Petros made some great suggestions about how to get the word out and make it stick. As I was brainstorming the other night it occurred to me that this is an election year and, if we take the right actions, we just might get some traction with some people who would otherwise happily ignore the whole business. These are 3 easy things that I have done or will do and I offer them to you as suggestions. If you have your own ideas, feel free to add them in the comments section:
1. Contact the U.S. Political Parties: There are overseas groups of the major political parties who are right now trying to drum up support among overseas Americans. I belonged to one and I sent them a letter two days ago asking them to cancel my membership. In my note I informed them that I was not giving them any more money and that I would not be supporting their candidate in the 2012 presidential elections nor any other member of their party running in the national elections because of FATCA and their support for IRS efforts to hunt down hard-working Americans overseas. If you are not willing to do this, then contact them anyway and express your deep concern about this issue. Tell them that you will give them your support if they are willing to publicly take a stand on this issue (FATCA, FBAR, “amnesty programs”) Here are the websites of the overseas branches of the two major parties: Democrats Abroad and Republicans Abroad.
2. Contact friends and family in the U.S.: Maybe you can’t vote for some reason in the 2012 elections but they can. Send them a copy of the National Taxpayer Advocate report. If you haven’t already, tell them how this is impacting you and encourage them to write letters to the local paper or to contact their representatives. Be personal and specific and demonstrate how this will effect them. “Would you like to continue to have your American grand-children visit you during the summer? Or “Are you OK with the fact that we are so scared that we may not be coming to see you in the U.S. in the foreseeable future?” Nasty? No, this is reality for a lot of people. I told my friends and family who I was NOT voting for in 2012 and got some really angry mail back. “You can’t do that!” Well, actually I can and will.
3. Register to vote: I know, I know, I know that some people are scared to do this or they think it’s a waste of time and I’m not going to criticize anyone who prefers not to. I’d just point out that, in my humble opinion, the time for hiding our heads in the sand has come and gone. If FATCA goes forward and, since there are more and more international data-sharing initiatives, the chances of being found are dramatically increasing every year. Do we all want to sit back and watch our accounts in our host countries being closed (and just try living in the EU with nothing but cash)? The 2012 elections will be tight and so few people vote in the U.S. anyway that I think large numbers of requests for absentee ballots coming in from overseas will make them sit up and take notice. And, trust me, it isn’t even that hard to do – the states are REQUIRED to mail you a ballot anywhere you are in the world (see UOCAVA and the MOVE act. There are several organizations out there that have wizards that will guide you through the process. I’m convinced that we have nothing to lose and everything to gain by voting.
Your ideas?
Renounce :-)! I just don’t see any way out of this. I expect the IRS to eventually drop the spousal/IRS issues later, after a lot of renunciations, and a big maybe for the bank account in resident country. But the problems inherit to the FACTA, I’m afraid, are never going away.
#2 – I send stuff to my parents and friends in America all the time. Some people there think it’s crazy, and overreaching but what are they going to do? This doesn’t affect their lives. Maybe it will, maybe it won’t.
About #3 – this is exercising Rights as a US Citizen. There could be some situations where someone may not want to do this for fear that the US will say “Request for Renunciation, Denied. You registered to vote.” The US Gov. can not be trusted.
Here’s my red-white-& blue striped towel. I’m throwing it in.
Oh, geeeez, I totally understand your frustration and despair. But, hey, I think we got nothing to lose at this point.
And before I go down (even think about renouncing) I am going to fight like hell.
I have not voted in US, in 40 years My first appointment is for 3 Feb, would be unwise to start now.
If a person exercises the right of voting in a US election, that should not preclude them from renouncing.
There are 7 ways to relinquish US citizenship, one of which is renunciation. These expatriating acts are enumerated in the Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 349.
Renunciation (s.349(5)) is he most common way to relinquish citizenship, the act of “making a formal renunciation …before a … consular officer.” This is an act which terminates citizenship from that day forward. So, there appears to be no incongruity in exercising the rights of US citizenship until the date of renunciation.
One can also apply for a CLN based on a past act or acts. But if one claims that they lost their citizenship due to a past act (s. 349, (1)(2)(3)(4)(6) or (7)), but then voted in a US election after performing the expatriating act, then Department of State could consider that the person didn’t lose their nationality on the date alleged because they continued to exercise rights of US citizenship.
So, there would appear to be no problem with voting up until one relinquishes one’s citizenship. In the case of relinquishment by renunciation, it seems both parties agree that the person is a US citizen, entitled to all attached rights, until the moment they make the oath of renunciation.
Rivka raises a good point, though, and it does make sense to me that if you’re planning to renounce, cutting your ties (or not establishing new ones) in the period leading up to renunciation would seem to buttress the firmness of your intent.
I’ve been posting on many of the articles talked about here on Facebook, but no one really responds because most folks just don’t care about these political issues that they don’t think applies to them. I think I will try emailing them directly this time around and see what response I get.
I used to get emails from Democrats abroad, but unsubscribed from their list about two years into Obama’s term when I realized what a lie and disappointment he is. But writing to Democrats and Republicans abroad is a good idea. I will do that just to see what their response, if any, is.
There are two other candidates I would like to suggest that we write to: Buddy Roemer and Rocky Anderson. Roemer is running on the Republican ticket but has not been invited to debates because his views don’t coincide with the establishment:
http://www.democracynow.org/2012/1/6/buddy_roemer_gop_pres_candidate_who
Rocky Anderson is a former Democrat running as an independent
http://www.democracynow.org/2011/12/13/ex_salt_lake_mayor_rocky_anderson
I know neither of these guys have a chance at winning, but it wouldn’t hurt to see if they could raise awareness of our plight out there.
Thanks for finding this…
“then Department of State could consider that the person didn’t lose their nationality on the date alleged because they continued to exercise rights of US citizenship.”
I had an eerie feeling that this was the case, and you found the reg. in black and white. There are so many pitfalls to US immigration law. They make it so hard to get rid of!
If you wish to claim that you relinquished your citizenship 40 years ago, which was automatically the case if you took citizenship back then, then don’t vote. It could affect your relinquishment:
http://isaacbrocksociety.com/2011/12/12/relinquish-dont-renounce-if-you-can/
http://isaacbrocksociety.com/2011/12/16/did-you-relinquish-before-february-6-1995-then-you-did-not-have-to-inform-the-state-department/
http://isaacbrocksociety.com/2011/12/16/from-the-archive-did-you-relinquish-here-are-some-proofs-that-the-state-department-uses/
Zucchero, I had the same response when I posted things. No one cares, or is even curious.. so I gave up on them. I bet [most] everyone who has tried to talk to American has experienced the same thing…
I know exactly what you folks are talking about. I wasn’t getting any traction either. We’re far away and people don’t see how this impacts them. So we have to make it personal and connect the dots for them. This will be different for every one of us but here are a few ideas:
1. Elderly parents needing care. Well, if we can’t come home, we can’t care for them, can we? If we have siblings, the burden will fall on them. Point this out.
2. Family property: Sorry, folks, we can’t inherit the farm/the family home. So when you pass on, it will have to be sold and there is a real possibility that the US Gov will get the proceeds. Be proactive and leave it to a foundation. I’m sure they will be thrilled by that.
3. Children and grand-children: Sorry we are too scared to go down and renew their passports (and ours too) so from now on you have to come to us. Can’t afford it? Well, I guess you won’t be seeing us or the grandkids/cousins/nieces or nephews for the next 10 years or so….
4. Oops we got audited (or think we will) and so we are coming home. Of course we may have no money at that point and no job so we’ll just come and camp at your house until we get on our feet again. But with the economy the way it is, this might take awhile. Oh and by the way can you send us enough money for a ticket to the U.S. for four people?
See what I mean? Make it THEIR problem too….
Oh and I wanted to say zucchero81 thanks for the ideas and the heads-up on the two candidates. I will write to them today and if I get an answer, I’ll post it here.
If you are going to vote and your’e looking for a Republican candidate who is a natural ally for the expat community then you should be looking at Ron Paul. He has come out clearly against FATCA and the U.S. government’s attempt to apply any of its laws outside of its borders.
Although it is not possible for Paul to win the party’s nomination he is running a strong second of third in the primaries and is therefore set up to have a heavy influence on the party’s election platform.
@recalcitrantexpat:
I was just reading today how the Patriot Act was drafted under Clinton and approved by Bush, and reapproved by Obama.
Likewise, misdirected (or possibly directed) crackdowns on expats started under Clinton, got worse under Bush, and got terrible under Obama. It was a continuation through each President. So if anyone is going to appeal to politicians, they should try to appeal to them all.
Just my opinion. People can write to whoever they want to.
Yes. It is there problem too. If “they” look at the problem and see that the United States can’t sell products overseas, may be its because people sent over to promote products can’t even open a bank account. Little inconvenient, doncha think?
I agree. Yet when it comes to our specific issues as expats persecuted by US policies, it is clear that both major parties are to blame. So then it comes down to figuring out who among the candidates best serves our interest; we have suffered the most under Obama as under any other administration, democrat or republican. So where does that leave us?
In the end it is pointless to even think that any expat vote can make a difference on American policy towards us. It may seem contradictory but the strongest vote that an expat has is the one of renunciation/relinquishment.
The U.S. has been on a war footing ever since the beginning of the “War on Drugs” which militarized the local police and diminished the citizen’s protections against violations of his/her privacy. Since then things have gotten progressively worse to the point that Americans now gladly embrace anything that they feel will protect them against the unknown terrors of religious extremist.
America is now a country that is engulfed in a paranoia that is destroying the protections of the individual against the tyrannical demands of the state.
Further to recalcitrantexpat’s previous:
“Any society that would give up a little liberty to gain a little security will deserve neither and lose both.” — Benjamin Franklin
PS. Ron Paul is a hero!
geeeeez,
After significant introspection, I came to the conclusion that “renunciation” was the only solution to a government of which I have no representation within its lawmaking body.
The right to vote for a US president is not representation. It is the equivalent of Great Britain’s claim that America’s colonists were “virtually represented” by the King of England — pure hogwash.
America’s Founders understood this and renounced British citizenship. Their bold decision and courage to go through with it serves as my moral compass.
There is a saying that, “in all wars the first victim is truth”. During both World Wars there were terrible violations of the civil rights of those resident segments of the U.S. population who were somehow seen as being connected with the enemy. Probably the most glaring example of this was the internment of Japanese/American citizens during WWII. These people had their possessions sold, suffered the break up of their families and lost their livelihoods.
America’s war on tax evasion has reached the level of irrational hysteria and FATCA/FBAR reporting requirements concretize this hysteria into the very institution of government. The fact that FATCA did not exist was never a hinderance to the IRS seeking out and punishing tax evaders. All that it meant was the the IRS had to work harder but that at least protected innocent people from being unfarily harrassed and punished.
There are two basic things that are important to the quality of a game: one is talented athletes but the other is good officiating. If the officiating is too tight then the game won’t be any fun but it will be safe. On the other hand if the officiating is too loose then the game won’t not be any fun because the rules that define the game aren’t being observed and this makes it harder to understand the game itself. Lax officiating will also make the game very dangerous for the participants.
Right now FATCA/FBAR’s make the game to rigid and this is why U.S. citizenship is now a threat to the life of every expat. Holding on to U.S. citizenship out of sentiment will end up destroying you in the end. Remember that the U.S. harbours no sentimental feelings whatsoever for you. For all intensive purposes you, as an expat, don’t even exist on the U.S. political landscape. All that they want from you is for you to know that they can destroy you whenever they see fit. This is the lesson of the U.S. tax code.
recalcitrantexpat,
The American colonists didn’t start rebelling until the British began enforcing legislation that was highly repressive, but for years, largely ignored.
How history repeats itself.
PS. Legislation in which the colonists had no say in the making.
Boiled Frog- the irony of the situation has not been lost on me either. It’s too bad that the American government isn’t as equally ideologically self aware of how it has come full circle back to where it all began.
BoiledFrog:
I think a part of the British culture, where you are OWNED by your government, passed onto the American culture. I think back in those days, you were supposed to serve and there was no renunciation. But they didn’t have FATCA back then, so you could open a bank account anyway… no tax returns to file back in England either.
I can’t help it, but I just become angrier and angrier every day. I can’t transfer money to Brazil because all the banks tell me that they will tax it like is earnings (I’ve been hearing that for 6 years now), but I can’t open an account in another country. It’s so irritating to be caught in this mess!
geeeez,
Perhaps I am wrong, but Brazil doesn’t appear to be very business friendly for entrepreneurs. I read a lot of good things about Chile and also Paraguay, although they seem quite different. Do you have an opinion on this?
recalcitrantexpat,
I think the Americans inherited institutionalized hypocrisy from the Brits, then took it to a whole new level as the empire expanded.
Boiled Frog: I think that America has fallen victim to its own success. The fall of the Soviet Union was completely unexpected when it did happen, and America was caught without a plan for how to behave as the lone super power left in the world. I guess that what I am saying is that the fall of the Soviet Union, which was the only other economic alternative to American Captialism, may not have been good for America itself.
This because it left America without a serious ideological and econmic system competitior. This has allowed America to pretty well have free run in the world. I don’t believe that America has much a sense of what it is “not”. I say this not only because of the two immoral wars that America has been engaged in, but also because America is in many making itself over into the image of the former Soviet Union.
When you look at the growth of in the powers of the U.S. government and the corresponding dimmunition of protections for indvidual privacy. When you listen to Newt Gingrich seriously contend that it is possible to Constitutionally protect the rights of a person who is accused of a criminal act while at the same time eliminating them for a terrorist suspect, you have to shudder. A crime is a crime and until a judge and or jury has handed down a verdict it is wrong to allow any one office to make that decision. But this is exactly what is now enshrined in American law in such bills as the- National Defense Authorization Act.
FATCA and FBAR’s are a symptom of a government that has come to resemble more that of China or Russia. What America needs is a serious competitor on the world stage. I guess that in this way the U.S. has become to resemble the smugness that characterized the British Empire.
recalcitrantexpat,
Thanks for your insights. I think we are on the same page regarding the shift in the global balance of power after the collapse of the Soviet Union.
FATCA and FUBARS are only symptoms of repressive government. The smoking gun is America’s prison system which includes more people (nominal and per capita) than not only in China or Russia, but more people than the entire population of Switzerland if you count those on probation and parole.
http://www.economist.com/node/16636027
Who knows, the US may eventually have to start a penal colony like the Brits did in Australia.
Victoria, thanks for your suggestions. It may seem like tilting at windmills, but as Margaret Meade said, “A small group of thoughtful people could change the world. Indeed, it’s the only thing that ever has.”
Every little thing each of us does matters, including voting. A write-in vote for Ron Paul, which I did in 2008, is one vote that was counted as cast, but NOT counted as cast for a Republocrat.
Check out Americans Elect at http://www.americanselect.org/about
It is a for-real online nominating process where US registered voters directly nominate any two candidates from either party, or neither, for the Americans Elect ticket. There will be an online convention in June and the ticket will be chosen by all voters who participated. And here is why it is significant: they are on the way to putting the non-partisan Americans Elect ticket on the ballot in every state. This could be a much better leveraging of your vote than forlornly voting as usual.
You are right, we need to take advantage of the fact t is an election year.