Win Win for U.S./Many of the NINE million Expats who may start voting would forgo the relief checks (spent overseas)/They want Residency Based Tax as per Rep. Platform (Promise kept)/Most do not pay tax BUT pay expensive fees to file/Save $$ on checks/Google it
— Anthony Scaramucci (@Scaramucci) April 17, 2020
To see the replies click on the part at the bottom that includes “are talking about this”.
Hmmm, what exactly is his point. Does he feel that the promise to shift to RBT only has been keep?
I for one will not apply nor will I accept the payment from the US precisely because I do not live there nor file.
Agree that his point is not clear. It seems that this is a possible opportunity to get this issue into the public domain.
Indeed. Is there encoded in this a statement that US Citizens abroad are for sure going to receive these relief cheques? I can’t really tell.
I doubt it as I have read reports that they will deposited directly into accounts. Doubt they are going to try to do so in banks abroad.
Per reports on other forums, non-resident US persons have begun receiving their cheques this week. The first group are those who filed in the last year (for 2018 or 2019) and who had direct deposit set up with a US bank account. Expats most definitely qualify for the funds, though there is no direct deposit to foreign accounts.
Going forward, those who filed without direct deposit can either wait for a cheque in the mail, or supposedly there is a form or app to update their past returns with bank information. Those who don’t file but receive social security can also expect cheques, by mail if not direct deposit. Finally, those who have not been required to to file can use a simplified online 1040 to enter an income number along with direct deposit information.
For a non-compliant US person who wishes to claim their renunciation subsidy, options are to file somewhat correctly (1040 with FEIE or FTC) or just go to the new form and say single, income $0 and here’s a Transferwise account number. Basta.
No clue what Scaramucci is actually talking about with that tweet – doesn’t he seem like a character from a lifetime ago? – but relieved he didn’t make another reference to auto-fellation. If he knew anything at all about the issue he’d realize that of the “NINE million Expats” it’s only around half a million who actually file anything. Otherwise a very strange comment.
I thought the Patriot Act made it illegal for those of us who actually reside overseas to have a bank account in the US. I looked into that issue so long ago that I may not recall correctly.
I also forgot that checks are useless here in Japan.
But isn’t it hard for one to argue against CBT if one receives benefits from the US?
No problem at all, assuming you can suck and blow at the same time.
Not clear of the mechanism but there are many non-residents with US bank accounts. Particularly those who’ve been bagging the child tax credit money year after year, I expect.
Transferwise now offers a simple way for anyone obtain a US routing and account number.
This technique can be learned: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Circular_breathing
“But isn’t it hard for one to argue against CBT if one receives benefits from the US?”
I’d turn the question around. If expats are forced to suffer the injustice of CBT, then they are absolutely entitled to the benefits of USC. It is the “benefits” of US citizenship that justify CBT in the minds of those who are in favor of it.
Most expats would happily trade those so-called benefits for the right to live their lives free of US government interference.
The ridiculous result (due to CBT) of money being sent overseas to stimulate foreign economies was most likely the reason for Scaramucci’s tweet. At least he seems to have a basic understanding of the issues and brought it up for discussion. Plus he remembered it was a campaign promise. Anyone who objects to the silliness of sending that money overseas will have to explain why its OK to tax expats but then turn around and deny them the benefits that every homelander is entitled to.
@
USCitizenAbroad says
April 17, 2020 at 7:20 am
“Agree that his point is not clear. It seems that this is a possible opportunity to get this issue into the public domain.”
Public domain! Did you say public domain?
Respectfully USCA, the US public, by and large, thinks we’re either traitors or tax cheats, and that no punishment is good enough for us. The only US citizens overseas who get love and respect from their fellow Americans are in uniform and are getting shot at. The rest of us can go to hell as far as most Americans are concerned. I’ve read enough blog comments on the subject of FATCA to know this to be true.
When I visit the states I make a point of not telling people I live in Switzerland because it’s a guaranteed conversation stopper. When I was in California I said I lived in Oklahoma. I previously lived in both places so I could lie with some accuracy. Americans for the most part just can’t conceive why anyone would want to live abroad.
As far as getting Corona checks from the US (for those who qualify) I think it’s a trap. What better way for some goddam democrat representative to justify FATCA forever than to declare before congress, for all to hear, “Our US citizens abroad…harrumpf…fart…cough…receive the same emergency benefits as Americans in this country. This is no time to even consider anything as outrageous as granting a certain class of citizens a tax exemption just for living overseas…harumpf…fart..cough. I yield the floor for the remainder of my time to Elise Bean, whom I invited, to better explain why US expats deserve to be taxed like every other US citizen…”
To be honest I condemn no one for taking these checks if eligible, with all your little IRS declaration ducks are in a row. Many expats are in dire straits with this quarantine madness. I just think that receiving money from Uncle Sam will be used against us politically, and later remove any serious debate about FATCA repeal – much less even considering RBT.
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“Respectfully USCA, the US public, by and large, thinks we’re either traitors or tax cheats, and that no punishment is good enough for us.”
That’s exactly why (in my opinion) expats should take the money from those morons and run. It wasn’t like expats asked for it; its on offer due to a fluke in the stupid US tax system. Homelanders already despise expats and declining to take the cash won’t improve their opinion one iota. Screw them (or to be precise, assist the homelanders in screwing themselves).
If it’s a trap [resisting urge to post the Admiral Akbar meme here] then it’s an unintentional trap. Pretty clearly this program was rushed out with zero thought given to non-residents. They are sending money to people who likely won’t spend it in the US, thus defeating the purpose of domestic stimulus. Meanwhile those who do qualify can’t, it turns out, easily set up direct deposit because the “Get My Payment” app one needs to enter a US account number will only work with a US address – so non-residents may be stuck waiting months for a cheque (more fun anyway since it’ll have Trump’s name on it). Adding to the confusion, it’s reported that direct deposit may only work for accounts used to collect refunds, not those used to make payments. In short, it’s a bit of a shit-show.
Whether one takes the money after years of compliance, or files once to collect the loot, is a personal decision that likely will have no impact whatsoever on the non-existent US debate about FATCA or CBT. No idea what The Mooch was actually trying to say on the subject because his tweet was so inarticulate.
“That’s exactly why (in my opinion) expats should take the money from those morons and run. It wasn’t like expats asked for it”.
Just been talking to one, mystified as to why he’s had $1200 turn up in his account when he is not a US citizen, not a US resident and he only studied in the US.
Still, it’s nice to see this vile little bit of US exceptionalism biting the US government in the in the ass.
However I share concerns that this hands the supporters of citizenship based taxation a huge amount of ammo.
@Mike
That is hilarious. He probably filed in 2018 as a student, still had his US account open. Nice little bonus.
@Eric,
You voice my concerns as well.
As far as the US Gov. getting taken by sending money to non resident non USCs, how is that different than the hundred’s of millions they send in overseas aid?
Not surprised one needs a US address to apply, most US businesses I have tried to buy stuff from still only accept only domestic address, postal codes and phone numbers on their websites despite advertising that they sell overseas.
I for one will not take it. To do so undercuts my argument against spending the time and money to file and concern of being fined for errors while receiving no benefits. Japan has their own aid package which it looks like I am eligible for. As I pay taxes here, it is their program I would apply for.
US address not needed actually, only US bank account for direct deposit (which can be done without US address) or supposedly they will mail the cheque to a foreign address.
Can anyone cash the check outside the US? With the exception of US bases, which I can no longer enter, I know of no place to do so on Japan.
@Maz57
I prefer to hang out at the bottom of the net instead of coming to the surface to take the bait and get hauled in earlier.
In Canada you can deposit a US cheque at any bank. Takes a few days to clear, maybe a service charge or a shitty exchange rate, but no big deal really.
Hopefully we all keep tweeting to keep this issue in the spotlight. I believe many Americans in the US will see the tweets and become educated. Hopefully it may lead to more coverage.
https://twitter.com/scaramucci/status/1250952726906916867?s=21
Advice for anyone who decides to file and claim the stimulus payment: it’s important to thank President Trump. He gets very upset when people are not appreciative.
The best way to thank him would be to spend it ASAP thereby stimulating the economy of your (non-US) country of choice. But I still don’t understand why they don’t just use dump trucks.
Not to forget this spin: & not to always keep defending “from the back foot” that we are not tax cheats.
It is the USG who is tax cheating USP overseas, BY claiming double tax jurisdiction over them WHILE providing $0 in resident services in exchange.
The USG is cheating USP overseas of $US113 Billion in resident services every year by my calculations:
4,094,000,000,000 2018 Budget Request
325,700,000 2017 US population
12,570 Expenditure per person
Overseas Population Total equivalent spend:
9,000,000 113,128,645,993
6,000,000 75,419,097,329
9 million persons ~= $113 Billion USG should spend on resident services for them, EVERY YEAR.
*** That figure/logic should be in any tax reform proposal shifting to RBT that is supposed to be “revenue neutral.” And, as the above adds the USG expense aspect then we may see that “revenue neutral” is an unrealistic term that works against us. I propose that we pursue “budget neutral” and that would be more beneficial for us especially if it includes consideration for the expense that the USG should spend on its “residents” who are tax resident overseas.
To cash a check in Australia:
Could take a bank teller about 45 minutes to figure it out/get approvals etc. + $AU50 cheque charge + usurious exchange rate + may take 4-6 weeks to clear + no respect if the statue of liberty and “U.S. Treasury” is on the cheque.