The FATCA Question — this needs to be answered by the Conservative Government of Canada and aired in the media before any IGA is signed. Your turn Mr. Harper, Mr. Flaherty, Mr. Shoom.
Thanks to Tim for this — and especially thanks to MP Ted Hsu.
(I will have a hand-out of the Q-121 at the mini-demonstration in conjunction with the October 31, November 1, November 2 Conservative Convention in Calgary.)
ADDITION, October 29: I’m adding to this post (for use in forwarding to government representatives, media, etc.) the COMBINED Q-121 and Q-127 in PDF format in more a readable form (questions asked in the Canadian Parliament on October 25, 2013 by MP Ted Hsu and October 28, 2013 by MP Scott Brison, respectively). Canadian Parliament FATCA Questions 121 and 127 – Oct 25,28 20133
Questions
Q-1212 — October 25, 2013 — Mr. Hsu (Kingston and the Islands) — With regard to the implementation of the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA):
(a) what steps has Canada undertaken to complete an Inter-Governmental Agreement (IGA) with the United States;
(b) with what type of legal instrument will the government enact a FATCA implementation agreement;
(c) will the government bring an IGA before Parliament and, if so, in what form;
(d) what steps are in place to ensure parliamentary review of an IGA;
(e) what studies have been undertaken as to whether an IGA can be implemented as an interpretation of the existing double tax treaty;
(f) in what ways will the government involve Parliament in any process to amend interpretation of the double taxation treaty;
(g) who is involved in the process indicated in (a);
(h) by what criteria is the government evaluating any proposed IGA with the US;
(i) who established the criteria in (h),
(ii) on what date,
(iii) under what authority;(j) is a draft IGA currently being negotiated, and if so, what is the status of said negotiations;
(k) when will the draft IGA be made public;
(l) will the public be consulted for input on any agreement, and if so, by what means;
(m) with which specific individuals and groups did the Minister of National Revenue consult regarding FATCA, and on what dates;
(n) with which specific individuals and groups did the Minister of National Revenue consult regarding any IGA, and on what dates;
(o) with which specific individuals and groups did the Minister of Finance consult regarding FATCA, and on what dates;
(p) with which specific individuals and groups did the Minister of Finance consult regarding any IGA, and on what dates;
(q) what studies and analyses has the Department of Finance undertaken with respect to FATCA;
(r) what studies and analyses has the Department of National Revenue undertaken with respect to FATCA;
(s) what analyses and studies have been undertaken as to whether the proposed FATCA regime constitutes an override of the existing double tax convention;
(t) what were the conclusions of the studies in (s);
(u) what steps is the government taking to ensure that, as a result of FATCA or an IGA, the US will not be allowed to impose higher taxes on Canadian persons than those agreed under the current convention;
(v) what studies and analyses have been undertaken to determine whether Canadian citizens and residents are or will be denied financial services in Canada owing to US tax law in general and FATCA in particular;
(w) what are the conclusions or recommendations of the studies in (v);
(x) what mechanisms are in place to ensure that Canadian citizens and residents are not and will not be denied financial services in Canada owing to US tax law in general and FATCA in particular;
(y) what measures will be taken to remedy denial of services to Canadians as a result of FATCA;
(z) what studies and analyses will be undertaken to assess FATCA’s impact on the availability of TFSAs and RESPs for dual US-Canada citizens;
(aa) what are the conclusions of any studies in (z);
(bb) what analyses and studies have been undertaken regarding whether the US definition of “resident” for tax purposes, and its impact on Canadians with dual status, is compatible with Canadian law, including the Charter of Rights and freedoms;
(cc) what analyses and studies have been undertaken regarding whether the US definition of “resident” for tax purposes, and its impact on Canadians with dual status, as will be enforced by FATCA or by an IGA, is compatible with Canadian law and, in particular, the Charter of Rights and Freedoms;
(dd) what analyses and studies have been conducted with respect to FATCA’s consequences upon Canadians who believed their US Citizenship had been relinquished;
(ee) with respect to the studies referenced in (dd), what particular efforts has the government undertaken to ensure no violation of a Canadian’s charter right would be occasioned by implementing FATCA or an IGA;
(ff) what studies and analyses have been undertaken regarding the likely cost of FATCA implementation to
(i) Canadian private institutions,
(ii) Canadian individuals,
(iii) the government;(gg) how were the figures in (ff) arrived at, by whom, when, and in consultation with whom;
(hh) what studies and analyses have been undertaken as to whether the likely cost of FATCA implementation to Canadian private institutions, Canadian individuals, and the government will be offset by the receipt of reciprocal tax information and Canadian tax law enforcement by the US;
(ii) what analyses and studies have been undertaken as to whether the likely costs and benefits described in (ff) and (hh) are likely to be greater, lesser, or the same as under the current tax-information-sharing relationship with the US;
(jj) what agencies, boards, tribunals, or commissions of the government have studied, interpreted, analyzed, or commented upon FATCA,
(i) to what extent,
(ii) on what dates, (iii) with what conclusion(s);(kk) what specific steps has the government taken to assess the privacy implications of FACTA;
(ll) on what dates and with respect to what topics has the government met with the Privacy Commissioner to discuss FATCA or the effect of any IGA;
(mm) broken down by province or territory,
(i) on which dates and
(ii) with what individuals in the provincial and territorial governments did the government consult on the subject of FATCA;(nn) broken down by province or territory,
(i) on which dates and
(ii) with what individuals in the provincial and territorial governments did the government consult on the subject of any IGA;(oo) does the government have the support of every province and territory with respect to any proposed implementation of FATCA, and what evidence does the government have that this support exists;
(pp) has the Department of Justice developed any policy relative to the implementation of an IGA and, if so, (i) how was it developed, (ii) in consultation with whom, (iii) to whom was it provided, (iv) who requested it, (v) what were its findings, conclusions, and recommendations;
(qq) how will the government monitor and enforce compliance by Canadian institutions with FATCA requirements;
(rr) how will the government monitor and enforce regulatory oversight of the bank due-diligence efforts required by FATCA and its implementation, including
(i) by whom
(ii) how,
(iii) using what standards such efforts will be evaluated;(ss) what penalties exist and what penalties does the government intend to establish for failure to adhere to standards indicated in (rr);
(tt) has the Department of Justice or the Department of Revenue developed any legislation or guidance relative to the implementation of an IGA or FATCA and, if so
(i) how was it developed,
(ii) in consultation with whom,
(iii) to whom was it provided,
(iv) who requested it,
(v) what were its findings, conclusions, and recommendations;(uu) has the Department of Justice reviewed any proposed legislation relative to the implementation of an IGA;
(vv) with what individuals or groups has the Department of Justice consulted relative to the implementation of FATCA;
(ww), what steps have been undertaken to assess regulatory changes to federal institutions at the provincial and territorial level that would be required as a result of FATCA or any IGA;
(xx) what steps has the Canada Revenue Agency taken with regard to developing or implementing FATCA or any IGA;
(yy) what tax information does the Canada Revenue agency currently share with the US,
(i) when,
(ii) under what circumstances,
(iii) in what form;(zz) has the government assessed whether FATCA and its implementation would require changes to the ways in which tax information is currently shared with the US;
(aaa) what has the government sought, or does the government plan to seek from the US, in terms of reciprocal information sharing as a result of the FATCA or IGA negotiations, and what is the current status of negotiations on this point;
(bbb) what measures are in place to ensure that no privacy laws or policies are violated in any transfer of information contemplated in (aaa); and
(ccc) by what process(es) and on what dates will any IGA and its enacting legislation be vetted for compliance with the
(i) Constitution Act, 1867,
(ii) Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms,
(iii) Canadian Bill of Rights?
I am playing catch up here as we were out all day but,…finally! Ted Hsu is my MP so I am very pleased to see these questions being put forward by him. I am especially glad to see he has mentioned the cost/benefits as well. Obama ordered a cost/benefit analysis be done and it was not. They just went forward anyway with faulty or no reliable data that this boondoggle is even going to raise the kinds of funds they have been saying it will for the U.S. Someone has to call them out on that. Why go forward if we are going to spend millions here in Canada to gain what? WHERE are the hard numbers?
All this suffering and angst, law bending and for what?
Mr. Hsu, I know has had more than a few letters about the impact of FATCA here in Canada. At last we have someone from the liberals standing up to ask some difficult questions as should have been done before Canada leaps into this abyss. Canada has good banking laws already. We had a perfectly good treaty already and Canada is NOT a tax haven. Something could have been done without the U.S. bullying everyone and imposing victorian era fines *FBAR* on honest families. This has to stop. Who is the U.S. with it’s banking laws cock ups to tell Canada how to collect anything? They have mucked up everything down there. FATCA is as if the least competent leader is in charge of a very large company making rules as they please with no oversight.
I’m very, very pleased to see Mr. Hsu’s questions as I had thought perhaps Kingston and the Islands might remain a lot quieter on this. Thank you Mr.Hsu!
MORE FROM NDP
Just received this reply from NDP Finance critic Peggy Nash.
This is in response to a FATCA oppositional letter sent to her, Rankin, Mulcair and Craig Scott, in support of Rankin’s letter to Flaherty.
OCTOBER 24 2013
“Thank you for taking the time to write my office.
As of this date we have yet to receive a response from the office of the finance minister.
That being said I can say that echo my colleague’s concerns on this file (FATCA) and given that the negotiations are being conducted behind closed doors my understanding of any new developments is limited and I unfortunately have nothing new to add to the debate.
Our position is clear to the government and rest assured that we will urge them, at every step of the way, to do the right thing.
Thanks again for taking the time to write.”
Sincerely,
Peggy Nash
Member of Parliament – Députée | Parkdale – High Park
peggy.nash@parl.gc.ca
Mr. Hsu spoke with me at the protest about this and said he was planning to address FATCA. I really wasn’t expecting anything so quickly. He’s my MP and I had been writing his office for a long while but, was feeling there wasn’t much more the liberal from Kingston and the Islands were going to put forward. I was wrong. I really appreciate what Mr. Hsu has done here.
I wish some media outlet would pick up his long list of questions after the conservatives answer him and I hope they do answer him in great detail. None of this wishy/washy business whilst trying to cover for the U.S. Treasury and POTUS. This is CANADA. Bottom line needs to be about how is this legal in Canada and what does it DO for Canada if anything and what will it do TO Canadians. If those questions cannot be answered satisfactorily then FATCA needs to go on the heap and be let go of here. It’s clearly not good for Canada then there is no reason we need to do it. We’re the leader on this issue for so many around the world. What Canada will do will make a huge impact on so many people.
Glad to see Mr. Hsu responding in this way!
See, bubblebustin — another wit ism to be added to your many!
@ atticusincanada
I feel your persistence in calling and speaking with Mr. Hsu gave him the awareness of how FATCA affects American Persons in Canada and all Canadians and this invasion of our Constitution. I am so impressed how informed you and other Brock and Maple Sandbox members are so knowledgeable and informed on FATCA. I am dazzled. Perhaps Mr Hsu and the other politicians were educated by these websites with such facts presented and also so much passion.
As for the media, those on Brock and Maple Sandbox could contact the same columnists that have already wrote about FATCA with the list of Mr. HSU’s question list.
I think we may be seeing a light in this tunnel with Mr. Hsu taking this to Parliament and out in the open now.
I’ve sent a link to CBC and to Globe and Mail and just now to a senior reporter at the Calgary Herald who communicated back and forth with me in January of 2012.
URGENT
Some of us are trying to figure a way of getting some FATCA coverage amongst the Conservative delegates to the convention in Calgary next weekend. Musing about circulating the FATCA flyer and maybe also a copy of Hsu’s Q-121 question to delegates as they arrive, but we’ve learned that (surprise surprise) the convention centre is private property and leafletting isn’t allowed on private property, there’s only one area of public ground near the convention where the police will allow this, and not many delegates are likely to wander by that spot. Sort of sounds like G-20 in Toronto, doesn’t it?
If by some fluke of luck, any of you who are following this thread are delegates to that convention or have personal connections to people who are and who might be sympathetic – our information from Calgary is that there is a policy workshop starting at 8:30am and going until 2:30 (probably with lunch break) on Friday November 1 in Palomino Rooms E-H at the BMO Centre. The subject is “Role of Government, Taxation, and Crime” (sorry but that’s the only thing I can make out on the agenda that seems related to taxation). From 12:30-1:30 there is a “ministerial information session” in that same venue and for the same topic. I’m not sure where Flaherty will be (there’s also a parallel Economic Development session where he might go, in other rooms, but I don’t think FATCA can remotely be stretched to economic development except for tax lawyers and accountants). So who knows which minister(s) will be at Rooms E-H at that time.
It would be wonderful if somehow we could get a delegate or two willing to raise some FATCA questions and maybe have a supply of the FATCA handout and Hsu’s questions to pass around at that session.
I know this is a “Hail Mary pass,” but I thought why not give it a stab.
If you think this might work, and are a delegate or are well-connected with someone who is and might be sympathetic, just try it. No need to reply on this thread, no real need to contact us about it.
Hail Mary, full of grace, ….
@all
I sent a message to Mr. Hsu on his facebook page earlier today. He just responded to me.
“Thanks for your note. Now put pressure on the government to answer these questions in detail! Often these questions are just answered generally if the government doesn’t want to talk about it.”
So let’s apply the pressure…
I have sent my emails to the Liberals, NDP , Conservatives and Green Party. Asking for these questions to be studied and answered ASAP and in detail.
I congratulated Dr. Hsu. asked him two supplementary questions. Who will pay the costs incurred by CRA? and what happens when US doesn’t deliver reciprocity?
@Kalc,
LOL!
My MP has never responded to any emails I sent regarding FATCA. I think I only sent two, so maybe I should give him a break…NOT.
I sent him another one tonight, letting him know about Hsu’s Order paper, and asking him again where he stands on FATCA. Maybe I will get a reply this time.
My MP John Weston is quiet on this subject. He answered a hand delivered letter after about 6 months with the statement that he is ‘doing his best on our behalf.’
It’s Green for me next time unless the LIbs or NDP come through big time. Unfortunately it’s a safe Conservative seat.
@Kalc,
I think it will be Green for me too, and not just because of FATCA. The bee protest got me riled up too. Pierre, are you listening?
Maybe Malcolm Gladwell’s new book David and Goliath is applicable here. It is about examples in history of small winning out over big. ‘O Canada’ could take on new special meaning.
I too have been inspired by Malcolm Gladwell’s new book’s premise, Joe Zinga. You should never underestimate your opponent’s weapon especially when their nimbleness of mind and body exceeds your own.
Also reported, to add to Mr. Harper’s woes: http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/trudeau-challenges-harper-to-testify-under-oath-1.2252951
@ Calgar411
Re: your comment of Justin Trudeau wanting PM Harper to testify under oath. This may be good. We must keep in mind that the PM is a follower of Leo Strauss, economist who taught in The School of Chicago. Some of Harper’s advisors and MPs went there as well as some of W Bush’s advisors. What I remember about Leo Strauss is that he believed the elite should only rule and that it was okay to lie to the citizens because they were not the elite.
Find out who are Straussians in Parliament.
Blaze has a good list of answers to the questions on Maple Sand box…
http://maplesandbox.ca/2013/fatca-iga-questions-from-liberal-mp-in-house-of-commons/#comment-11018
@Outraged: The answers to the questions are simple, but they will drag it out as long as they can.
Here are some examples of the real answers:
Who consulted: CBA: Yes. CCLA: Oops.
Provinces and Territories: Oops.
What studies and analyses: Oops.
Conclusions: Oops.
Specifics on privacy: Oops.
Monitor and enforce: Oops.
Costs: Oops.
Vetted for 1867 Constitution, Charter, Bill of Rights: Oops
@Just Me
LOL!
@Joe Zinga
Interesting that you mentioned the book David and Goliath…
There was a good interview today where Malcolm Gladwell tells Fareed Zakaria why Goliath was the real underdog in the classic biblical tale. Here is an excerpt…
http://www.cnn.com/video/data/2.0/video/bestoftv/2013/10/25/exp-gps-gladwell-sot-david-and-goliath.cnn.html
I love the description of the lumbering slow moving blind Giant. America anyone?
Additional questions?
I think he covered things very, very well.
I’d still like to know how in the world a Canadian spouse or child can be required to have information sent about their accounts to a foreign government. IRS was asked to consider the impact of “signing rights” and if they could eliminate some of those requirements and they responded negatively.
I do think the legal ramifications were covered in those questions though. The fact that Canada is playing this game with the U.S. at all is deeply disturbing. We have a treaty. Imposing FBAR fines in the thousands of dollars on benign Canadian families is a dirty thing for the U.S. to do to a country they keep calling their “closest neighbour and best trading partner.” Really? Neither the Model 1 or 2 IGA are acceptable for Canada given that at the beginning of this our government asked for an exemption from FATCA since this is not a tax haven, and we already exchange information of the kind that would be required under FATCA. I do NOT want Canadian banks following U.S. laws. Their banking laws and rules were nothing but, a hot mess for a long time now.
Why should Canada follow the laws of another nation at all when that country has shown their banks to be far worse than ours at having good regulations and safe guards?
@Just Me
I saw the same interview this morning, and it was very good.
I just received this email message re my thank you to Mr. Hsu:
Calgary411, I also just received the same email from Mr. Hsu’s office.