Consulate Report Directory (Brockers Describe their Consulate Meetings) and CLN Delivery Time Chart Part 2
If clicking on a link brought you to the wrong page on the comment thread, click here to go to the current page.
Wonder what really happens at the consulates? Find out in the Isaac Brock Society’s Consulate Report Directory, currently 279 pages of first-hand accounts of renunciation/relinquishment appointments, arranged by consulate location, along with further information and links to the required Dept of State forms and the Dept of State manuals used by the consulates in processing CLN applications, with an appendix containing a timeline chart (booking-meeting-CLN) as reported by consulate location.
The Directory is updated as consulate visit stories are posted on the website.
You can post here or elsewhere on the site (we’ll keep an eye out for them). Some comments may be excerpted or condensed slightly in the consulate reports. The original posts and comments remain on their threads are not edited.
Thanks to everyone for sharing your experiences…and keep ’em coming! It’s a new experience for everyone and your information is really helpful.
To change or delete your report in the Directory, you can post the change as a comment on this thread or e-mail Pacifica@isaacbrocksociety.ca
Click here for the Consulate Report Directory
Notes:
Consulates are listed alphabetically by country and the Directory’s table of contents links to each section (they don’t look like links, but they are.)
This thread is a continuation of Consulate Report Directory Part 1, which contains earlier discussion on this topic, 929 comments from its inception in March 2012 through February 2013.
To Book an Appointment and/or Request Information from your Local Consulate:
This post by Eric, Almost No US Citizenship Renunciation Appointments Left During 2016 in Dublin, contains a chart of links to the consulates’ website pages on renunciation/relinquishment, for info on booking appointments and/or requesting information at your location. (The title highlights Dublin, but the charts, article and discussion cover consulates around the world.)
– – – – – – – – – – – – – – – –
If clicking on a link brought you to the wrong page on the comment thread, click here to go to the current page.
@Pacifica,
On another thread, (Forget about form 8854: US law establishes a right to unilateral expatriation), Keonna mentioned that the consulate in Toronto told her she would have to come to Ontario because Vancouver was not taking appts. Have you heard anything about this?
Thanks, Noble Dreamer,
I haven’t seen any available appointments on the Vancouver site for months, and Tiger’s also mentioned that she hasn’t.
Re Keonna’s comment,
“I have just herd word from Toronto that I need to be in Ontario to get an appointment (Vancouver is not doing them right now)”
That gave me the impression from it that Toronto was only taking bookings from people in Ontario. I was about to follow up on that, but I think I’ll go back to the other thread and ask Keonna to clarify that before I do.
As for Vancouver not taking any appointments, I found a note I’d made in January — at that time Toronto had 155 available for February, and Vancouver had nothing available until July (they had 3).
As of today, I see that Toronto has only 6 left in August, in the last week of the month. I seem to recall they had less slots than usual available during the summer months. But they’re back to their normal number of 192 appointments for September, of which 189 remain available.
@pacifica @nobledreamer
Sorry for the confusion. No one in Toronto told me about Vancouver. I’ve just been trying really hard to make something happen that doesn’t seam to want to. Vancouver is not cooperating so I am taking my business elsewhere:)
@pacifica777
It took me several days, but I just finished reading the Consulate Report Directory dated July 19. I see now that it’s been updated since I started reading it.
I wonder, what’s the easiest way to keep up with new additions to the directory without scrolling through 133 pages looking for new dates?
@ WhatAmI
The only way I found is to do a search on the page for a month date from which you wish to begin. So to find all items with dates in June you would search and repeat search on “2013.06” as your search string. Then when completed if you wanted to search July you would change the search string to “2013.07”
Yitzi
@ WhatAmI and Yitzi,
That’s a good point. I think I’ll add a reverse-chronological table of contents to it,and update that each time I add a new report, so readers will have the option of knowing where to go for the latest entries.
Also re scrolling. I just noticed a problem with the regular table of contents — it’s supposed to be links to each section, but the links dropped out, so I’ll fix that too.
I went to the embassy in Stockholm the other day to get some documents notarized and I think it is worth reporting on my visit because this is was really happens at the embassy.
1) The person before me was an 18 year old accidental American male who was there to get a Social Security card as he “wanted to spend time in America.” When he was at the window, the Consul/Consul representative asked him if he was aware of the Selective Service. The young man stated he was not. The person at the window then said, “I am going to give you some documents on the Selective Service. I suggest you take them and read them.” He then pushed some documents through the window to him. I was surprised that the policy was not to explain anything about what the obligations of an 18 year old US citizen male are. It was very laissez-faire. However, the potential fines may not be so.
2) I was next. In the US, in my experience, it costs between $2 and $5 dollars to get a document notarized. The service the US embassy provides costs $50 per document. I suppose that I am supposed to just be happy that the service exists and ignore how I feel about the price gouging. I honestly find it hard to justify that $50 per document covers extra cost that may be incurred for a notary service abroad, especially when it is just a part of someone’s duties. So much for the wonderful services that are often cited as provided to US citizens abroad by embassies. I do not find $50 per document either wonderful, or understandable.
3) The person who was scheduled to go up after me was there for a second renunciation visit. While waiting together, I congratulated her on making the decision. She told me that she felt really bad about what she was about to do, but saw no other way. She explained that she was an accidental American, born in the US to parents of a third country (not Sweden). She had always been proud to have a US passport, however, the passport had begun to interfere with her ability to lead a life with her Swedish husband and children in Sweden. She realized that she had no real ties to the US so she made the decision to give up the passport. She related that while it had been hard, she had always put up with paying one month’s take home salary to get her taxes done correctly and she had done so in spite of her husband’s anger as they could have used the money to pay bills. Once she recognized she really had no ties to the US, two things happened that became the icing on the cake and led her to go through with the renunciation. The first was that her family planned to spend a tourist weekend in St. Petersburg, Russia. As she is a Swedish citizen, the Russian visa was not expected to be an issue. However, the visa application asks what countries she had been in during the last year. She listed the USA and some zealous visa official then asked why there was no US visa in her passport. She explained that she was also a US citizen and had used her US passport to enter the States. The reaction was that Americans had to get their Russian visa in the US and her visa was denied. She could not get a visa from the US in time for the trip. Her family went on the trip without her as visa problems had not been anticipated and it was too late to cancel the trip. I know this policy is true as I had to travel to Russia on a business trip recently and the visa agency my company uses warned me about this. As I have not been in the US for years, visas to the US never came up and I was able to obtain a visa where I live. The woman realized that her US passport added an unecessary complication to a life lived primarily as a Swede. Added to this, the woman told me that she works in a Swedish bank and she saw the preparations that the banks were making to identify US citizens and expected things to get more difficult for US citizens in terms of bank accounts. Finally, as a bank employee, she could not take advantage of the same offers fellow bank employees who were solely Swedish citizens could. So reluctantly, but as she could not see any real reason or need to keep the passport, she was renouncing.
That was my recent hour at the embassy.
@NotThatLisa,
Thanks for posting this. It’s very interesting and useful to get a feel for what is going on at the embassies and to learn how the current situation is affecting people.
This is follow-up on an earlier comment about the Ottawa Embassy.
My wife had an appointment in early July hoping to renounce in one visit, but was told she needed 2, even though she was thoroughly prepared. At the first meeting they made sure the 4079 form was completed and she discussed her reasons for renouncing with an official, who was very polite and professional. She then made another appointment for about 4 weeks later and went to it, only to be told that there was nobody there that could deal with her that day. They were very apologetic. However, you would have thought they could have contacted her to tell her not to come to the appointment. (What if she had been from a city many hours of travel from Ottawa?) A few days later, after daily phone calls she was able to get in to actually meet someone. After a couple of hours, where she had to show some documents again, she got to take the oath and formally renounce. Anyone planning to renounce in Ottawa should most probably make 2 appointments, separated by, say, a week, and not wait until after the first one to make the second. One can always cancel the second if the date is inconvenient.
So US Independence Day will have a different meaning and date in this household from now on!
@CanCan,
Good to hear your wife has completed her renunciation! I’m glad she hadn’t come in from out of town to find her meeting cancelled – they sure should have contacted her to let her know. Also too bad they’re requiring 2 visits as they don’t have to and that she had to wait a couple of hours to see the vice consul when she arrived for her appt. That being said, great to hear she’s finished and I hope she gets her CLN soon! Thanks for your report and your advice!
Pingback: The Isaac Brock Society
A feeling of relief beset me as I was sitting there wait for my elusive number to appear on the board. Soon I would be called to Booth B in at the U. S consulate in Calgary to finally read aloud the renunciation statements and affirm the oath. It all went off without a hitch. I arrived at 9:20am and was when asked what I was there for the guard called me past the line to head through the first metal detector only to wait in the seats afterwards. They called a block of people up and lined us against the wall, we then proceeded to follow the guard to the elevator to floor 10 where we went through another metal detector and given a number. You then wait some more in the large room with windowed booths much like the Canadian passport offices. You sit and wait for your number to appear on the board. The first time I was called up was to provide my Id (canadian passport, U. S birth certificate) and to pay the 450(472) fee but my credit card wouldn’t swipe. They can’t key in the digits either so I had to go through the entire process again after going downstairs to get some cash. I already had a number so they moved me to the front of the security check lines. I returned to the window to pay the fee.
The next time I was called, I was provided two forms. One to review the information that I provided them a few months ago was accurate and the second to review the what I was to read aloud later.
The actual time spend talking to anybody was very minuscule compared to the amount of time spent waiting. The last time I was called up was to recite the renunciation oath, and sign some papers and that was it.
I was there from 9:20am and was out of the door by 11:00am. Now I’m back at the airport waiting to go back home to Vancouver. It was worth the trip. It’s great that only a single appointment was required, but 2 doesn’t make any sense.
@pman, Didn’t you know? You are a myth. Ask Robert Stack.
Seriously though, thanks for describing your renunciation day. I hope your CLN arrives soon!
Can’t say I saw a check box certifying 5 years of tax compliance though. Where was that supposed to be? It’s moot though as I did go through OVDI and then streamlined. I had actually booked my appt. before getting a response from my OVDI submission. No being a goat here…
Thanks to all Brock contributors btw.. This was an extremely valuable respurce
@pman
The Calgary questionnaire asks if you’re going to provide a written reason for renouncing, Yes? or No?
What’s your take on that? Did you say yes or no on the form? Don’t they just ask you again in person anyway?
Congratulations, Pman! Good to hear that Brock has been a valuable resource for you, and thanks for adding to it with your report.
The check box for certifying 5 years of tax compliance is on the IRS form 8854. State Dept doesn’t care about that, so the only reference to tax on their forms is that line about tax obligations on the Statement of Understanding of Consequences.
Congrats, pman! Must be feeling quite good.
A quick question: did you get an “all clear” from the IRS concerning your Streamlined filing prior to renouncing? I’ll be going this route myself, and understand it can take a while for the IRS to get back to you, so am wondering.
@ WhatAmI,
As it’s not required to give a reason, most renunciants do not provide a written reason. Generally the consulate officers don’t ask about it. (Of course, they know why so many people are suddenly renouncing!) If you are asked, even though you’re not required to give a reason, you could just say you want to simplify your life, or that your entire life is in Canada so you don’t want to feel divided between two countries. Generally they don’t ask much, if any, questions — everything they need to know is on the forms. The meeting is usually quite short (10-15 minutes or so — as Pman wrote, you spend most of your time in the waiting area) and the focus is on that your documents are in order and that you understand the consequences.
@pacifica777
Thanks! My mother is renouncing in December. She’s 90 years old.
@ WhatAmI,
It should go very well for her. Calgary has an excellent reputation. People find them to be very pleasant and considerate to deal with.
@tdott yes I received the golden ‘low risk for noncompliance’ note when I was accepted in to streamlined.
As for providing a written reason why I was renouncing I said no but the agent asked me for a reason. Basically said I have no ties, and no desire for, and and no need for us citizenship. As others have stated Calgary was very respectful.
On September 19, 2013 I had my appointment to Relinquish my US Citizenship at US Consulate Toronto. I arrived about 1 hour early and stood in line outside on Simcoe Street. The hour passed by very slow, but finally I was allowed to go in. The security guard checked my pre-printed appointment confirmation and US passport, and directed me inside. I went through the security area where they checked all my belongings, and then up to the third floor. I walked up to the glass window, the lady asked me what my appointment was for, I told her I was there to relinquish my US Citizenship, she asked to see my forms, she looked at them and then told me to wait a minute. She came back out and told me to just have a seat.
So I went to the waiting room and after about 5 minutes a man in a uniform came out and asked if I had a Canadian Passport and I said no, I told him I just received my Canadian Citizenship about 2 week prior. So he took all that I had as far as Birth Certificate, Canadian Citizenship Certificate Info, etc. He was not a very friendly man almost acted as if he was irritated about something.
So after about 1 hour I was called up to the window and was greeted by a very charming lady which was the Vice Consul . She asked me if I understood what I was about to do, and if I was sure of my decision. I said yes, that I has done a lot of reading on the subject and was well aware, so she asked me to sign the forms and to raise my right hand and repeat after her, well she was speaking so fast I could not keep up with what she was saying and we both laughed and I told her I understand, swear, will do, etc. and she laughed again and said Ok, She was really a funny lady and very sweet, she made me feel really comfortable. She told me she had to take my US Passport, I said OK and that was it, really no questions asked. She did mention that the CLN should arrive in 4-6 months.
The US Consulate in Toronto are very nice and professional. They really make you feel at ease, I thought I would be nervous but not at all.
I do want to thank all my Brocker friends who helped me for the past 2 years, it is so very much appreciated. I want to give a SPECIAL THANKS to Pacifica777 who helped me so much through out this whole process,she was always so kind to me and would help me anyway she could. And also Calgary411, who also is such a kind, helpful and wonderful person. And of course Lynn aka (Blaze) she has been there for me from the beginning, what a sweet lady. And a BIG THANK YOU TO PETROS, for all his help and for starting this site..
I am so happy this part is over with and can’t wait for the CLN to arrive.
Saddened123
Big congratulations, Saddened. I knew and am glad you came do the decision you felt best for you. And, I’m glad your relinquishment (or claiming your relinquishment by virtue of your becoming a Canadian citizen) was a comfortable process for you. The rest of your process should be more straight-forward. I, for one, am really, really happy for you — and there are many others that have followed your progression through all the emotions and realizatons. Thanks for letting us know.
Now — time for a name change. Are you really still “Saddened”?