UPDATE 2: This post has been upgraded to a press release at newswire.ca and digitjournal.com. Thanks go to Jim Jatras.
UPDATE: Jim Jatras has provided an revised Word Version of the text below for mass distribution.
The following is a message from Jim Jatras:
Friends
Please review that following and submit comments. I hope it’s more or less self-explanatory.
As indicated in a previous comment, it’s in effect a kind of ad or statement inviting people to contact Harper, Flaherty, MPs and oppose FATCA/IGA. Ideally, it’s the kind of thing that would be posted online or even in print publications as an ad, if there were money for that. (If Canadian industry weren’t spending money trying to get the “best deal possible” from the Americans under an IGA instead of fighting.) Certainly individual comment letters to the Finance Department should be sent, but let’s not kid ourselves they will pay much attention them. What we need is a groundswell of outraged Canadians to contact Harper, Flaherty, and MPs as soon as possible with a simple message: NO!
I realize that it’s always risky to hang a draft out where anyone can take a whack at it, but feel free. Also, any ideas on where and how it can be posted and distributed are welcome.
BTW, this is the kind of thing that routinely gets placed in DC in publications like Politico, The Hill, Roll Call, and other pubs aimed at Congress. Picture a similar message aimed at Congress but making an American argument against FATCA, as this makes a Canadian one. That’s how we get things done – if we had someone with money and willing to fight.
Best
Jim
Call or email Stephen Harper, Jim Flaherty, and Your MP Today!
Call or email Stephen Harper, Jim Flaherty, and Your MP Today!
STOP an Impending Massive Handover of Canadian Sovereignty to the United States!
Tell the Government: Canada Must Say NO
to the United States on ‘FATCA’
Recently the Department of Finance invited comments on what was characterized as “an agreement to improve cross-border tax compliance through . . . the provisions enacted by the United States commonly known as the Foreign Account Tax Compliance Act (FATCA).” This eleventh-hour invitation came as sources in both Ottawa and Washington announced that they were close to finalizing an intergovernmental agreement (IGA) that would, in effect, deputize the Canadian government to enforce this American law in Canada.
The Department’s invitation is to “persons whose interests are affected by the provisions of FATCA” but does not spell out that each and every Canadian citizen would suffer from FATCA and from an IGA to implement it:
Canadian citizens have an interest in preserving Canada’s sovereignty against US encroachment. However it is disguised, FATCA is a unilateral U.S. initiative. The U.S. didn’t negotiate a global tax scheme with Canada and other countries but instead enacted an unprecedented extraterritorial law and demands that Canada comply and bear the costs. An IGA simply puts a Canadian glove on the hand enforcing American law.
Canadian taxpayers have an interest in a tax policy that benefits Canada’s needs, not America’s. Sold under the guise of “reciprocity” and “partnership,” an IGA in reality would be a costly one-way street imposed by the U.S. Given the differences between the two countries’ tax systems, FATCA would accelerate a zero-sum game that siphons wealth from Canada and robs the Canadian treasury.
Canadian consumers have an interest in avoiding foreign schemes that impose costly non-economic regulations on Canadian firms (banks, insurance companies, pension funds, stock and investment companies) – who will then pass those costs on to consumers. With or without an IGA, FATCA’s costs will be in the billions of dollars (for example, one major bank alone would pay an estimated $100 million in FATCA compliance!) These costs would be non-productive as regards the Canadian economy and a waste of human and material resources. Imposing these costs on Canadians supposedly is justified by the unproven hope that FATCA may trip up American “tax cheats,” even though FATCA does little specifically to catch such people.
Canadians as human beings have an interest in ensuring their rights are protected under sovereign Canadian law. FATCA demands extraordinary disclosure of private information of U.S. citizens in Canada in violation of Canadian laws, such as the Personal Information Protection and Electronic Documents Act, whose application Canada would be forced to alter under an IGA. Many of these resident Americans are Canadian dual citizens who would be denied protection of Canada’s laws to appease the U.S. Once it’s established a foreign government can demand abrogation of such rights, even of Canadian citizens, where’s the limit?
So why is the Government considering an IGA with the United States? Because of the very real fear that Washington otherwise would unilaterally impose FATCA on Canada at ruinous cost, especially a 30% withholding penalty on Canadian firms’ U.S.-derived revenue. Simply put, this is a threat of U.S. economic sanctions against Canada.
Finance Minister Flaherty and industry leaders publicly have talked a good fight on FATCA while in private negotiating Canada’s capitulation under an IGA. Canadians must not let that happen! Instead:
Contact Prime Minister Harper and tell him No on FATCA, and No on an IGA with Washington!
Contact Minister Flaherty and tell him No on FATCA, and No on an IGA with Washington!
Contact your Senators and MPs and tell them No on FATCA, and No on an IGA with Washington!
Get the FATCA facts! Find more information at [Isaac Brock Society and Repeal FATCA]
*FYI, for the non Canadian Chris Hall is actually an “On Air” reporter and commentator for CBC TV.
*Any thoughts on whether the revised FATCA timetable will still apply in the event of an IGA, or will the capitulation begin immediately?
*Same timetable. Need for Parliamentary approval sometime in the spring.
*Thanks Tim, an optimist could say that any delay might help kill this thing. Take it out behind the barn and put it out of it’s misery!
I just fired off our message to all of the BC NDP federal caucus members. Here is the list of NDP MP’s nation wide:
http://www.ndp.ca/ourcaucus
Me too.
@Calgary
As usual, excellent!
@all
I know I know I am a day late, dollar short, but catching up with my reading, and tweeted and emailed Chris Hall too, so he now has a reminder! 🙂
A little anecdote … Several years ago when I saw the change in the FBAR form I phoned our MPs office. I was deeply concerned about the privacy aspect. The woman l spoke to (named Wendy) was politely sympathetic but then I mailed off a copy of a blank FBAR form to her so she could actually see what I was trying to explain to her. Seeing is believing and although there was nothing Wendy could do about this she was sincerely sympathetic after receiving that FBAR form. She phoned me afterwards and we had another nice conversation but ultimately I was left all alone with the FBAR fear — until this year when I found Brock.
I think what our MPs need is a good old fashioned show and tell. Someone needs to plunk down on their desks all of the IRS tax forms required for a typical US connected Canadian resident (maybe someone with a salary, basic savings account, chequing account, RRSP, TDSP and a small investment portfolio). Any guess how high the stack of IRS forms would be, compared to what is required by the CRA? Personally, I think it would be pretty impressive. There would of course be no tax guide to “help” because the IRS does not provide this anymore to “overseas” filers (the last one we received was almost 1/2 inch thick though). The MPs need to be made aware that for an ordinary person attempting to complete all these forms without a foot fault which could result in thousands of dollars of penalties, he/she would have to search online for instructions or try to get questions answered by phone — IF he/she can find an IRS number to call other than the 800 number which cannot be used outside the USA. If this ordinary person simply cannot deal with all this complexity and is forced to hire a tax specialist then the MPs need to be aware of how much that would cost — all to prove to the IRS that zero or minimal tax is owed.
@Jim Jatras, @Petros,
It has been pointed out to me that the press release has:
Contact:
Global Strategic Communications Group, Darren Spinck at
202-669-4418
It looks like even where on the upper right-hand corner of the news release there is an organization profile, the link leads back to CNW Group, not to Isaac Brock where, I think, it would be more preferable to lead readers to us where questions can be answered and further information obtained.
Organization Profile
Isaac Brock Society
More on this organization
I got a response back from a newspaper in the Kootenay’s (lots of usps there) they want to run it but think it is a bit lengthy. I’ll see if I can do a more concise version.
@em
I can provide a picture of what a bankers box stuffed with tax returns and FBAR’s for 42 bank accounts for eight years sent to the IRS under OVDI looks like. My husband who remained fairly calm through the ordeal went ballistic when he heard it would cost over $200 to FedEx. It was the proverbial straw that broke the camels back.
@bubblebustin,
That’s good news from the Kootenay’s — thanks for following up on it.
Lioness is also working on a shorter version.
@ bubblebustin
No kidding? You’ve got a photo of that! Is there anyway to post it here without showing any personal identification? Perhaps e-mail the photo to Petros and ask him to post it? Eight years of our CRA returns would fit easily into an ordinary 8×10 mailing envelope. That’s exactly the difference I was trying to point out. A picture can be worth a thousand words. Some people really have to SEE the damage because sometimes trying to explain it just ends up sounding like blah, blah, blah.
@bubblebustin.
That’s a darn good idea — we can send photos of it all. I would LOVE for my MP, Canada’s Finance Minister and Canada’s Prime Minister to see with their own eyes the monstrosity I have. My banker’s box wasn’t big enough to additionally contain updated US return 1040’s, Schedules B, D, E; Forms 8833, 8949, 1116, 8582, 8891, 8948, 8938, Request for Waiver of Penalties and Reasonable Cause Arguments for 2009 – 2010 failure to include the requisite 3520 and 3520A for TFSA’s for myself and my husband and RDSP for my son (included now) to remedy our not-quite-complete original submittal of 2009 and 2010 returns. I think no one in Canada, least of all our government representatives, could imagine the imensity of what we have to provide to the US.
Also those who cannot imagine it are those who have their heads in the sand and are yet to be identified through FATCA. Perhaps that would get more US Persons Abroad to actually fight against what is and will be happening to them.
It is not hard to see the work that went into this documentation required by the US by professionals I had to hire, sucking $$ from my retirement savings, work I absolutely could NOT do myself.
It is so absurd; don’t get me going.
My original idea was to plunk blank forms on an MPs desk but photos are more doable. I would love to attach one of these types of revealing photos (see bubblebustin’s comment) to my FATCA e-mails. Call it “formography” if you want. 😉 Actually @calgary411, just reading the list of all those forms you sent away made me feel sick and dizzy. But stay calm, I don’t want you to get too wound up because you should be basking in the glow of having your renouncement day behind you.
I love your adding words to the English language, Em. Formography — that’s a very descriptive word you’ve come up with!
I am much less wound up than I was prior to Wednesday’s renunciation. It doesn’t take much for me to rewind though. I am still glowing and feeling good about that important step.
bubblebustin, thank you so much for that idea. I AM going to try to schedule a meeting with my thus-far non-responsive MP, Michelle Rempel, when she is next hanging around Calgary so she can see exactly the documentation I’ve described. You’re right — they would have no idea of the imensity of what US Persons in Canada have to deal with. Maybe I should invite her here for a cup of tea, less hard on the back.
Good grief! Photograph those document boxes!
@Pacifca,
Here are photos of mine: calgary411 US Tax Returns & Backup, 2005 – 2011
@ calgary411
OMG! Those photos are obscene!!! (How do you make a shocked smiley face?)
@calgary
that’s not formogrophy that’s FORMAGEDDON!
@Just Me
Thanks for reminding Chris Hall & Aossa Araxia – I sent it to her but guess she didn’t look or else just noticed it when u sent because she knows you
*Calgary 411 – I hear you …..I filed the following forms for 3 years in 2011: 1040 long and short , schedules A, B, D & E, 3520, 3520A, 1116, 6251, 1116 alternate min tax, 2555, 4952, 4562, 8582, 8582 alternate min tax, 5471, 8891, 2210. I paid US $14,000 in tax including failure to file penalties, failure to pay penalties, & interest charges. I have also paid Tax accountants and legal tax lawyers. Re 3520 filing – I received notices for the two years to pay late filing fees of $10,000 and $57,000. the $10,000 penalty reasonable cause letter has been accepted. I am still waiting for the $57,000 reasonable cause to be accepted. I haven’t heard about the “request for waiver of penalties.” I’ve learned more from this site in a few weeks, than I have from accountants and tax lawyers in the past year. Appreciate you pioneers! or should say warriors?
@ calgary411, bubblebustin and lioness
I dearly wish you hadn’t been forced to go through all that form trauma. It is so darn unfair. It was this sort of thing I had in mind when I wrote …
They’d like to make the world their zone
And weigh it down with forms
Tax our savings, fines galore
And snatch our dear first borns
The USA is undeserving of all those LCUs that it wrenched away from you. It has chosen to besiege innocents living abroad and is too arrogant to realize it is losing GWUs (Good Will Units) in the process.
*@Em,@Calgary,@Bubblebustin, and @ Lioness, wow, I can relate to the formageddon!!! Just four years of amended returns came to just under 600 pages; and have been told that 2011 alone could come to over 250 pages!!!
Absolutely no way on earth I’d even attempt doing them myself without professional help. Simply too risky. I regret looking back that I ever did any investing at all or that I opened a pension plan…would have been better off just having a simple savings account; or if I had known about all the complexities instead blindly investing like a Brit would have got my UK citizenship years earlier and relinquished. So many regrets…
I’m no longer so concerned about substantial US taxation going forward but agree that keeping compliant is going to force me to budget for at least 2500-3000 dollars per year for professional fees. If I decide to go ahead and renounce, it would be to simplify my life and reduce compliance costs rather than to primarily save double taxation…but as I wound up owing a ridiculously high five figure sum in tax because of pfic taxation, I’m terrified that renouncing could raise red flags because of up to a six year statute of limitation due to past under-reported income plus the fact that they might assume that I was trying to dodge tax. It seems that I will have to wait it out if I don’t want to risk an acrimonious ‘divorce’.
I just keep praying that we will finally be listened to. I hate feeling trapped like this. :'( I feel so vulnerable which is why it’s essential for me to stay anonymous for now. Was all above board with the UK taxman; all the more why I find all this so sickening.