AtticusinCanada and WhiteKat were a successful anti-FATCA presence at Finance Minister Jim Flaherty’s press conference in Ottawa yesterday.
Besides handing out leaflets, they spoke with people, one of whom was Globe and Mail reporter Bill Curry, who – although the event was held to announce a three year freeze in unemployment insurance premiums – asked Minister Flaherty about FATCA.
WhiteKat’s sign said: “FATCA: Sequel to the War of 1812” on one side and “FATCA = Extortion by USA of All Canadians” on the other. Atticus’ sign said: US Bullying violates Canadian Charter: Stop FATCA” on one sign and “Google isaacbrocksociety.ca” on the other.
Minister’s Flaherty’s reply is on CTV, beginning around 4.25 min.
WhiteKat and Atticus’ conversation with reporter Curry also resulted in a Globe and Mail article.
Thank you, WhiteKat and Atticus!
@Victoria, starting to protest was YOUR idea quite a while ago. Had you not made the post you did about I wouldn’t have started to think more strongly about taking the opportunity. So thanks to you too. I think everyone worked together to make this happen at the very last second. Calgary, Em, Bubble, all had great suggestions and comments for the hand out and had that done and posted here in a flash! All of you posted slogans so when the time came to do our signs we could just scroll and grab one.
@Wondering, really wonderful letter! I so agree with you. I don’t think he wants it either but, that sound bite about not taking care of our personal affairs was smarmy and wrong headed. However, he WAS caught off guard, he wasn’t expecting to be publicly asked about FATCA yesterday. lol…
Great work everyone. What’s next? I like the idea of a larger protest in Ottawa on the Hill too. Say when. We need to do it when we know there is something else important going on that day. Also watch Minister Flaherty’s schedule and Harpers, and Obama’s too.
@bubblebusting
I do believe Flaherty – and many top people in the Canadian banking and financial industry as well – understand how untenable their position is. They are stuck, and it truly sucks because there is no easy way out.
On one hand there are the demands of the broke, dysfunctional yet still very influential foreign superpower next door. On the other hand Canada has a large population of FATCA-affected citizens and residents who have made it clear they will not behave politely while being sold down the river. And there are the advanced human rights laws and history of judicial activism in Canada to support a legal challenge to FATCA.
My guess is that Flaherty and company are playing a waiting game. I don’t think these is much love lost between our government and the US these days. The US has nothing to teach us about fiscal responsibility, good governance, or social order. Personally, I believe a position of strength would be preferable, because it would crystallize the resentment and resistance to FATCA.
What about a march from US embassy to Parliament Hill? Can’t be a Wednesday, embassy closed.
Do people line up outside the embassy for greencards, like they do in Toronto? Could be a good time to bring awareness to them.
I posted this on the other thread, seems more appropriate here though. Sorry, I’m kinda new at this.
White Kat, Atticus and everyone here, thank you. I have not renounced yet, I’ve been pushing this nightmare to the side due to other issues on my plate, but have been able to stay informed because of all of you. My story is just like White Kat, born “there” to Canadian parents. My siblings are Canadian. I am a Canadian. Period.
I’m in the Vancouver area and I’m more than willing to help spread the word. I’ll be at a rally here, if that’s what decided or I can carry placards and help hand out info sheets to all those vehicles that line up each weekend at our three border crossings. I can get on a plane and stand with you in Ottawa. Just tell me when to be there.
Wow, you guys!
Great work everyone. In listening to Flaherty answer the question about FATCA, he did not look enthusiastic about it (FATCA). I doubt they will be moving very quickly from here and I got the sense that some of the messages are getting through. Who was that standing behind Flaherty?A youngish looking man. He was really paying attention when FATCA came up. In roads are being made. Next level?
@Atticus, I’ve been waiting for this day. The work done here and in other places to educate and advocate is helping but I’ve always thought that eventually we would have to turn to peaceful, but very public, demonstrations. It’s a lot to ask of people and we probably weren’t ready. Now we are and you and Whitekat have led the way.
In the mail yesterday I received a gift in the mail. It’s an old copy of Phyllis Michaux’s book The Unknown Ambassadors. Just after reading the preface and the first chapter I was so excited I was bouncing around on my sofa. This was one woman (that’s right, ONE woman) who as an American abroad, saw so much injustice in US law at that time that she started advocating for change. She founded AAWE and AARO and she led the charge in many a battle which ended in victory (though some of those “wins” looks very different today). Does this sound familiar?
“The problem for this latter group [civilian Americans abroad] is their unfavorable image, or even lack of image, for want of knowledge about their very existence. As a consequence they are often regarded with mistrust. ”
“This distorted impression of overseas Americans confuses public officials – those who make the laws and those who administer them – as they have no real picture of what Americans are doing overseas. This confusion is reflected in Congress and unfairly influences legislation affecting those living abroad.”
The Unknown Ambassadors was published in 1996.
Almost 20 years later, I think Americans abroad still face exactly the same fundamental problems: recognition and legitimacy.
@Joe Zinga
Kevin Shoom, maybe? He’s on Facebook and Linkedin but darn, no pictures of him on either. Google images of Shoom doesn’t show anyone who looks like that guy.
It’s different now than 20 years ago, as until recently CBT had remained to the American global migrant America’s best unknown boat anchor. The USG will take note of the renunciations, or they won’t. My worry is how they’ll deal with them if they do – with a stick or a carrot?
@Victoria
I was just speaking with another Brocker last night about the need to document and tell our stories using every possible medium, including traditional books. Perhaps you might consider taking-up such a challenge? You are an excellent writer and I have no doubt you could distill our experiences into a compelling non-fiction page-turner that would build on your excellent blog and freelance articles.
@ brockers europe response to: Victoria says September 10, 2013 at 1:01 pm …what about standing outside US Embassies with fact leaflets on US tax compliance to hand out to potential immigrants (the forgotten victims of FBAR and FATcA)….
any takers for London?
@Deckard, I just suggested to Victoria last night (she is on my fb) that she is good enough to write something for Harpers Magazine. Not like the newspaper articles that have recently appeared, but something more deep, with connotations everywhere; It has to be non-fiction (as an unsolicited article) and she knows of lots of stories of what the Brockers have gone through. She kind of liked the idea.
@kermitzii
That’s a great idea too.
Well, if this isn’t serendipity, I don’t know what is.
Some of you may recall that I was invited to attend an information seminar in my area on FATCA, sponsored by BMO and conducted by Trowbridge Professional Group (specializing in US and international tax services). I went to the meeting and managed to draw a bit of attention to myself, as the speaker Mo Ahmad allowed questions to be asked while he covered off the many topics on his agenda. These topics included:
-Are you a US citizen?
-US Income Tax & Other Filing Requirements
-Other US Reporting Forms
-Common Cross-border Issues
-US Estate Tax
-Do you want to be a US Citizen?
-Streamlined Voluntary Compliance Program
-Renouncing US citizenship
-Legal
-Circular 230
The short of it is that a number of people came up to me after the seminar wanting more information from me. I had taken a few printouts I’d made that I thought would cover things I thought people would be interested in, but quickly ran out.
Today my friend was at the BMO in West Vancouver and saw a poster for the same seminar on September 17th. This is a good opportunity for those interested to reach out to other USP’s in Canada, and perhaps be a thorn in the side of those who are too quick to push those people into the arms of the IRS. To get the location of the meeting, you’ll need to RSVP with Anna Chung at 604-901-1091 or anna.chung@nbpcd.com
I also got a follow up letter from BMO asking me what I thought of the seminar. I’ll leave those who might go to form their own opinion.
@The Mom “Do people line up outside the embassy for greencards, like they do in Toronto? ”
Are they applying for green cards or for a more temporary status? Makes a difference in terms of tax enforcement, although the tax net can catch people even in more temporary status to some degree.
Wow, thank you for the trust. Writing up the history is something I would love and I’m honored that you think I could do it justice. I will give it a try. Plus my woodstove shows up on Monday, it’s getting cold here and spending the winter writing sounds like a plan to me. I like Kermit’s idea a lot about writing a piece for Harper’s. I just submitted today something to the NYT and Blaze and I have a few things cooking.
In some ways I’ve kinda already started working on what you are proposing. I’ve been doing a lot of reading and research. I’ve started this book list on Goodreads:
http://www.goodreads.com/list/show/43000.American_Diaspora_Reading_List
Feel free to add titles to this list.
I’m trying to get the full picture here starting from, say, WW II to the present day. How did we get here? And that involves digging into the history of Americans leaving America and the state of this “proto-diaspora”. I’ve also just finished a book that I think is the best one I’ve ever read about tax havens – Tax Havens: How Globalization Really Works – it taught me a lot about where they came from and the efforts to stop them and tax evasion/tax avoidance.
Another angle is to look at how this virtual community was formed and how social media made it possible for us to build this place. Just on that level what has been accomplished here is extraordinary.
I’m going to shut up now and go to bed before I do a nose plant on my keyboard.
Bonne nuit, everyone.
@Dash1729
If you want another form of protest or impact, stand outside the embassy and hand out “U.S Person” warnings, along with the IRS publication 54. A simple one page Cover sheet could be constructed to say this…
Be forewarned: If you become a “U.S. Person” and ever want to return home, live abroad in the future, or if you still have accounts in your home country, read this before you decide to get that Green Card…
FATCA and FBAR are designed to get you!
http://www.irs.gov/publications/p54/index.html
I like the idea of marching from U.S. embassy to the Hill in Ottawa among other ideas.
I also like the idea of filming our stories. I learned yesterday that putting a face to this has a huge influence on what people think, how they listen. It is hard for people to understand FATCA just reading about it online. Some don’t GO online. But a few words with another person face to face. Telling them what is happening has a huge impact in gaining empathy and getting people to understand. I am wondering if we couldn’t start small with a You Tube which contains small videos for those that are comfortable. Answering a short list of questions. How you found out about this, what is your story, where you are now? Some could even just use first names, or even their username. Just a start to put a face for those who can’t travel too easily.
As to the march…I’m am up for that and many more like it. We need to find out what the rules are for starting at an embassy or for handing out anything there. They are very strict but, we will be fine if we know where our boundaries, where we are allowed to walk, not walk.
Canadian Girl, welcome. I am so glad you found your way here. There is so much good information here and we’re here to support one another through this morass and to stand up for Canadians rights and for the rights of others harassed by the U.S. over this wherever they are in this world.
@Victoria, yes you are very eloquent and have a lovely way with phrases. I think you should submit to a major magazine or consider a book!
Elizabeth May has posted a comment at IBS
http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2013/08/28/where-do-we-go-from-here-is-it-time-for-an-organization/comment-page-4/#comment-529357
@crystal london – I’ve been wondering if any expats in the UK care about this issue as much as I do! There is zero press about it and I can’t find any groups in the UK who seem to be concerned with it.
@bubblebustin, yup serendipity…go with the flow.
Have posted photo at Maple Sandbox couldn’t figure out how to do so here as well. I emailed and asked Bill Curry for photo of yesterday.
@US in UK. You might want to check out Victoria’s Franco American Flophouse Blog. She and Bubblebustin pulled together a Brockstock in Vancouver when Victoria was visiting Seattle.
Victoria has now posted on her own blog asking if a group on your side of the pond wants to get together in London or Brussels. One woman in UK has already said yes and they’re looking for more.
Canada is key is this fight, along with China and Russia. The UK is lost as it was the first country to roll over and has not only signed an IGA but has passed implementing legislation without so much of a whimper about the rights of dual UK/US citizens.
@Steve, you are right. Canada is key! Even more so than China and Russia: reason being that we have a history or respecting human rights. We need to continue to lead by example.