After reading the completely unacceptable response to MP Ted Hsu’s order paper question (OPQ 816), WhiteKat decided to reach out, once again (in spite of previous communications being unsatisfying) and this time, write her story from the heart. Her MP, the Hon. John Baird is the Minister of Foreign Affairs, the Department that provided this “response.”
I thought it deserved a thread of its own as this letter is a real gem.
WhiteKat:
“Its been awhile since I’ve emailed/mailed any government reps. I was inspired by a comment, written by Stephen Arvay on the Allison Christians post.”
If you have two to four hours to watch the “Stupid Bowl” coming up on Sunday, then you have a few hours per week to read, be informed and write your representatives. We must put the pressure on in volumes of letter, emails, faxes, phone calls!
“I hope lots of you do the same! Yes, the lawsuit is important, but we cannot stop our bitching either!”
“Here is my latest to my MP John Baird.”
I am writing to you about the FATCA IGA with the USA, that was signed by the Conservative government in Feb 2014.
I am very, very sad and totally disillusioned. I cannot believe I have lived in such an innocent state of unknowing for nearly 1/2 a century in that I thought Canada would protect ALL her citizens from foreign threats – not just a subset of them.
Apparently, I am a second class Canadian citizen. You really have no idea how horrible this feels unless it happens to you. It is a living nightmare that I stress about every single day. The last two Canada Days, I have found myself in tears. And if it can happen to me, it can happen to any Canadian.
I don’t remember the first 20 months or so of my life, which was spent in the USA while my Canadian parents lived there. I haven’t got an American bone in my body, but had the misfortune to be born on US soil. I’ve lived and worked only in Canada since moving back ‘home’ as a toddler.
Can you imagine the shock I went through just over two years ago, when I heard about FATCA and discovered that not only was I a delinquent US tax-filer, but was also required to report my Canadian accounts to the FINANCIAL CRIMES ENFORCEMENT NETWORK every year? And worse, my own country was going to shine a light on me so that the IRS would have knowledge of my existence, along with the private details of my bank accounts, most of which are held jointly with my 100% pure Canadian husband. He was not too pleased to say the least, and this has caused big rifts in our marriage.
Please help Mr Baird. I have done nothing wrong, unless to be born on US soil is a crime. How was I to know all these years, that USA was unique in the world with its byzantine ‘place of birth’ taxation laws? I have paid all taxes ever owed to the Canadian government and have been a law abiding citizen and productive member of Canadian society for over 50 years.
I am seriously stressing out, and at age 52 this is not good for my health. I have NO IDEA what to do. I cannot afford the financial costs to get into good standing with the IRS. I estimate 15-20K as I have lots of low-value Passive Foreign Income Corporations (i.e. Canadian mutual funds), several RESPS (one for each of my 3 children), several small RRSPS, and a TFSA (all considered foreign trusts).
Although I thought I was being a responsible parent and adult, saving for my children’s education and my retirement, I have in fact caused nothing but huge problems for myself and family.
I am scared to death of the penalties that IRS will assess for my not reporting my and my husband’s so-called ‘foreign accounts’ to the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network, which is what will happen when my financial institution reports me to the CRA under FATCA.
Did you know that the penalties for not filing FBARS (FOREIGN bank account reports) for my CANADIAN accounts are 50% of the value of the account for each of the last 6 years (i.e. 300% of the value of the account)?
Will the Canadian government take care of my husband and me after we hand over our life savings to the US government?
I would love to renounce US citizenship, but this does not relieve me of past compliance requirements for US tax reporting and FBARs, and in fact puts a red X on me for the IRS. Not only that, but renunciation is expensive! In 2008 it was free. In 2010 it was $450, and in 2014 it was raised to an unbelievable $2,350 (US dollars). I believe Canada charges $100 to renounce Canadian citizenship and that it can be done by mail.
So basically, I am damned if I do, and damned if I don’t. There is NO painless way out of the mess I am in, yet I am just a decent person trying to live an average life. Why is this happening to me? Why is my government not protecting me? Why is it handing me over to the USA which will allow it to literally destroy me and my Canadian born spouse and children?
I don’t know which is worse – the threat of financial devastation from the USA simply for spending the first 20 months of my life there, or the horrible feeling that the ground I thought was beneath my feet all these decades was never really there! Sometimes, I think it is the latter – it is that soul destroying.
Please, is there someone in the Conservative party who actually cares about the millions of Canadians who are suffering like I and my family are, or is everyone just concerned about keeping their jobs and their pensions? I have truly lost faith in Canadian government.
Very sad second-class Canadian
Kxxxxxxx Pxxxx (name not withheld from Mr. Baird)
Nepean ON
@Bubblebustin
Thanks to you and others for your comments. I guess each person’s circumstances are different (a friend spent $60,000 in fees and penalties to comply because he has two daughters and other family in the US and feared not being able to visit. He now regrets doing so and wishes he had just flown under the radar or at least waited for a better disclosure deal). On the mobility question, I guess I’ll start to worry in earnest when there’s evidence that State and ICE are talking to the IRS. Since I had a US passport mailed to my home (I was told long before this current crackdown that I must have one for travel to the US) at least one US government department knows where I am. In any case, with no business interests or family in the US, I’m in a better situation than many and there are worse fates than not wanting to risk travel south of the border. Bottom line, I’m more disappointed in Ottawa than I am in Washington.
DMichael, Thank you for your comment.
The ‘what’s the big deal?’ attitude you’ve so clearly expressed is exactly what has allowed FATCA to get as far as it has here in Canada and throughout the world.
I don’t have a crystal ball any more than you do, but I can think of lots of things that should cause you to be afraid which have already been discussed extensively in many posts here at Brock. Have you read much here?
By the way, fear is a healthy emotion, and not one to be ashamed of. It doesn’t necessarily send us cowering or hiding or result in bad decision making; it can inspire us to fight and take action against real threats as bravery and fear are not mutually exclusive.
@WhiteKat – No worries I’m firmly in the FATCA OFF camp.
@DMichael
It sounds as though your friend entered an early amnesty program where minnows were assessed fines and penalties (you didn’t mention tax) but cannot have them refunded because they signed closing agreements with the IRS. The fact that the IRS will allow reasonable cause to waive or reimburse penalties is making a lot of people regret having entered any amnesty programs prior to the 2011 OVDI, when minnows began opting out into the Streamlined. The thing is though, the IRS may forgive penalties, but not tax and interest on the tax, so if you have a significant undisclosed tax liability outside of the Streamlined years, there’s a pretty good chance the IRS will discover it. Note: there’s no statute of limitation,on unfiled tax returns. The scariest question the IRS agent asked us was “What was the source of funds in your FBAR’s?” Of course we’d disclosed everything, but you’d have to have nerves of steel in trying to fly one by them. That’s the exact situation that Boris Johnson found himself in, and how Streamlined or just going forward would not have made a difference to either of us. As my lawyer said, “Streamlined doesn’t offer you anything you wouldn’t have without it”.
Also, the longer you wait, the more difficult it is to prove your behaviour wasn’t wilful.
Well said, WhiteKat.
WhiteKat, my heart is with you.
One commenter asks if this is biting satire. I ask is this type of Conservative majority government procedure what Canadian journalists and we are up against: http://thetyee.ca/News/2015/01/31/Inside_Orwellian_Launch_Tories_Anti_Terrorism_Act/?
@WhiteKat
My approach is not so much “what’s the big deal”, which sounds rather cavalier, but a real and healthy concern (or you can call it fear) over how I, as a Canadian since birth and an accidental USA citizen living in Canada, might be vulnerable to financial penalties, travel restrictions or other encumbrances imposed by what I consider a foreign government. I have indeed read a lot on this site over the last three or four years and, as suggested in my original post, have not yet found answers to all my questions. (I feel a Rumsfeldian known unknowns/unknown unknowns jabberwok coming on). And in the end, I would rather harness a healthy fear against something known rather than something unknown and potentially harmless. That’s why I’m still looking for answers, though they may not be out there, while not giving up the fight at the same time.
@Bubblebustin
My understanding is that my friend, who started his compliance process in 2010, owed about $448 in tax and the rest was either all penalties, principally FBAR, or penalties and accounting/legal fees combined. I don’t know if he signed a closing agreement but understand he has made representations about getting the penalties reduced in light of subsequent “amnesties” but has been met with silence.
@DMichael
I can’t imagine what approach your friend took, but I was never assessed FBAR penalties in the 2011 OVDI, therefore didn’t need to seek a refund of them.
“But let there be no misunderstanding: we will not be intimidated. Canada will never be intimidated.”
Prime Minister Stephen Harper, Oct. 22, 2014
Within weeks, Harper’s posture as a “never-intimidated” tough guy is re-confirmed:
52. The Impugned Provisions [in Canada’s law implementing the FATCA IGA] are reasonably necessary to achieve the [goal] of relieving Canadian financial institutions and their clients of the potential for crippling tax and commercial consequences of non-compliance with FATCA….”
Harper Government’s Response to ADCS claim, Nov. 10, 2014
No, wait…. Ah, I have it: “crippling tax and commercial consequences” aren’t intimidation….
@Bubblebustin
I may have misunderstood him … I know his filing was a tad complicated because he founded and owned a business here and went decades not knowing he was required to file to the IRS (not unlike a lot of his generation who moved here in the 70s and took out citizenship). Anyway, he’s still out the money and that remains a travesty.
Exactly, Shovel.
US sanctions all over the world / consequences for not complying with the blackmail of “Congress has spoken” all over the world are meant to intimidate by crippling other economies. Stephen Harper talks out of both sides of his mouth over and over and over and over again – many issues.
@DMichael re: ” I feel a Rumsfeldian known unknowns/unknown unknowns jabberwok coming on”
Would you like some “hyperbolic jingoism” to go along with that? 🙂
Usually, when I leave my house I lock the door. Its not that I imagine all sorts of frightening “unknown unknowns”, or don’t trust my neighbour, or think that a bad guy is going to just happen to walk by and decide to check if my door is unlocked. Similarly when I purchase something online with a credit card, I clear my cache afterwards.
I take these precautions because, well…’shit happens’ when we don’t take care to keep ourselves from being vulnerable to the ‘bad guys’. Whether or nor we can predict exactly what shit might happen is irrelevant.
One can never be too vigilant when it comes to one’s private banking information. Ever heard of identity theft? – this is not one of the “unknown unknowns” you refer to, and happens with increasing regularity. The IRS has definite, well documented problems keeping US taxpayers’ information safe from the ‘bad guys’. The Canadian government is without a doubt, KNOWINGLY putting Canadians at risk of identity theft by sending our private financial information to the IRS.
Besides the real KNOWN threat of identity theft, do you really trust that our government has enough balls left to resist further twisting by the USA, and will make good on its promise to us not to collect IRS assessed penalties/ taxes, when it has already blatantly violated our Charter rights by agreeing to send the private financial information of a subset of Canadians to a foreign government?
Do you realistically think that the IRS will be happy to have the information it needs to assess penalties/taxes, and yet be content not to actually collect them?
Again, I have no crystal ball, but leaving the door of the chicken coop open when you KNOW there is a wolf outside, is asking for trouble.
@WhiteKat
Good point about our feckless government caving a second time … which in turn bolsters your point about the IRS seizing the opportunity with glee. As I said, I’m even more outraged by Ottawa than I am by Washington. Wolves tend to run in packs and at least one is sporting a red maple leaf.
Having lived my first year of life in a “chicken coop” (on Canadian soil) I think I can comment on your metaphor, WhiteKat. I know I am living in a chicken coop again and worse yet the door got jammed open by Bill C-31. It won’t be budged, until the ADCS lawsuit is won. All I can do (or is it doo-doo?) is put a big pile of chicken shit on the threshold and hope the big bad wolf slips while trying to gain entry.
BTW, it’s true. The tiny house my parents rented during my first year of my life was converted into a chicken coop right after we moved out. The floor was too cold to put a baby down to crawl so I was confined to a crib and I had to wait until we moved to be able to walk. Dad said I was so happy to be released that I bypassed walking and went straight to running.
@DMichael,
I also am way more angry at the Canadian government than the American government, just as I would be with someone I thought was a friend or family member, who in reality did not have my back.
The US government is the wolf. The Canadian government is my neighbour who promised to watch my chicken coop while I was gone, but didn’t care enough to check that the barn door was shut, and came up with all sorts of excuses for forgetting.
@WhiteKat
Good one … I’m going to steal it for barroom arguments.
Just say no.
I’m not sure if this is the place to post this, but I just saw a story on W5 about a Vancouver businessman named Steve de Jaray and it made me think about WhiteKat’s question whether anyone in the Conservative government cares about the suffering they are causing. Basically, in that situation, de Jaray (and his daughter) were wrongfully prosecuted by CBSA to curry favored trading status with the US. The US connection was only discovered through WikiLeaks. After the government basically ruined this man’s life (he lost his $30 million business), he sued and they settled – his settlement was second only to Maher Arar’s. He got around ten million dollars. Does the Harper government care about any of us? We are just bargaining chips used to curry favour with the Obama administration.
http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/01/31/ottawa-pays-10m-plus-to-wrongly-accused-businessman.html
Sorry if I posted this on the wrong thread.
@WhiteKat
Thank you for sharing your story and letter. It must be sent and herd.
I have some suggestions for the letter that you may consider to help, in my view, the potential for the letter and message to be better heard.
I am thinking that your MP gets lots of letters. So then how best to make it and key points stand out. Like a news item you might put a headline in there that would be memorable and sums it all up in a nutshell. Let me try a few:
The Terror of the FATCA IGA : The Canadian Government Does Not Care About Canadians
The Terror of the FATCA IGA: The Canadian Government Not There to Help Citizens
The Terror of The FATCA IGA: Canadian Government Full Ostrich
FATCA IGA : Canadian Government Acts as The 51st State and Ignores Terror of its Citizens
Canadian Government Supports Terrorism of its Own Citizens, via: FATCA IGA
These may be more memorable/impactive. You might use bold, bring up the font size, and add a bit of colour.
Your letter appears a bit long. You might bold a few key points.
You might consider bringing in a few legal points such as Canadian Charter and Canadian Sovereignty.
Call to action: What action do you want?
How about asking for Please Help By: Publicly Supporting the Alliance for the Defence of Canadian Sovereignty http://www.adcs-adsc.ca/
All the above may dilute the personal story appeal of your letter. Isaac Brockians will likely read the whole letter – yet the expectation may be a skimming speed reader in the MP’s office, and lets hope that that person gets lots of these letters and reports this fact to the MP.
You might add something about that you are highly likely to be single issue voter and vote for any party who champions Canadian Sovereignty and stands for Canadian citizens against the extraterritorial FATCA IGA.
Canadian Cop,
Thanks for the link to the disturbing piece on Vancouver businessman, Steve deJaray. It absolutely fits in with the WhiteKat’s letter to her Conservative MP Baird thread and the bigger question — Does the Harper government care about any of us (will she even get an answer?)? Harper’s strings are pulled and we are Harper’s pawns (one definition of which is “a person serving as security; a hostage”).
No, they don’t care. Someone posted somewhere here last week and I posted at Maole Sandbox that the Cons have spent $700,000 (so far!) fighting disabled veterans in the courts. This is a group they profess to love.
Today, Globe and Mail is reporting that they have spend $1.3 million fighing sick new Moms in the courts.
http://ottawacitizen.com/news/politics/federal-government-spends-almost-700000-fighting-disabled-afghan-veterans-in-court
How can anyone read that and think they care.
How could anyone in Ottawa read the submissions Canadians made and support the FATCA IGA. They could do it because they don’t care.
Here are the submssions that I obtained through an ATI request. These were not shared with MPs before they voted. Finance Canada delayed providing them to me until after the vote was taken in the House of Commons. All parties were aware these submissions were requested by Finance and submitted by Canadians. I do not know if any MPs asked to see them.
http://maplesandbox.ca/2014/here-is-what-canadians-said-on-fatca-iga-the-cons-didnt-listen/
@JC, thanks for the tips. When/if I send my letter out to anyone else, besides my new MP, I will keep your helpful suggestions in mind.
@DMichael re: “Good one … I’m going to steal it for barroom arguments. ”
Whatever works for you dude.
@Blaze thanks for that link on submissions in regard to the Canadian IGA. I liked the idea of some sort of depository of stories of the injustices accessible on the web. This comes quite close to what I was looking for.