Senators to Unveil the ‘Ex-Patriot Act’ to Respond to Facebook’s Saverin’s Tax ‘Scheme’
The Saverin fall-out, as expected, has begun:
Key quote:
The senators will call Saverin’s move an “outrage” and will outline their plan to re-impose taxes on expatriates like Saverin even after they flee the United States and take up residence in a foreign country. Their proposal would also impose a mandatory 30 percent tax on the capital gains of anybody who renounces their U.S. citizenship.
The plan would bar individuals like Saverin from ever reentering the United States again.
What does this mean? Can we never be free from these people? Is this implying that if you renounce citizenship now even with under the 2 million in assets that you will end up paying capital gains taxes anyway? And what is this about “re-imposing taxes on expatriates”? Does that mean that renouncing citizenship doesn’t do anything and that there would be no way to get out of the US net? Personally I couldn’t care less if they ban me from travelling there, but this has me very alarmed at what is going on. I just want to get rid of this unwanted, accidental citizenship and get about living my life in my own country!
@recalcitrantexpat, Definitely. Or as one family member said to me suspiciously one day at a reunion, “you must be one of those people who watch PBS….”
Because I was feeling perverse and out of sorts that day I replied, “Actually I mostly read Al-Jazeera sur Seine…” (aka Le Monde)
🙂
@Victoria, That is a good one!!
This is really terrible. It will be even MORE terrible if it passes– for America and Americans. Somehow given all of the foot-shooting in the last few years, this sort of thing comes at little surprise.
Thank goodness my nest egg is so small, it wouldn’t really affect me.
@Just Me, Victoria, Em and Jefferson, my sister in Texas just told me that Rush covered the Saverin topic, and I am encouraged by this. Whatever you think of Rush, he has a huge audience and he is very influential. He can mobilize people. Apparently he moved to Florida from New York because of the state taxes, and since then he gets audited every year and has to show his daily calendar to prove he doesn’t spend enough time in New York to be considered a resident. Oh yeah, he gets it about abusive tax laws. I am going to send him some information about us, about how we are being affected, how the US treats expats versus other countries, and how the US economy has suffered from the tax laws on expats. Again, thank you so much, Roger Conklin, for sharing your knowledge and history about this!
@ recalcitrantexpat…that was a brilliant read.
@foxyladyhawk Yes, and Rush is condemned as wrong by Fox Panel…
http://mediamatters.org/mmtv/201205190004?
I am gun-shy about Rush, as he tends to consolidate progressives against anything that he is for, even if he is right. There have been comments back and forth on this at… http://bit.ly/LoKaui
He is a wild card, and you never know what might come out of his mouth. I bet he talks about the Fox Panel criticism of him, because his dialog is always about “him” . Just download any transcript and do a search on “me” and that should tell you something.
Anyway, my lack of enthusiasm aside, I understand that others feel differently, but there is no controlling Rush when he gets on a subject. He is a dog with a bone when he gets gets worked up, and just doesn’t let go. He does have 10s of millions of “ditto heads” listening every week. Maybe ‘real Americans’ will get it, but somehow I doubt it, but I am open to be proved wrong.
@Just Me, I do understand your reservations about Rush. He has certainly gone overboard on occasion. Yes he’s self-centered and he often goes on way too long about things. I rarely listen to him. Way too many ads, among other things.
However, last week I was travelling in the States and I tuned in. I was pleasantly surprised to hear a show that was informative, thoughtful and actually well-moderated. He is very respectful to his callers, even when he disagrees with them, and I am not accustomed to hearing that with the “extreme” shows on the left as well as the right. When his callers disagreed with his opinion, he patiently explained why he believed as he did and was not at all insulting or even sarcastic.
He does have influence with his listeners, and I don’t think it’s quite fair to deny them the label “real Americans” – if that is what you meant. When you get past all the bombast, he usually does have his facts correct and his opinion is not always extreme, just strongly expressed. Like other influential people, it is probably worthwhile letting him know our point of view. If I can get through all his correspondence and get his attention, I think he’d be very sympathetic to expats renouncing due to tax complexities, and I am certain he’d be interested in facts showing how the tax code has harmed the US economy all these decades.
Anyway, here is a link to the transcript of his introduction to the Saverin piece on his show, FWIW.
http://www.rushlimbaugh.com/daily/2012/05/18/the_eduardo_saverin_question
I saw that Grover Norquist just came out and said that any Republican Senator or Congressman that votes for the Schumer Casey legislation would if they have taken a pledge to his Americans for Tax Reform organization not to raise taxes would be violating that pledge.
Schumer I believe came out with a later statement I am trying to find again cricitzing people not just for renouncing their citizenship but also for living outside the US. Schumer seemed to indicate back in the good old days no one ever wanted to live outside the US.
More about Grover Norquist for those who don’t know who he is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grover_Norquist
@Just Me
This reminds a lot of the whole AIG Financial Products bonus issue back in the spring of 2009 that everyone got hot under the collar over. I do think there might be a little bit of regional divide on this issue. The media commentators all criticizing Rush come from the Northeast while Rush lives in Florida. My sense has always been that Florida’s lack of state income tax has always been disliked among the Northeastern Establishment.
@tim- well I do know all about Mr. Norquist. This is the first thing that he and I agree upon. Having him come out against this piece of legislative theft will go a long ways towards its defeat. I have yet to see the Republicans vote for anything that Norquist was against. Especially when it comes to violating that pledge.
@recalcitrantexpat
Here is a link to Norquist’s Statement:
http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/international-taxes/228427-norquist-compares-schumers-tax-dodger-bill-to-the-nazis
@JustMe
I have also heard I a rumor that Eugene Scalia son of US Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia has been put on retainer by the Florida Bankers Association to fight the non resident alien reporting rule(aka DATCA) in court. The particular challenge the Florida Bankers Association intends to make will not be In US Tax Court but at the US Court of Appeal for the DC Circuit which is filled to the brim with batshit crazy rightwing Reagan and Bush appointed judges. The DC Circuit is where rejected Supreme Court nominee Robert Bork made a name for him.self
@ Just Me, I’m not here to defend Rush (though I agree with Ladyhawk’s earlier comment). Have whatever opinion you want about him. If he picks up our issue, then I’ll rejoice because he will effectively mobilize an entire part of the political spectrum in favor of our side. When I originally wrote my articles for the American Thinker, I was hoping that Rush would read them on the air. That was my dream. Back in April 2011 when I wrote with Monty Pelerin, “When government turns predator”, I was alone in my fight–now I have many allies. So it didn’t turn out at all bad even though Rush never read it on the air. But that is the only effective way to reach Limbaugh, to write something powerful that he will read. I know he reads the American Thinker. And I have written for them before.
As for the so-called progressives, they are already almost totally allied against freedom and our cause and they are the ones in favor of FATCA and cracking down on Americans abroad (consider Chuck Schumer and Bob Casey). To expect to be able court their attention and favor is tantamount to battered wife syndrome. I leave the courting of the progressives to you. If you manage to get them hear our story good. But mostly what I hear from them is, “I don’t care what those people say.” We heard it from the esteemed Prof Ackermann, and that other progressive female law professor, I forget her name. They don’t care who they make suffer as long as they get they are able to tax the rich.
And as for Rush using I/me, I’ve seen many analyses of Obama’s speeches that show an extraordinary usage of the first person pronoun. It is not a disease exclusive to the Rush. But when the progressive media has Rush Derangement Syndrome, well Rush finds it irresistible to talk about it. I don’t personally know why Obama does it. Some think that Obama suffers from Narcissistic Personality Disorder.
If you are offended that I speak of Obama in this manner, I am just saying this: Don’t get your nose out of joint about a potential ally who could help us. Remember who has done this to us. The crackdown started with the Obama administration. It is true the Republicans are to blame too because of lamentable legislation that they were also responsible for passing. This is bi-partisan persecution. But our current persecutor occupies the White House. His initials are BHO.
We should also consider the possibility of Mark Steyn because he is frequent substitute on Rush’s show. What about Canadian Ezra Levant? These two would probably be considerably more accessible than Limbaugh.
@Petros and JustMe
I think in terms of progressive voices to reach out to I would look to those who have in the past who voices positive feelings towards Canada. The first two in this group I can think of off the top of my head would be Bill Maher(who has Kim Campbell on as frequent guest and Michael Moore. Most other progressives I think would have a hard time finding Canada on a map. There is a bigger divide on that is American Progressives are very unhappy with status quo whereas Canadian Progressives such as say Dalton McGuinty and Dwight Duncan are very content with the current state of affairs. In many ways Rush and Grover Norquist are more the natural allies of someone such as Dalton McGuinty than Chuck Schumer or Bob Casey would be.
@foxyladyhawk
Thanks for your feedback on Rush. I have not listened to him since last year, when on a drive across Nebraska. It seemed that his show was the only thing I could hear. What you describe, I did not hear, but pleased if you say he was more moderated. Maybe he is mellowing in age, or maybe this was after his last blow up on the air that he had to apologize for and is now trying to be more measured. I don’t know. Again, I will respect those that like him, and think he has important or valuable things to say. Like I have said elsewhere, I have friends who love him, but he is just not to my taste. It is ok if you disagree with me and appreciate what he had to say. It has been a year since I have tuned him in, so in fairness maybe I should. Maybe he is a new person now.
@Petros… To your point about the me/I syndrome with Obama too. I agree. It bothers me too. As for my nose being out of joint, trust me, I just looked in the mirror and it is just fine. I am just expressing my personal distaste for Rush’s style and the possible consequences if he suddenly champions our cause. The only one worse is probably Michael Savage, and I wouldn’t entertain trying to reach out to him either. Again, others may, but I think I will try to get thinking progressives to turn up the heat on Obama and Treasury for their misguided policies, as I think that will be more effective than Rush attacks, but again, I maybe wrong. Probably am. If you turn out to be right, then I will be more than happy to apologize. I have been totally ineffective so far, ( James Fallows trilogy, the sole exception) so in the end, it might take a partisan attack to get their attention. I personally had hoped to avoid that, but it may be unavoidable. I appreciate your point of view.
@Tim..
That is interesting about Norquist, as that pledge or fear that a vote would be breaking the pledge sure strikes fear in the hearts of Republicans, so that should make them hold the line. Thanks for the link!
This is significant. So wonder how Fox is going to triangulate between Rush and Norquist! This might be interesting.
Norquist is very important. He will also understand the value of ex-pats for promoting US exports.
Homelander progressives are having difficulty understanding the connection.
@ Tim: you said: “US Court of Appeal for the DC Circuit which is filled to the brim with batshit crazy rightwing Reagan and Bush appointed judges”.
FWIW, my opinion of some of the extreme lefties in the judiciary is similarly strong.
The point about the objection to DATCA is that it affects Florida enormously because it is the home of many many immigrants, often from repressive regimes ( eg, Cuba and Venezuela ) in their homelands that would be delighted to get the names of people whose families may still be in the country of origin and who may be getting money quietly from their Florida members. Political refugees are a constituency that I think people from both sides of the spectrum wish to protect. This is why Marco Rubio is one Congresscritter who opposes DATCA and similarly intrusive IRS activities.
Clearly some of us here see hope for support from the left, and some see hope on the right. Sometimes the two sides can and do come together on certain issues, and I would hope that abusive IRS practices, politicians who go overboard in using the tax code to punish individuals, and the harm done to the US economy by tax policies that are based in ideology instead of practicality, fairness and efficiency would be among them.
You may want to help update Casey’s and Schumer’s wikipedia pages.
http://www.migrationinformation.org/Feature/print.cfm?ID=905
Renouncing US Citizenship: A New Trend?
By Muzaffar Chishti and Faye Hipsman
September 12, 2012
@badger
thanks for posting this article-good find!
*