, but it is good to know I can get back to a normal financial life, and the end is in sight.
Good stuff. Welcome to the Club, Doc!
Wonderful news, Canuckdoc. You have better things to do. That light at the end of the paperwork tunnel is getting brighter for you. Congratulations!!
You my recall that in January I visited the Toronto Consulate to apply for my CLN.
It came through, much more quickly than the stated 4-6 months! I got a phone message that it was available and did I want to pick it up or did I want it mailed. Since I live several hours from Toronto, mailing was the only real option. I left voice mail with the consular official to that effect.
Three business days later it arrived. Included in the package was a cover letter stating that my application for the CLN was approved; the letter provided the details and added that I needed to sign and either 1) return the original as acknowledgement of receipt; or 2) sign, scan, and email the letter to the email address provided. I chose the latter.
Done.
I’m free. I still have to file tax returns for 2012 and the 14 days of 2013 that I was a citizen but I’m done. Hooray!
Here is the timeline.
14 January 2013: Consulate visit
27 March: State Department approved application
15 April: date on Consulate letter
18 April: voice mail from Consulate
19 April: return voice mail
23 April: package in my Canada Post PO box
27 April: letter signed, scanned, and emailed
I took those last few days as a check: this is what I really want to do, right? Even the answer was a foregone conclusion, it did not hurt to make absolutely certain.
After emailing the letter, mowing the yard, patting my beloved dogs, and chatting with my marvellous wife, we had a beer on the deck and I smoked a cigar.
Now on to the next battle, which is to blunt if not stop FATCA’s effect on us.
I plan a trip later this year to the States for a reunion with my siblings. It will be interesting to see what happens at the border when I present my Canadian passport with CLN.
@medea
Congrats and thanks for the tips you have given me. I am slogging along with the filing and trying to control my anxiety over the entire situation. No cpa persons to file US forms where I live, except only one I heard of charged over 1000 per return – I have heard that the hurdle can be the never filed Fbars if one doen’t owe any US tax. So I am carefully, slowly getting it done. Luckily I am already a dual, and so want to be a mono again (why oh why did my parents ever immigrate to the US??? I have seen my 10 yr. old face on the naturalization certificate, and I look unhappy
Best wishes and all the best for a lovely summer!
Congratulations and our appreciation for giving all your details, extex. Many wishes for enjoying patting those beloved dogs and chatting with your marvelous (and obviously very supportive) wife and a beer or two on your deck, with a (Cuban?) cigar. You now have your guarantee for no trouble crossing the border to visit and relatives in the US — as it should be regardless.
Thanks for staying in the fight for something more just than FATCA.
@extex, Congratulations. That was a quick turnaround. Very lucky you.
@allou, I’m so glad I only seem to need to file the FBAR’s as I have no income of my own, but even then it’s going to cost around CHF3,000-3,500 to do all the paperwork and that’s before I know if I have any tax/penalties to pay. I’m doing the FBAR’s myself, but sending them on to my tax preparer to submit along with the rest of the paperwork. I certainly don’t envy you, but there are plenty of people here who have gone through the process so hopefully they’ll be able to advise you if you get stuck.
I will say one thing; FBAR for this year has to be received by the Treasury Department on or before the 30th June, there’s no extension for that form.
…and, reminder, it is not sent with the tax return.
Q. Where do I file the FBAR?
A. Send completed forms to:
U.S. Department of the Treasury
P.O. Box 32621
Detroit, MI 48232-0621
If an express delivery service is used, send completed forms to:
IRS Enterprise Computing Center
ATTN: CTR Operations Mailroom, 4th Floor
985 Michigan Avenue
Detroit, MI 48226
The contact phone number for the delivery messenger service is 313-234-1062. The number cannot be used to confirm that your FBAR was received.
The FBAR is not to be filed with the filer’s Federal tax return.
Q. How do I verify that my FBAR was filed?
A. Ninety days after the date of filing, the filer can request verification that the FBAR was received. An FBAR filing verification request may be made by calling 866-270-0733 and selecting option 1. Up to five documents may be verified over the phone. There is no fee for this verification.
Alternatively, an FBAR filing verification request may be made in writing and must include the filer’s name, taxpayer identification number and the filing period. There is a $5 fee for verifying five or fewer FBARs and a $1 fee for each additional FBAR. A copy of the filed FBAR can be obtained at a cost of $0.15 per page. Check or money order should be made payable to the United States Treasury.
The request and payment should be mailed to:
IRS Enterprise Computing Center/Detroit
ATTN: Verification
P.O. Box 32063
Detroit, MI 48232
I have always sent my FBARs by registered mail that requires a signature — I’ve received my Canadian Postal Service registered mail card back for this year’s 2012 FBAR filing.
@Calgary,
I just sent my FBARS by efiling. Initially I was reluctant, but wanted to try it out so I could advise my son, who is not sure whether he wants to renounce yet. It was very simple, and you get an almost immediate response that it’s been received. Not for everyone, but that is another option Unless of course you have a Mac, in which case it appears it is not possible.
Submitted on 2013/05/07 at 1:45 pm
13-05-06 US GOV IS STILL AFTER ME… US CONSULATE, JERUSALEM
The correspondence below was forwarded to the German Consul in Israel, who
had previously provided protection against abuse of my rights by the US
and
Israeli governments.
Brief summary:
On January 1st, 2013, my bank accounts in Israel were blocked by Bank
HaPoalim. The bank claimed that it was done on behalf of the US gov. No
written records were provided. No legal procedure was the basis for such
conduct, either in Israel or in the US.
The Israeli gov refused to provide Equal Protection under the law.
Eventually, after request for protection by the German Consul in Israel,
my money was returned.
In parallel, I appeared in the US Consulate in Jerusalem, paid the
exorbitant fees, and fulfilled my duties for renunciation of US
government.
The US Consul refused to perform his duties, and only false and
deliberately misleading records were produced.
No response was provided at the end of the correspondence below by the US
Consulate in Jerusalem.
It is not expected that the US gov would recognize my renunciation of US
citizenship anytime soon (i.e., I do not believe that I would ever get a
CLN.)
jz
____________
On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 11:01 AM, JZ wrote:
May 6, 2013
Nili Weinfeld
Special Consular Services
American Citizen Services
Dear Ms Weinfeld:
Thank you for your expedient response.
I would appreciate if you could also explain:
1) Who authorized your request, below, relative to my German citizenship,
and
2) What is the legal foundation for such request, pertaining to a person,
who fulfilled his duties relative to renunciation of US citizenship.
Truly,
Joseph Zernik, PhD
Human Rights Alert (NGO)
On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 9:24 AM, Jerusalem, ACS wrote:
I just saw your request about the title:
Nili Weinfeld
Special Consular Services
American Citizen Services
This email is UNCLASSIFIED.
From: Jerusalem, ACS
Sent: Monday, May 06, 2013 9:22 AM
To: ’123456xyz@gmail.com’
Subject: FW: Loss of U.S. Nationality Application in process
I apologize, here it is.
Regards, Nili Weinfeld
American Citizen Services Unit
Consulate General of the United States in Jerusalem
Phone: +972 (0)2-630-4000
Fax: +972 (0)2-630-4070
Street Address: 14 David Flusser, Jerusalem 93392
(Near the former Diplomat Hotel, now the Caprice Diamond Center)
Follow us on our Facebook page!
To schedule the next available appointment click here.
http://jerusalem.usconsulate.gov/service.html
This e-mail is unclassified based on the definitions outlined in E.O.
12958.
This email is UNCLASSIFIED.
From: JZ [mailto:123456xyz@gmail.com ]
Sent: Monday, May 06, 2013 9:18 AM
To: Jerusalem, ACS
Cc: Smith, Kirk G; Ratney, Michael A
Subject: Re: Loss of U.S. Nationality Application in process
Dear “Nili”:
Relative to the email communication below, please provide your full name
and your title in the Consulate General of the United States in Jerusalem.
Joseph Zernik, PhD
Human Rights Alert (NGO)
On Mon, May 6, 2013 at 8:58 AM, Jerusalem, ACS wrote:
Dear Mr. Zernik,
Your Loss of Nationality application is still in process with the
Department of State. In the meantime, would you please provide your German
passport number and its date of issuance? As we recall, you showed us the
German passport in one of your visits in our office, but we do not have a
copy of it on file.
Please do not hesitate to contact us if you have any questions.
Regards, Nili
American Citizen Services Unit
Consulate General of the United States in Jerusalem
Phone: +972 (0)2-630-4000
Fax: +972 (0)2-630-4070
Street Address: 14 David Flusser, Jerusalem 93392
(Near the former Diplomat Hotel, now the Caprice Diamond Center)
@ Joseph,
I’m sorry your experience is being such a hassle and taking so long.
It does seem odd that months after your meeting, the consulate would ask you for your passport number and issue date. Logically, if that information is important, they should have taken it when you presented the passport at your meeting months ago.
I don’t think it’s unique to Jerusalem to record passport information. As far as I know, the consulates all ask to see your passport if you have one and it seems they photocopy the identification page. [If you don’t have a passport, I know they need some type of photo id, but so far no one’s reported here using other photo id, but a lot of people have mentioned their passports in describing their consulate meetings]
Reading your comment got me wondering if a foreign passport has a bearing on the issuance itself and I can’t think of how. It’s not required to have a passport. The DOS forms don’t ask for a non-US passport number. The 4079, on page 1, asks for your US passport number, if applicable, and there’s a question on p. 4 about What country’s passport do you use to enter the US?, What country’s passport do you use to enter other countries? but it doesn’t ask for the number.
I don’t know what role one’s non-US passport would really play in the renunciation process, as you don’t need to have one to renounce anyway. By that line of thinking, if it plays no substantive role in a renunciation, I wouldn’t think them not noting the the passport number at your meeting, but only asking now, is a delaying tactic. It’s weird they’re asking so late, but it could just be a clerical error type of thing, like their policy is to note this stuff in a person’s file and they noticed it wasn’t there in yours.
I’m concerned that you make reference to false and misleading records. Because either there’s a misunderstanding, which is not good (but could get cleared up fairly easily), or something is very seriously wrong but it’s not clear what. Would you provide more detail? Maybe someone/s here can be of some assistance.
No, it’s certainly not unique. This is what I received from the Bern embassy:
“Enclosed is a short questionnaire that you should complete and send to us, by e-mail (BernRenunciations@state.gov) or regular mail, no later than 5 working days before your scheduled appointment, together with copies of your U.S. and foreign passports (if you do not have a U.S. passport, the U.S. birth certificate or consular report of birth abroad is required) and your U.S. naturalization certificate, if applicable. At the time of your appointment you must bring all original documents.”
I’m surprised they didn’t ask you for similar when you prepared your documents and they certainly should have taken a copy when you went for your renunciation. However, if they don’t deal with many, they may not be up on the proper procedures.
I know there have been occasional reports that some embassies haven’t been allowing people to renounce if they don’t have a second nationality, citing their “statelessness”, but it’s not against US law for you to renounce without having a second citizenship to fall back on. But that’s clearly not the case for you so just send them a copy so they can get on with finalising your renuncation.