UPDATE SEPTEMBER 19, 2015: SEE ALSO DISCLAIMER AND LITIGATION UPDATES.
[This post, which began in May and having over 1000 revisions and 2000 comments, is being retired from service and updates. It lived through the success of reaching a total of $500,000 in donations from our kind, dear supporters who had little money to give, the hope and disappointment with the summary trial decision, and the certainty that we are now finally moving on to the Charter trial.]
CANADIAN CHARTER TRIAL UPDATE:
— We have instructed the Arvay team to prepare for the “Constitutional-Charter” trial. This means that our focus now, as it was in the beginning of our lawsuit, is on the Charter trial.
Unless there is a new expense in the future that we have not anticipated, the monies from your donations will be sufficient to take us through the “constitutional-charter” trial in Federal Court. However, to pay other legal bills we will need additional donations from our supporters, and a request for donations will appear on another post soon.
OUR LITIGATION HISTORY:
One year ago, on August 11, 2014, Litigator Joseph Arvay filed a FATCA IGA lawsuit in Canada Federal Court on behalf of Plaintiffs Ginny and Gwen, the Alliance for the Defence of Canadian Sovereignty (en français), and all peoples.
Because of a Government delay we initiated a “summary trial”, using a portion of the arguments, which offered the possibility of preventing private banking information from being turned over to the IRS before September 30, 2015. See Alliance’s Claims, our Alliance blog, and AUGUST 4-5 SUMMARY TRIAL FILINGS in LITIGATION UPDATES.
PatCanadian sent me an email about possible delay of trial. I live in Van so it does no matter I can go anytime but my cousin is visiting from Bellingham with her husband that weekend (to see the fireworks) and I invited them to come the first morning. It could let them see how justice in Canada is served (*not*). This tactic will reduce the number who can attend.
Another ‘Happy Hearing’ greeting on its way – not going far so snail mail should work.
Very evil delaying tactics on the part of the Harper government and the Canadian taxpayer funded lawyers and bureaucrats who do its unjust bidding – AT OUR EXPENSE AS TAXPAYERS.
Perhaps they’d like this to be delayed until after the election. Perhaps they are just throwing up any barrier at all in order to try to wear us out and stretch our resources – since they command ALL of our tax revenues to misuse and abuse us with.
They are just proving that NOTHING they have done re the FATCA IGA has been in good faith. It has all been rigged – USING OUR HARD EARNED CANADIAN TAX DOLLARS to boot – extracted from OUR hard work and savings. What a TRAVESTY it is to be tormented using your own tax monies.
Now that is the true crime.
And,
Justice delayed is Justice denied.
Let’s show them that we may be small, but we are MANY, MIGHTY, MAD and MOTIVATED!!!
Donate NOW – we canNOT let the FATCAnatics dirty tactics win the day.
http://www.adcs-adsc.ca/DonateADCS.html
(Shaking my head…)
America has lost the plot in constructing this madness. Practicing residence-based taxation would have been far cheaper and so humane. All this fiscal carnage to achieve nothing…
Re: adjournment
The Canadian govt passed this law with no debate, no consideration of Canadian citizens, disregarded the Charter, ignored the advice of experts, etc. Now they need an adjournment? For what purpose? To review the 100,000 documents that should have been reviewed prior to passing the law? I’m sorry, I’m no legal expert but this sounds like great argument for an injunction. How can they pass a law, and not be able to defend it because they don’t know enough about it? This makes my blood boil! I hope the Arvay team is prepared to fight this.
Gutted….angry……..and I am not a Canadian in Canada!!!!!
Back for my rare visit.
“Tricia Moon says
June 16, 2015 at 4:13 pm
@GeorgeIII
.
There simply are no grounds for the US to request a list of donors from Paypal. We have no tax or reporting requirement to the US. And we are compliant with the appropriate laws required by the Not-For-Profit Act as well as CRA that do apply to us in Canada. As far as I know, there is no law that says we may not accept donations; nor is there one to say we cannot accept donations for a lawsuit.
It is not that your information is not appreciated GeorgeIII, we understand where you are coming from. However, it is not helpful when other points of view are more or less “dismissed” by comments indicating anything beyond accepting the content outright is a waste of your time. And again, is the value of this information enough to justify a negative effect on donations?”
Failure to pay US income & FBAR is a criminal offense. What percentage of contributors people have not filed taxes? The more successful the lawsuit, the more likely Obama will have it investigated.
I know something about corporate responsibilities and ignoring a warning can lead to lawsuits. Even condo association have board of director insurance. I am not certain about your type of association. The least you should do is issue a warning. It would very easy for paypal to have a lists of donors.
Use of a low value checking account (secondary account) is the best option.
I have issued warning on other items
Use of Computershares Canada & Canadian Tire financial they keep their records in USA.
Use of tweeter by Maple Sandbox.
Please note I have issued warning at Maple Sandbox about putting too much money (over 100K) in a credit union because of housing bubble and provincial government huge budget deficit. Unlike Federal Government it does not print money. The housing bubble is even worse with the lowering of interest rates.
If Lynn wants to look at record of June 2014 she can see who asked when was contrubuted fund going to be set up. Within a number of hours that fund was set up.
People can look back at my comment of April 2015 to Dash about the full problem. That was not the first time I warned about paypal.
Does anybody who is not tax compliant want a Paypal account your birth date, SIN and bank account information is there.
I was never an US citizen, but I do not want a Paypal account because everything is being hacked in USA.
George re: ” Gutted….angry……..and I am not a Canadian in Canada!!!!!”
Sometimes, when I read your comments, I almost think that you ARE a Canadian in Canada. 🙂
I feel bad for everyone who bought plane tickets and booked hotels….crossing fingers trial will not be delayed.
@George3,
There are lots of us who have no doubt made it easy for the US government to find out who we are, and not because of PayPal. I really don’t care. I mean seriously, what is anyone going to do? Extradite us to the USA. I’m more worried about identity theft (had two credit cards compromised within the last year which had nothing to do with PayPal I don’t think) than being outed as a non-filing US taxpayer living outside USA.
Oh, and SIN is not on PayPal is it?
No SIN is not on PayPal. Neither is bank account information. Instead, it is credit card information.
There are other ways to donate to ADCS if you don’t want to use PayPal. Have you used any of those options GeorgeIII?
Why am I not surprised at the government’s latest move?
Remember, this is the government that calls us “American citizens abiding in Canada.” This is the government that says “Congress has spoken.” This is the government that refused to consider an amendment to protect Canadian citizens and residents.
This is the government that is fighting disabled veterans, sick new mothers, a disabled aboriginal mother with a severely disabled teen son, Canadian citizens living outside Canada, the Supreme Court Chief Justice and us.
This is the government that passed a law giving it the right to deport Canadian citizens who have the right to citizenship of another country–even if those citizens were born in Canada.
This is the government that passed Bill C51 giving it unprecedented power to snoop into the private lives of Canadians.
This is the government Stephen Harper promised in 2006 when he said “You won’t recognize Canada when I’m through with it.”
This is the government that will make this as long, costly and brutal for us as they possibly can.
Our only recourse is to keep fighting back. Please donate to help bring back the Canada you recognize.
Thank you Blaze for summarizing so well just how nasty a creature Harper is.
Blaze says, “Remember, this is the government that calls us “American citizens abiding in Canada.” “.
We will have no support from our fellow Canadians unless we are viewed as “Canadians living in Canada”, which is why I bitch about this all the time.
In the words of Winston Churchhill:
“Never give in–never, never, never, never, in nothing great or small, large or petty, never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense. Never yield to force; never yield to the apparently overwhelming might of the enemy.”
Or more practically,
“If you’re going through hell, keep going.”
As I posted on the Goat Rodeo Roundup thread:
@Whitekat, “Sometimes, when I read your comments, I almost think that you ARE a Canadian in Canada. ”
Flattery will get you everywhere.
I spent much of my youth in Canada.
As a young man, I dreamed of some day moving to Canada but could never figure how within the law. So I ended up elsewhere, happy nonetheless.
But recently learned because of changes in Canadian Law that I am in fact now a Canadian Citizen though I have no passport and likely will not get one as I have become a single passport kind of guy though I am entitled to four.
@WhiteKat, “We will have no support from our fellow Canadians unless we are viewed as “Canadians living in Canada”, which is why I bitch about this all the time.”
I pray that Ginny and Gwen when they are deposed and in the Court Room, a Court Room with the flag of Canada, a Court Room with a picture of our Queen, Her Majesty Queen Elizabeth II, that they and their legal counsel object in the strongest terms when they are called US Citizen!!
To call a Canadian Citizen in Canada ANYTHING other than Canadian reeks of discrimination and is disgusting.
@Blaze, ” This is the government that refused to consider an amendment to protect Canadian citizens and residents.”
Disregarding that you and I have a cordial debate on the resident issue which is based on tactical considerations not on substantive considerations.
I think it is more powerful to state;
This is the government that refused to consider an amendment to protect Canadian citizens at home in Canada from attack by a foreign power. Canada has an obligation to protect its citizens abroad and an obligation to protect its citizens at home.
I will only really answer this and I do not want to waste more time
“Blaze
No SIN is not on PayPal. Neither is bank account information. Instead, it is credit card information.”
Cash to cash transaction requires confirming bank account & giving SIN our national tax ID
numbershttps://community.ebay.com/t5/Archive-PayPal/Do-I-have-to-give-PayPal-my-SSN/qaq-p/10116345
“What is the problem? • Dec 16, 2012: As of April, 2012, new Federal Regulations require Money Service Businesses, such as PayPal, to verify the identity of a customer before we can provide various services or product offerings. As a result, PayPal must ensure we have collected and verified important data such as customer name, address, date of birth, and national tax ID or social security number. Because we were not able to fully confirm your identity based on your current account information, we need to request additional supporting documentation from you.
You will continue to have full access to your PayPal account, but until we are able to confirm your identity, we may be unable to process certain types of customer initiated requests such as adding funds to your PayPal account.
(Your case ID for this reason is *omitted*.)”
—————————————————————– —————
“Default Paypal Canada asking for SIN
I opened a pp Canada account yesterday and noticed that paypal is asking for your SIN. This is currently optional but it is the first time I have seen this.”
http://www.aspkin.com/forums/canada-ebay-discussions/60601-paypal-canada-asking-sin.html
Is the organization paying the cost of credit card fee and paypal fees?
Cash transaction have no fees but they require banking information and national taxpayer ID
If you just do visa payment through your paypal and are not verified you may not have SIN number but they have birth date address and various other things
You can try and pay merchant without a paypal account but paypal does have your name and credit card
Why does someone go through a new paypal account opening?
Seriously, if we really think about it the IRS is terribly short staffed. I doubt very much if they are going through all the existing Pay Pal accounts to find a few little minnows that don’t owe any tax. Paranoia is reaching great heights these days. Have faith in the intelligent legal Eagles we’ve hired. It seems Stevie’s bandits are running scared now and have nowhere to go except hide. They had a chance to make this right. They wouldn’t listen so they’re are listening now. Too late! It’s our turn to turn the tide and turn the tide we will.
@ Ann…I totally agree about the paranoia! However, I understand it. I am furious that we all have had to feel scared and paranoia. I am just waiting to get that election call wanting my support and vote! No support, no vote! I WILL MAKE SURE THAT THE CALLER KNOWS IT’S BECAUSE OF FATCA!
This may be an explanation from the Australian govt as to why the CDN is trying to delay(re: election)
The caretaker conventions may affect the way litigation involving the Commonwealth should be handled and the application of the conventions should be considered on a case-by-case basis. The conventions do not displace the overarching obligation to act to protect the interests of the Commonwealth. Responsibility for observing the conventions ultimately rests with the agency head and the following principles should be taken into account before making decisions on how litigation is to be handled.
• If possible, the taking of substantive steps in legal proceedings that would materially commit an incoming government should be deferred until after the conclusion of the caretaker period, taking into account the circumstances of the matter. In some cases, it may be appropriate to seek an adjournment from the court or tribunal, or seek consent from the other party to delay settlement negotiations, until the result of the election is known.
@Tim – I am quite sure that your Aussie explanatory piece is similar to the situation in Canada. In this case however, I believe that the Govt is dragging feet to get the evil deed done BEFORE the court can hear the matter … to transfer data on all “US Persons” before the court can stop it … and then if they lose they simply say “Sorry”. The irreparable harm would have been done. These Politicians and Bureaucrats have no honour whatsoever.
This was one of several updates posted today on the “Proceeding Queries” site. Can anyone translate this for me? Is there any hint in this of asking for a delay/adjournment or does it verify that the summary trial will be held on August 4th, as scheduled? Whatever could this Motion within a Motion be that isn’t “returnable” until August 4th?
http://cas-ncr-nter03.cas-satj.gc.ca/IndexingQueries/infp_RE_info_e.php?court_no=T-1736-14
RE: my comment above
It sure looks to me like Joseph Arvay is proceeding as normal to the trial date so probably nothing has been presented regarding a delay … to date. OTOH I guess the defendant’s lawyer can just spring this delay thing on the judge on August 4th too. If they do this then I hope the judge will be inclined to dismiss the request. Maybe it’s best to not try to guess … wait and see … wait and see.