Today (11/16/2017) the floor of the House passed the House tax reform bill. The earlier version is here .
Today also the Senate Finance committee passed the Senate tax reform bill. See link
Do not yet have the final versions of either bill but suspect that we are not helped in the bills. Will post here final versions when they become available.
Listen to the C-span clip found by BB in which Residence-based taxation is mentioned by Golding and Brady in the House tax bill debate — none of this however, appears to have been incorporated into the House or Senate bills passed on 11/16/2017
Republicans Overseas (RO) continues to press on, to make changes in the final tax package that will help us. The fight is not yet over, but it continues, right from the beginning, to be an uphill battle — and the odds don’t seem very good right now. RO says: “Again we need to focus on the Senate side since this fight is far from over.”
Personally, it makes no sense to me to blame Solomon and the handful of people at Republicans Overseas for trying to make a change and, so far, failing. Yesterday a friend reminded me that there was this Ismene, who kept telling her sister Antigone that it was pointless to even “try”: “…but you’re bound to fail…No sense in starting a hopeless task…Go then, if you are determined, to your folly, etc. etc.” Antigone responded: “When I have tried and failed, [then] I shall have failed.”
Your words are reassuring, USCA.
I know there’s definitely one accounting firm whose services I won’t be using again.
So there’s basically nada for expats and possibly even nasty bits tossed in for them to worry about. In the spirit of homelanders who continue to shrug at the plight of their fellow Americans living overseas and sometimes express disdain and anger towards them, I’ll now say that if US tax reform 2017 is a godsend for the homelanders then I hope it doesn’t get passed. I don’t think RO has anything left in their hat to pull out at this point but if they do then I might retract my snark and accept yet another glimmer of hope. It’s time to focus on our Canadian litigation again and we need to continue to protest the injustice of CBT/FBAR/FATCA wherever the opportunities exist — FB, twitter, comment sections. If we falter now the conclusion will be that we accept what’s been done or we no longer care.
Maybe a laugh will help. I found this on American Expatriates FB.
Douglas Parsons points out a question in the Americans Abroad FAQ:
“I was born in an airplane flying over the USA, am I american?”
Alexander von Pinoci replied:
“Actually, according to US logic, since you were born in an airplane, you are an airplane! Have a nice flight … “
@EmBee
Alexander does often deliver much-needed comic relief!
I cannot easily judge what content will/will not make the new bill. Today (not sure I am seeing “live” or recorded content) the SFC seems to be focused on the American Care Act. They are still going thru the 5 minute comments rather than working on any changes. It is hopelessly too much, too fast and seemingly, with nothing that is going to help us. I think USCA has made a clear case that small private corps owned by expats are not going to experience the excise tax. So we may make it through without any further punitive effects. But this has to be a turning point. No Tax Reform means bad, bad things for those of us in our later decades and people are going to have to make a choice. Pleasant or cheap or not………..
This was just posted at RO FB:
You can read ACA’s statement on the FEIE cap here.
https://www.americansabroad.org/news/aca-statement-on-the-feie/?platform=hootsuite
Sen. Ron Johnson (R-WI) has come out against the tax plan, unless radically revised:
https://www.wsj.com/articles/republican-sen-ron-johnson-opposes-gop-senate-tax-package-1510777290
@Patricia Moon
“But this has to be a turning point. No Tax Reform means bad, bad things for those of us in our later decades and people are going to have to make a choice.”
If the Congress do not effect profound changes to their tax regime, then litigations will be the turning point (especially here in Europe). It is quite shocking that extraterritorial taxation is still being practiced 17 years into the 21st century…
Did some Congresscritter’s staff bring up the FEIE in a private meeting or something? I don’t see anyone calling for it to be raised anymore. (That was a bigger theme ten years ago, and I remain grateful to Greg Meeks, Jim DeMint et al who proposed it in response to Grassley’s “Tax Increase Prevention”, back when no one understood all the other non-FEIE problems AmCitsAbroad mentions.)
But more importantly, talk of FEIE is not “diversionary” as long as it continues to be possible that the diaspora comes out of this “tax reform” exercise with no TTFI plus a Grassley attempt to repeal the FEIE as an “offset” (based on the JCT’s BS revenue estimates of repealing it).
@Duality
Glad to hear that one can expect lawsuits in Europe.
Any in particular that come to mind? I am only aware of France, via the Accidental American group/Fabien Lehagre
MB says
Tax reform 2017 is everything but a godsend.
It is-a gift to huge corporations- one that will not be offset by a larger bump in the economy or trickle down
– a gift to the super rich who will have an increased estate tax deduction
– a gift to the super rich including pumpkin head by abolishing the AMT
– a gift to billionaire hedge fund guys- no repeal of the carried interest deduction
It punishes- residents of blue states- abolishing state tax deductions
– students-limits tuition deduction
– our children and grand children- a huge jump in the deficit- something Repubs railed against for years
-Americans overseas- no relief
-the middle class- see above
This abomination doesn’t deserve to pass. It is being rushed through after 8 years to prepare and they came up with this s**t. No hearings, no thought. Just take it or leave it We have to pass something, anything to appease our donors.
@ DoD
Thanks for listing what’s in tax reform 2017. Looks like it’s the same old same old winners and losers. I haven’t been following what’s in it because I’ve only been looking for what’s apparently not in it — something for expats. They can pass it or not. Either way … shrug.
@ Patricia Moon
“Any in particular that come to mind? I am only aware of France, via the Accidental American group/Fabien Lehagre”
Fatca has been unfolding in a rather fragmented way here in Europe. I, too, am aware of the French initiative, but there was also that successful tribunal brought about by a Dutch-American in the Netherlands back in 2014. However, that alone did not effect any changes in Europe (and I cannot figure out why). At present, there is the French case. And now I am wondering about Greece, where many family members of mine are themselves Accidentals. An IGA was signed just this year (!!!) and has gone into effect just last month (I believe). They are a rowdy bunch and will not put up with any of the hassles that we have been reading on this website…
I pity any American or European who tries to get the Greek bureaucracy to do anything.
Continuing to watch for Heller’s amendments.
Anyone watching House final debate? Deedee told me Holding and Brady mentioned RBT!
@Zla’od
On the other hand, I would be very confident in Greek banks and government being utterly uninterested in and incapable of enforcing FATCA.
“On the other hand, I would be very confident in Greek banks and government being utterly uninterested in and incapable of enforcing FATCA.”
Greeks started getting FATCA letters years back.
Hello, McFly???
ACA tweeted the video where Holding and Brady discuss the merits of RBT this morning:
https://www.c-span.org/video/?c4692161/congressman-holdings-comment-rbt
Good point EmBee!
Have experienced the same response here with regards to FATCA in the US, people don’t care and show disapproval about anything outside the US, especially those charged up with recent political right rhetoric. Interestingly, have been calling people out on their response to the plight of fellow Americans as they have now become enraged by “Double Taxation” with regards to the Removal f the State And Local Tax (SALT) deduction here in the US. Very hypocritical, Americans generally do not care until an issue affects them personally.
When will people learn that our strength is in cooperation / understanding / compassion and becoming united?
Finally, have put in many hours with letters, (taxreform2017@finance.senate.gov submissions also) calls and visits to my representatives, and have come to the conclusion that if one does not show up with millions of dollars in contributions, they too don’t care! Seems like there will be no repeal of FATCA this time around in their proposed “Tax Reform” – It’s all for the Corporations since the election last year!
Am left feeling Disgusted!
EmBee says
November 15, 2017 at 3:17 pm
In the spirit of homelanders who continue to shrug at the plight of their fellow Americans living overseas and sometimes express disdain and anger towards them, I’ll now say that if US tax reform 2017 is a godsend for the homelanders then I hope it doesn’t get passed.
I haven’t been following the blow by blow details. I did, however, run across a twitter thread which I thought neatly encapsulated what “tax reform” is really about – https://twitter.com/SethHanlon/status/927189669888086017. Forgive me if it’s out of date. US citizens overseas could end up losing out to preserve “conservation easements” on golf courses? It all seems rather brutally unfair.
House just passed tax reform bill.
What’s in this version that was just voted on?
@ Stephen Kish
No RBT or a transition tax fix/clarification because they won’t have gone from “exploring” to writing to passing in a matter of hours. Let’s just say everything of importance to expats is in a holding pattern.
“am left feeling disgusted”
Amen to that. I think we have all felt disgusted for years now.
Senate is currently voting on amendments. As would be expected, all have been defeated so far. No mention of Heller yet. He left the room before the voting started.