Frustration, exhaustion, and a sense of impending disaster appear to lurk among those Brockers and Sandboxers who have had FATCA on their minds more frequently in a day than teenagers think about sex. We are at a crossroads here in Canada. Our Conservative government is about to make history; we all feel it here in this place we call the Isaac Brock Society, which is much more than just a website. We all hope that the history our government is about to make is the ‘right’ one.
Many citizens of the world, not just Canadians, have contributed their individual talents, and personal attributes in countless ways to educate those who do not understand FATCA, which is no easy task! It is not my intention for this post to name them all, or describe what they have done, but we know, and they know, and everyone reading this who values human rights and freedoms knows.
Sadly, we are not there yet. Most Canadians have never heard of FATCA. Most people in the world have never heard of FATCA, nor have they heard of citizenship based taxation. Intuitively, almost everyone gets it that it is unfair to tax people who do not live in the taxing country, and do not earn income there. Unfortunately, most people don’t connect the dots between the bad, unfair things that happen to ‘other people’ with the bad, unfair things that could happen to them.
Our job is to educate the masses, so that our voice becomes much LOUDER. We have been trying, but people in Canada, and the USA are easily distracted with things such as the antics of Rob Ford. How sad is it that little media attention was paid to a group of Canadian citizens who spent 2 days in the cold demonstrating on 18 inches of curb outside a meeting held by Canadian bankers who were discussing how to smoke out the ‘US Persons’ among us?
It is not over people. We haven’t lost. And we are not going to. We have accomplished too much to give up now. However, Mr, and Mrs, Joe Canadian are still asleep in front of their computers and TV sets. If they could hear us, they would be on our side, and at our defense. We have a voice that Canadian politicians and bankers, and US politicians and bankers, have definitely heard. They fear us, as they should, and they hope we will go away so that Mr and Mrs Joe Canadian don’t ever wake up. We won’t go away!
So, how do we get the critical mass that we need to effect change? I don’t have the answers, but I am confident that the group does. Every day, as the ripple of knowledge spreads, more and more individuals discover the group of people at IsaacBrockSociety and come to us full of passion, and talent to offer in this fight.
For example, someone whose name I won’t mention because I am not sure if he/she wants me to, took our Canadian FATCA fact sheet and used his/her graphic design skills to transform a bunch of words into something eye catching and alarming. Check out the PDF version of the Canadian FATCA fact sheet linked to on our side bar. Maybe someone else can come up with a WORD version. Imagine if everyone across Canada saw it! Imagine if 10,000 people saw it, and .01% of those decided to participate in a public demonstration against FATCA. Imagine 100 people in a public demonstration at Parliament Hill. Do you think anyone would notice? I think they would.
@Polly,
I take that back. Even with RBT, FATCA is a monster, just less deadly. If there was no threat of 30% withholding, and things were truly negotiable, then maybe FATCA would be acceptable.
Again, the best way for the US government to hear your voice is to speak directly to them.
tax_reform@finance.senate.gov
Submissions will be accepted until January 14, 2014.
@WhiteKat, I agree with the position you take above http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/11/20/critical-mass-and-fatca/comment-page-2/#comment-694922 on priorities re fighting to prevent Canada from signing on to FATCA, vs. switching the priority to fighting for RBT – also for the reasons you describe so very clearly. We need to fight back the imposition of FATCA because it extends CBT into Canada via changes to Canadian laws, with Canada as a signatory and a direct arm of IRS and Treasury reporting – using Canadian tax money to do so. Canada is not a signatory to US CBT, although it says it ‘respects’ the US ‘right’ to determine its own tax system. And Canada has no actual powers to interfere with US domestic laws, only has the power and sovereignty and autonomy to determine how to respond on Canadian soil so far as it affects Canadian citizens and residents.
We do need also to pursue RBT in order to stop the US from continuing to force ‘US taxable status’ on our children born and living outside the US, and in order to free those abroad that the US punishes for life and holds as tax hostages by refusing to allow minors and those deemed ‘incompetent’ to exercise the same international human right to choose/reject a citizenship. They hold our children and dependents hostage – which then binds their non-US guardians and parents as well. Many others may not ever be able to successfully renounce and obtain a CLN anyway without obliteration – unless RBT with a simpler exit process is created. All indications are that the US is bi-partisan in the regular hysterical efforts and support for continuing to make renouncing/relinquishing as difficult as possible.
The fight to get RBT instituted could be a lengthy process with a flawed or limited and complex result – knowing the IRS and Treasury works (ex. see restrictions and lack of clarity around the ‘Streamlined’ process for example). They never do anything simply or without additional pitfalls. Witness the history of the fight to get our RRSPs exempted from US double taxation as ‘foreign trusts’ – even when the IRS finally agreed. The US-Canada tax treaty exempts them, but the US still insists on deeming them reportable and taxable foreign trusts if the annual treaty election isn’t made faithfully every year for each and every individual RRSP account, for the life of the RRSP.
@Polly; FATCA is not called the Super FBAR or Son of FBAR for nothing. They deliberately constructed FATCA for individuals to get around the limitations of the FBAR, and it extends or nullifies SOLs, and FATCA for the FIs reports on transactions, deposits, withdrawals, etc. – which goes far beyond the reporting required on the FBAR. FATCA includes many accounts which are not even taxable, or included in the FBAR – such as private pension plan accounts with only future and contingent distributions, undistributed life insurance, etc.
@badger
With RBT, America will lose its incentive for FATCA:
And I am not talking working on the US government to change CBT, but calling other nations to express their own discontent with this form of taxation which is not used by any other country in the world except Eritrea. And if USA itself can condemn Eritrea for doing so,who is to say that Europe and Russia, Asia and all other countries cannot do the same to America?
@Polly, I don’t think so. FATCA was enacted in the first place to go after rich tax cheat homelanders – an emotional response to the scandals that happened in 2009 with Switzerland.
I don’t think they gave a single thought to the Americans living abroad, accidentals, etc…
Even with RBT, the incentive is still there. I still believe they didn’t need FATCA. They’re doing a pretty good job and getting great results with John Doe summons and going after banks in real tax havens. They should have just pursued this avenue. FATCA was opening the Pandora box to some unexpected negative consequences they didn’t think about. Stupid politicians acting on emotion and not rationally.
http://www.eduardomorgan.com/blog/?p=2456
Andrew Quinlan (Center for Freedom and Prosperity) posted a link to this article on his website. Has anyone written to the OECD about this issue? The Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development pushes member countries to follow global economic norms. CBT most certainly is not a global norm.
@ all: Here’s a remarkable blog outlining the FATCA situation, which I found whilst making an unrelated tech search:
http://www.synergy-software.com/blog/?p=3316 “FATCA what does it mean for the U.A.E.?”, dated September 22nd, 2013 by Stephen Jones.
The author’s clear and thorough account applies far beyond the U.A.E. He vividly describes the turmoil which is gripping us worldwide (including in the U.S), in a balanced manner that I think both FATCA novices and seasoned Brockers can relate to.
It begins with the words “FATCA released shock waves among Americans overseas….”
To it’s author, a big “thank you” – and if you happen to be here on IBS – which I feel you might be – then thank you again. It feels wonderful to have to the story told out loud so clearly….
– even if it has to do with marketing software….
@Chris
I think most homelanders with offshore accounts have come forward. What better could happen to them than one of the special programs they can enlist into. No – now FATCA is after those ca. 7 million expats and the revenue penalties will bring. With RBT that incentive would die.
FATCA is the symptom. The FBAR penalty structure is the weapon that is the most dangerous, also with how it is connected to OVDP. The FBAR penalty structure should be eliminated for immigrants and emigrants. This can be argued with the US media.
CBT and its principles are of course the source of the problem, and would be the end goal, but after taking on that which is fightable.
FATCA is likely to be fought inside USA, and if it gets going it will be a circus like Obamacare, with the difference that the media loves FATCA. Taking on the FATCA is like skirmishing at the Maginot line—very difficult. The FBAR penalties can be fought without resistance from the media.