Liberty and justice for all United States persons abroad

The Isaac Brock Society

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13-01-03 PRESS RELEASE: FATCA, Stanley Fischer – complaint asks release of $250,000 seized of “US Person” by Israeli Bank HaPoalim

 The complaint asks the release of $250,000, unlawfully seized from “US Person” by the Israeli Bank HaPoalim, BM.  The conduct has no foundation in either the law of the State of Israel, or the law of the United States, but appears to have been induced by Bank of Israel’s Stanley Fischer unparalleled, unconditional submission to the United States FACTA. Petition, previously filed with the Israeli High Court of Justice claimed that Fischer exchanged his loyalty to the State of Israel and its law with loyalty to another nation and its law, and/or loyalty to financial institutions and their interests. The case captures the financial crisis in a nutshell – criminality by financial institution is patronized by national banking regulators and the national highest courts.  In this case – under the guise of compliance with United States law by Israeli banks. Eventually, the territory of “FACTA-compliance” is likely to coincide with the territory of the financial crisis, through corruption of banking regulation of other nations, under United States coercion.
Stanley Fischer, Governor of the Bank of Israel – Israel’s Banking Regulator and Bilderberg Member, showing off his newly acquired Israeli ID in 2005; Supreme Court of the State of Israel, FATCA.
View as PDF:
Jerusalem, January 6 – complaint, filed with Bank of Israel-Banking regulation, documents the seizing on January 1, 2013, of some $250,000 of “US Person’s” funds, which were deposited with the Israeli Bank HaPoalim, BM. [1]  The conduct of the Bank was purported by the Bank as part of its “New Policy” of compliance with the United States FACTA law in the State of Israel.  Under such “New Policy” the Bank demanded that the customer, a US citizen living in Israel, sign “Waiver of Privacy” to the United States government of his financial transactions in an Israeli bank in Israel, which the customer refused to sign. In response, Bank HaPoalim now denies the customer’s access to the customer’s own deposit accounts, totaling some $250,000.
The complaint also documents that:
·       Bank HaPoalim in fact had no “New Policy”.  The Bank refused to provide a copy of the policy record and stated that none existed.
·       Bank HaPoalim refused to comply with pertinent United States Internal Revenue Regulations – reporting to the account holder the total interest gained in his account on an annual basis (US IRS form 1099-Int) – conduct that is inconsistent with honest banking as well.
·       Bank HaPoalim’s conduct in seizing deposit accounts had no basis even in the purported US FATCA – the act provides only for only withholding tax on income from US financial assets held at the Banks by non-compliant customers.
petition, previously filed with the Israeli Supreme Court, sought to compel Governor of the Bank of Israel Stanley Fischer to perform his duties as banking regulator.  The Court was asked to order Stanley Fischer to duly register and review a complaint, relative to conduct of Bank HaPoalim, BM, and its purported enforcement the United States FATCA in the State of Israel. [1]
Today, staff of Bank of Israel confirmed receipt of the consumer’s complaint, filed by Joseph Zernik, PhD, of Human Rights Alert (NGO).  Whether the complaint would ever be registered, be reviewed “according to legal standards”, and decision communicated to the complainant (as promised on the Bank of Israel web site for all complaints), remains to be seen.
In August 2012, a previous complaint against Bank HaPoalim was filed by Dr Zernik, which documented unlawful, extortionist demands and threats by Bank HaPoalim, BM, under the guise of FATCA compliance. [2] For months Bank of Israel refused to inform the complainant, whether the complaint was registered and reviewed. Most recently, from conversations with Bank HaPoalim, Dr Zernik discovered that the Bank had received a decision from Bank of Israel on Dr Zernik’s August 2012 complaint, which had been registered (No 82304-12), and that the Bank of Israel decision in part induced Bank HaPoalim’s most recent unlawful actions.  Regardless, Bank of Israel continues in its refusal to disclose any details on the matter to the complainant. [3]
In October 2012, petition was also filed with the Israeli High Court of Justice to compel Mr Fischer to perform his duties by duly registering and reviewing the complaint against Bank HaPoalim. [4] The petition alleges that in permitting Israeli banks to act as they will under the pretense of enforcing the US FATCA, Stanley Fischer “undermines the rule of law” and “sovereignty of the State of Israel”, and “substitutes his loyalty to the State of Israel and its laws with loyalty to another nation and its law, and/or with loyalty to financial institutions and their interests.” [5]
The petition in the Supreme Court of Israel was subjected to a fate that was remarkably similar to the fate of the complaint against Bank HaPoalim, BM, at Bank of Israel-Banking Regulation:  The office of the clerk of the Supreme Court refused to duly register the petition. [6]
The case of Bank HaPoalim is particularly striking, since in previous years Mr Fischer had removed some of the Bank’s senior officers and initiated criminal investigations against them. Now Mr Fischer is patronizing their criminality.
The case of Mr Fischer is also striking, since review of Israeli media reports indicates that under his tenure Bank of Israel was determined, even prior to the final enactment of FATCA, that the matter was “not under its purview”, and that Bank of Israel refused to issue Banking Regulations of the State of Israel in this matter, even after being pressed to do so by Israeli banks. [7]
Combined, conduct of Mr Fischer, Bank of Israel-Banking Regulation, and the Supreme Court of the State of Israel should raise concerns regarding integrity and stability of financial systems in the State of Israel.
Corruption of banking regulation in collusion with the US courts, under the color of law, has been increasingly recognized as central to the current socio-economic crisis in the United States. [8, and see quotes below]
The State of Israel has not yet seen financial institutions’ defaults of the size, seen in the US and Europe in recent years.  However,the case captures a snapshot of emergence of the basic conditions for a financial crisis, in a nutshell: Criminality by financial institutions is patronized by national banking regulators and the national highest courts.  In this case – under the guise of compliance with United States law by Israeli banks. Eventually, the territory of “FACTA-compliance” is likely to coincide with the territory of the financial crisis, through corruption of banking regulation of other nations, under United States coercion.
LINKS:
[1] 13-01-04 FATCA-related Consumer Complaint No 2 against Bank HaPoalim, BM, and its Chief Internal Auditor Jacob Orbach, filed with Bank of Israel-Banking Regulation
[2] 12-08-25 Dr Zernik’s complaint, filed with Israeli banking regulation against Bank HaPoalim – for attempting to extort compliance with US IRS regulations in Jerusalem
[3] 13-01-03 Letter to Stanley Fischer, Bank of Israel Governor RE- request for immediate production of records re FATCA-related complaint against Bank HaPoalim, BM
[4] 12-10-23 PRESS RELEASE – Petition alleges Bank of Israel Fischer patronizes criminality at Bank HaPoalim, BM
[5] 12-10-23 Joseph Zernik v Stanley Fischer (7650/12) Petition in the High Court of Justice of the State of Israel.
[6] 12-12-27 PRESS RELEASE – FATCA, Stanley Fischer, and “Chief Clerk” Sarah Lifschitz in the High Court of Justice of the State of Israel
[7] 13-01-06 FATCA – United States Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (2011) – Israel and other nations’ responses – compilation of media reports
[8] Zernik, J, Large-scale fraud in US court records is linked to failing banking regulation _ OpEdNews
_____________
Joseph Zernik, PhD
< josephzernik@humanrightsalertngo.org>
Sent from “1984”, Iceland-based Internet Service Provider
_____________
Human Rights Alert (NGO)
* United States – the 2010 submission of Human Rights Alert to the Human Rights Council (HRC) of the United Nations was reviewed and incorporated in the official HRC Professional Staff Report with a note referring to “corruption of the courts and the legal profession and discrimination by law enforcement in California.”
[1] 10-10-01 United Nations Human Rights Council Records for 2010 Review (UPR) of Human Rights in the United States, where Human Rights Alert (NGO) submission was incorporated with a note referring to “corruption of the courts and the legal profession and discrimination by law enforcement in California.”
* State of Israel  – the 2012 submission of Human Rights Alert to the HRC, titled, “Integrity, or lack thereof, of the electronic record systems of the courts of the State of Israel’, is scheduled for review in January 2013.
[1] 12-06-04 Human Right Alert’s Submission;  2013 UPR of the State of Israel: Integrity, or lack thereof, of the electronic record systems of the courts of the State of Israel
[2] 12-05-10 Appendix I to Human Right Alert’s Submission; 15th UPR – State of Israel: Integrity, or lack thereof, of the electronic record systems of the courts of the State of Israe
[3] 12-07-18 Human Right Alert’s Appendix II to Submission; 2013 UPR of the State of Israel: Integrity, or lack thereof, in the electronic record systems in the courts of the State of Israel  –  Additional Responses by National Authorities/Experts, Re: ComSign, LTD – sole certifier and hacker of the digital signatures of the State of Israel
_____
Human Rights Alert online:  
http://inproperinla.blogspot.com/
Flag Counter: 145
http://www.scribd.com/Human_Rights_Alert
Total Reads: 1,007,042
Followers: 1,640
____________________________
Occupy!
11-12-10 Where should Occupy go next? Civil Disobedience in the footsteps of Thoreau and Gandhi!
http :// www.scribd.com/doc/75348301/
12-06-08 Courts and Judges as racketeering enterprises under RICO (the Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations Act) – key element in the current financial crisis
http://www.scribd.com/doc/96504009/
Secede! The US in its current form is simply unmanageable…
12-01-01 Secession – A Smart Business Move!
http://www.scribd.com/doc/76877453/
Get Up, stand up, stand up for your rights! 
_____________________________
Take away justice, then, and what are governments but great bandit bands?
Saint Augustine, Civitas Dei (City of God,4.4)
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WHAT DID THE EXPERT SAY ABOUT THE CURRENT FINANCIAL CRISIS?
*  “I think it’s difficult to find a fraud of this size on the U.S. court system in U.S. history,” said Raymond Brescia, a visiting professor at Yale Law School who has written articles analyzing the role of courts in the financial crisis. “I can’t think of one where you have literally tens of thousands of fraudulent documents filed in tens of thousands of cases.” Reuters (Jan 22, 2012)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/79572282/
* “Foreclosure fraud: The homeowner nightmares continue” CNN (April 7, 2011)
* “About 3 million homes have been repossessed since the housing boom ended in 2006… That number could balloon to about 6 million by 2013” Bloomberg (January 2011)
* “…a system in which only the little people have to obey the law, while the rich, and bankers especially, can cheat and defraud without consequences.” Prof Paul Krugman, MIT (2011)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/50753639/
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WHAT DID THE EXPERTS SAY ABOUT THE JUSTICE SYSTEM IN LOS ANGELES COUNTY, CALIFORNIA?
* “…judges tried and sentenced a staggering number of people for crimes they did not commit.”
Prof David Burcham, Dean, Loyola Law School, LA (2001)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/29043589/
* “This is conduct associated with the most repressive dictators and police states… and judges must share responsibility when innocent people are convicted.”   Prof Erwin Chemerinsky, Dean, Irvine Law School (2001)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/27433920/
* “Innocent people remain in prison”
* “…the LA Superior Court and the DA office, the two other parts of the justice system that the Blue Panel Report recommends must be investigated relative to the integrity of the system, have not produced any response that we know of…” LAPD Blue Ribbon Review Panel Report (2006)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/24902306 /
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WHAT DID THE EXPERTS SAY ABOUT THE JUSTICE SYSTEM IN CALIFORNIA?
* “…corruption of the courts and the legal profession and discrimination by law enforcement in California.”  United Nations Human Rights Council Staff Report (2010)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/38566837/
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WHAT DID THE EXPERTS SAY ABOUT THE STATE COURTS IN THE UNITED STATES?
* “On July 26, 2010, Laurence Tribe, Senior Counsel for the United States Department of Justice, Access to Justice Initiative, delivered an important speech to the Conference of Chief Justices, challenging them to halt the disintegration of our state justice systems before they become indistinguishable from courts of third world nations.”  Prof Laurence Tribe, Harvard Law School (2010), per National Defender Leadership Institute (2010)
http://www.nlada.net/library/article/national_dojspeechto%20chiefjustice07-26-2010_gideonalert
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WHAT DID THE EXPERTS SAY ABOUT THE CONDITIONS IN THE PRISON IN MONROE COUNTY, TENESSEE?
* “What goes on there is more like gulags of centuries ago.” ACLU
http://www.scribd.com/doc/72546279/
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WHAT DID THE EXPERTS SAY ABOUT THE SUPREME COURT OF THE UNITED STATES?
* “More than 100 law professors have signed on to a letter released today that proposes congressional hearings and legislation aimed at fashioning “mandatory and enforceable” ethics rules for Supreme Court justices for the first time. The effort, coordinated by the liberal Alliance for Justice, was triggered by “recent media reports,” the letter said, apparently referring to stories of meetings and other potential conflicts of interest involving Justices Antonin Scalia and Clarence Thomas among others.” More than 100 law professors, as reported by the Blog of the Legal Times (February 2011)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/49586436/
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WHAT DID CHIEF JUDGE OF THE US COURT OF APPEALS, 5TH CIRCUIT, SAY ABOUT THE US JUSTICE SYSTEM?
* “The American legal system has been corrupted almost beyond recognition…”  Chief Judge, US Court of Appeals, 5th Circuit, Edith Jones, speaking before the Federalist Society of Harvard Law School (February 2003)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/50137887/
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WHAT DID THE CHAIR OF THE SENATE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE SAY ABOUT THE US JUSTICE SYSTEM?
* In a speech in Georgetown University, Senator Leahy, Chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee called for a “Truth and Reconciliation Commission” on the US Department of Justice. Transcript of Senator Leahy speech (2009)
http://www.scribd.com/doc/38472251/

43 thoughts on “Press Release: FATCA, Stanley Fischer – complaint asks release of $250,000 seized of “US Person” by Israeli Bank HaPoalim”

  1. @Petros…

    I know you copy and pasted that from another thread.  Any chance you could edit it with some spacing for readability even though the authors didn’t do it in the first place.   thnx  🙂

    Here is the press release that first caught my attention.

  2. When you copy and paste things like this they look ok on the edit screen, and then you publish it and it looks terrible.  I don’t have time to do it, because it will resist fix without first stripping the codes and the reformatting everything.

  3. So stuff put up at Brock can look bad as long as the content is acceptable? Brock won’t lose respect or not be taken seriously for looking like junk?

    One more job for the janitorial invisible “moderator” – make sure Brock looks spiffy where commenters and posters have not.

  4. @USX, I have in the past spent considerable time fixing posts (not just my own but those of other writers).  I might not have time to do some minor formatting changes, as I said, this sort of issue resists changes.

  5. @Petros

    Understand. If there is anything I can do to help, let me know?  I might find the time. 

  6. @Petros @Justme @USX  I try to make my posts look clean, but sometimes I have to go back multiple times (and once posted, the editor version changes, especially for comments).

    One trick is to prepare in Word, then strip out the formatting by pasting to Notepad. 

    Has anyone tried saving in Webpage, Filtered from Word?  But then I think there would be plenty of header information to strip.

    How about these:

     

    http://www.wphub.com/visual-composer-wordpress-plugin/

    http://codecanyon.net/item/visual-composer-for-wordpress/242431

    http://www.wpexplorer.com/wordpress-shortcodes-page-builders

    Also how about using MS Word New Blog Post Template?

     

  7. Ok, I sucessfully connected to IBS from WORD and published the post http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/wp-admin/post.php?post=15145&action=edit

    The post appeared near the top of the home page (Below FATCA fact finding) and appeared correctly, along with the graphics.

    I immediately moved the post to Draft (Using my Author priviledges) but you can still preview it using the URL above.

    The problem with this method is that it only works for new threads, not for comments, as far as I can tell

    You have to create a new document using the Blog Post Template (I have Word 2007, but I bet it will work in subsequent versions).

    Blog post URL is http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/xmlrpc.php
    I opted to store pictures at the provider, and it appeared to work.

    I tell you what, I will try to make my next new thread with word, and see how it goes.

    The message one gets when connecting with word about the username and PWD not being secure doesn’t surprise me. After all we do not have https:// (SSL) activated on the site.

    What we need for editing comments is an HTML editor that will just create snippets without page headers.

  8. You can also Post to IBS as Draft, that works, and it appears in the posts lists of the admin page, but not on the real site.

    I tried using this to generate WordPress code that I could subsequently copy to a comment post, but it didn’t work.

  10. You can also use ScribeFire for FireFox, and Windows Live Writer.  They work a bit like the MS Word feature, except you can also browse posts and topics. 

    But they appear to work only for Posts starting new Threads, not for comments.

    Which is very discouraging, because the wordwrap often gets messed up when copying text to a new comment, and once posted, the online editor changes to a different version where it is very difficult to work.  I for one sometimes reply in a comment and include blockquotes and indents and other things. I have an easier time if it is a post that I own (because I can use a better online WP editor) but it if it is not my thread I get stuck with the poor editor once I post the initial version and decide to go back within 30 minutes and clean up the formatting. 

    Petros & Pacifica you can copy my previous few comments and delete them or consolidate them into one comment. Sorry for cluttering this thread, but someone started on the issue of formatting, so I thought I would try to help.

  11. It’s not particularly clear from the press release or the January 2013 complaint what this is about. The August 2012 complaint and attachments are useful background information.

    It would appear that Dr. Zernik has had his account frozen (“seized” might be premature) because he did not sign the waiver letter presented to him in August 2012 in which he would undertake a) to pay US income tax on that or any subsequent accounts b) to file FBAR c) to provide the bank with Schedule B or the FBAR schedule on request and d) to provide a signed W-9.

    The Hapoalim undertaking/waiver seems to be unusually aggressive. All they really need is the W-9 and the waiver to provide the relevant info to the IRS. Why do they need an undertaking from the account holder to file US taxes and FBAR and copies, on request, of FBAR and Schedule B. Surely that responsibility rests squarely with Dr. Zernik. I certainly wouldn’t want any of my bank account providers to have my FBAR or Schedule B.

    It will be interesting to see how this gets resolved. Is Dr. Zernik the first known recalcitrant account holder? I hope Prof. Christians is following this one as I had thought she said that the procedure was to close the recalcitrant account holder’s account. If this is in the process of happening, I don’t understand why Hapoalim wouldn’t tell Dr. Zernik that his account was in the process of being closed as opposed to frozen. Could it be that Hapoalim’s policy is that you sign the waiver or you don’t get your money?

  12. Apologies, I got the terminology wrong and missed the edit deadline. I just looked again at the decision tree in Prof. Christians’ presentation and you become a recalcitrant account holder if you sign the waiver and agree to provide the information but ultimately don’t provide it. Dr. Zernik, I believe, refused to sign the waiver. The decision tree indicates that the account should then be closed but, instead, it appears to have been frozen.

  13. @Edelweiss,

    You ask good questions. Why Hapoalim is taking these actions when they haven’t even signed up yet, as a PFFI, is a mystery to me.  Just an aggressive stand by some local management due to misunderstandings of FATCA requirements not yet in place?  Or like the illegal mortgage foreclosure process mess in America, loan officers don’t know what they hell the requirements are and just act stupidly without much upper management oversight of how their actions are contravening existing law.

    I hope this creates a BIG Stink in Israel so that it gets a lot of media play, and this gentlemen’s funds are released.  I am wonder what portion of the story we don’t know?

  16. pacifica777January 15, 2013 at 3:33 pm

    The following is the beginning of a comment made by Joseph Zernik, originally posted here on the FATCA thread an hour ago.  However, I moved the entire comment to the”Consulate Report Directory” thread as the subject matter of his question and the bulk of his comment deals with his consulate experiences.

    Please note his summary points (1), (4) and (5) concerning FATCA.

    “13-01-15 Ongoing honest services fraud by the Jerusalem, Jerusalem Consulate of the United States, in re: Adminitration of Oath of Renunciation of US Citizenship.

    Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.  In particular, I am interested in hearing from others that were denied the right to take the Oath of Renunciation of US Citizenship, and how they may have handled the situation.

    Joseph Zernik, PhD

    Human Rights Alert (NGO)

    123456xyz@gmail.com

    Summary
    The case below shows the real nature of FATCA, a law that has not been promulgated, that conflicts with the laws of other nations, and which promotes lawlessness and deprivation of rights of US citizens abroad.

    1) on January 1, 2013, my accounts in the Israeli Bank HaPoalim, holding some $250,000 were seized.  These accounts had no investments in securities, US or otherwise, and had no reporting duty.  Regardless, the total funds in the accounts were seized by the bank with no basis in the law of either Israel or the United States.

    2) On January 7, 2013 I appeared for a scheduled appointment in the US Consulate, Jerusalem for renunciation of US citizenship.  I was interviewed by a person, who represented himself as “Consul Kirk G Smith”.  Another appointment was scheduled for January 14, 2013, for administration of the oath of renunciation.

    3) On January 14, 2013, I appeared before  “Consul Kirk G Smith” for the administration of the oath of renunciation.  Upon review of the conduct and records, one would conclude that the Consulate in Jerusalem engaged in fraud, through the deliberate administration of invalid oath of renunciation, and the issuance of simulated records.

    4) On January 14, 2013, I tried to open a new account with the Israeli Bank HaPoalim, as a non US citizen, and my request was denied.  The Bank refuses to respond in writing, or on what legal basis.

    5) On January 14, and January 15, 2013, I tried to open a new account with the Israeli Bank Leumi. My request was denied, and the Bank refuses to provide written explanation,why my request is denied.

    Some suggest that it is retaliation for my social activism. Maybe, but such lawless conduct would never have been possible absent the false appearance of legality under FATCA.  The true nature of FATCA has not much to do with tax collection, but as a means to control the banks of other nations and in particular, to unlawfully control US citizens abroad.

    The striking feature of FATCA in this story is how well FATCA works, only days after the date of its purported effectiveness, in conjunction with various other unlawful fraud and retaliation measures by the US government.” … continued on Consulate Report Directory thread.

    The remainder of Joseph’s comment deals with his consulate experience.  So, please reply to that on that thread.  And please reply to the FATCA aspect here.Thanks!

  17. HAARETZ: “Israeli banks demanding to see U.S. citizens’ tax returns”

    “In a move that some tax lawyers are calling a blatant violation of customer privacy, two Israeli banks are requiring current and prospective account holders with American citizenship to furnish portions of their U.S. tax returns.”

    “Those who refuse to do so risk having their applications denied, or their existing bank accounts frozen.”

    http://www.haaretz.com/weekend/anglo-file/israeli-banks-demanding-to-see-u-s-citizens-tax-returns-1.473899

    STEP Journal: “Israel may seek special treatment on FATCA”

    “According to the Tel Aviv newspaper Haaretz, Israeli banks are already writing to their USA-national clients to warn them of the bank’s FATCA reporting obligations. One such bank – Leumi – has apparently told clients with USA citizenship that their accounts will be frozen at the beginning of May unless they confirm that the IRS knows about their bank accounts in Israel.”

    “Another bank, Hapoalim, has also requested American customers to make the same declaration, while other banks are even asking clients to provide documentary proof of their USA tax compliance.”

    http://www.stepjournal.org/news/news/main_story/israel_may_seek_special_treatm.aspx?link=news_headline&j=31051&e=wood@woodporter.com&l=346_HTML&u=1040350&mid=1062735&jb=0

    Jewish Press: “Israel, US to Exchange Tax Information, Banking Secrecy Disregarded”

    “According to Globes, Israel Tax Authority director general Doron Arbeli last week met Internal Revenue Service (IRS) acting commissioner Steven Miller to advance this effort. Should an agreement be signed, Israel will establish an organization to monitor and enable the transfer of the necessary information to the U.S., and the IRS will send to Israel details of bank accounts belonging to Israeli residents in the U.S.”

    http://www.jewishpress.com/news/breaking-news/israel-us-to-exchange-tax-information-banking-secrecy-disregarded/2012/12/13/

  18. Blatant indeed. 

    “According to the Tel Aviv newspaper Haaretz, Israeli banks are already writing to their USA-national clients to warn them of the bank’s FATCA reporting obligations. One such bank – Leumi – has apparently told clients with USA citizenship that their accounts will be frozen at the beginning of May unless they confirm that the IRS knows about their bank accounts in Israel.”

    “Another bank, Hapoalim, has also requested American customers to make the same declaration, while other banks are even asking clients to provide documentary proof of their USA tax compliance.”

     Thanks for this comment, John Brown.  A missing piece of the puzzle re Joseph Zernik’s situation. 

  20.  I have wondered about this increasing “offshore tax evasion’ focus on Israel. Others have said that evasion by Israelis is worse than American, and thus they want FATCA. Are we sure they know what they are getting? 

    Every time I hear an Israeli interviewed on the news these days he sounds American, and I wonder immediately what his compliance status is. The US wants all the records of all the Americans living in Israel and all the Americans in America who have funds in Israeli banks. 

    Israel, on the other hand, only wants information of all the Israelis living in Israel that have funds in the US, but not on those that are resident in America. US banks are supposed to sort that out via IRS bulletin 2012-20. There isn’t such a concept of Israeli citizenship tax, is there? 

    So, which country has the biggest proportion of its citizens living in each others countries, and which stands to gain or lose the most from their treasury and economy from this coming FATCA IGA so called reciprocity? I assume Israel will want a FATCA IGA 

    I think Israel loses, but hasn’t figured it out yet. More so now when the Obamacare tax on Americans abroad kicks in this year, and when penalties are factored into the non compliance of U.S. Citizens living in the Holy Land. 

    When America starts going hard after those long time US Citizens in Israel (I have heard numbers from 100,000 – 300,000) living within its security fence, might that not create some unease? Or do you think more Israelis are hiding money in America and so the reciprocal impacts are in their favor? 

    The two states are so intertwined, culturally, emotionally, religiously and by treaty. I just have to think at some point this becomes a political issue, especially when someone of prominence gets gored. With no love loss between Obama and Bibi, if it is seen that O is persecuting Israelis on Israel soil, that might not be so kindly taken by Bibi who reportedly favored Romney in the last election. What do you think? What does AIPAC think? 

    Interesting to watch. Time will tell.

  21. Based on Brock traffic, Israel now seems to be emerging as extraterritorial flashpoint #3, with Switzerland perhaps #1 and Canada perhaps #2. This ranking is intuitive and based mainly on period of emergence. Maybe some stats geek could have fun tabulating (a) estimated total persons for each country (b) that estimate as % of estimated world total. To go further – typologize the factors contributing to ignition, and project the critical masses yet to start radiating.

  22. @Just Me…There are ~100,000 Israeli citizens in the US, and about twice as many American’s in Israel.  Israel, like most sane countries, has resident based taxation so Israelis abroad don’t have filing obligations. Israel does have an FBAR/FATCA type rule for it’s own residents that they must report foreign accounts, but the threshold is around $500,000 IIRC and of course only applies to locals.  Still, I’m sure the ITA (israeli tax authority) would love to get their hands on that data.  I’d also add that while Israel has traditionally had tough bank secrecy laws, Israel is more like Canada than Switzerland in that the taxes here are very high.  However there is no gift or estate taxes here.  (But there is 17% VAT)

  23. BenPloni

    Thanks for that insight.  So, again just wondering who has the most to gain or lose from a reciprocity deal, the US or Israel? I think it might be Israel when the tax revenues flow outward back to the U.S.  If Israel started taxing those 100,000 Israeli citizens in the US, I am sure there would be loud complaints in America, and just wondering if the same will occur in Israel when it finally dawns on them what this FATCA is all about.

    Will be watching for more stories…

  24. @Justme…people are asleep here insofar as I can tell vis-a-vis FBAR/FATCA…it’s only the banks telling them they have to fill out W9s etc that are starting to wake them up (and they are obviously not FBAR compliant.  I see lots of problems coming down the pipe in the next few years when people start waking up.  Although, having spoken to  more than one, I can say from their initial reaction that the IRS can go <bleep bleep>

    For the top 5 American Diaspora countries, I saw:

    1. Mexico (1.04 million)
    2. Canada (687,000)
    3. UK (224,000)
    4. Germany (211,000)
    5. Israel (184,000)

    I’m surprised we haven’t heard more from Mexico on here..

  25. @BenPloni, glad to have participation by readers offering information from Israel and other countries.

    Re: “surprised we haven’t heard more from Mexico on here…”. We have wondered too. Particularly re the issue of ‘fideicomisos’ , ex. http://hodgen.com/category/fideicomiso/ which seem just as problematic and punitively treated by the US, as some of the Canadian specific examples that we focus on – simply because those are the ones that many of us know the most about at firsthand.

    Unfortunately, without authors, or comments from readers from other countries, we don’t know enough about the intricate details and the politics of other contexts, and so face challenges to broadening the information and advocacy efforts here. Unilingualism is also a barrier, though we have been very lucky in having some multilingual readers and bloggers who have gathered and shared information here in several languages and from non-English sources.

    It may be that keeping Canada from signing an IGA, or challenging our own government in the event that it signs, may in the end help other countries – as an object lesson – since we have so many duals (second to Mexico), and the most extensive existing ‘reciprocal’ tax treaty with the US.

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