“Even in era of emailed ballots, corralling far-flung voters proves troublesome.”
Global Post, a news feeder organization for PBS and NPR ran a story with this headline a couple days ago that caught my attention.
BANGKOK, Thailand — There is no variety of American voter quite so unreliable as expatriates. They vote far less frequently than even teenagers and high-school dropouts. When it comes to campaign contributions, they donate less than 1 percent of the total haul.
I thought it rated at least a short comment. There are only 3. Maybe some of you will think so too. Maybe you can explain why you are sooo lazy, or not! 🙂
Confederationh’s brutal honesty is easier to take if you think of him more affectionately as Brock’s resident Archie Bunker.
Consider a family, a workplace, a society based on an interest like paleontology, a religious group, or what have you. You decide that you regard a family member as a black sheep, that you will diss a coworker as a pain in the ass, that you will ostracize a club member you do not cotton to, that you ought to shun a heretic, etc. You think that the object of your distaste taints the situation to the extent that you would not bring a friend home, would recommend that others seek employment elsewhere, would dissuade a person with similar interest from joining the interest group, would advise the seeker to find a different congregation, etc. In effect, are you then not saying that other people lack the skills required to make their own assessments of the personalities in the social gathering? Is this arrogance? Is the world filled with norms and purities that your sage vigilance can protect? Scapegoating is one of the scariest power plays going. Sort of like bundling up extraterritorials as tax cheats.
“In effect, are you then not saying that other people lack the skills
required to make their own assessments of the personalities in the
Qualifying a personal recommendation of this site with a personal caveat
as to some of the content does not ‘scapegoat’. Others are entirely free to make up their own minds about what they read here. However, to stay silent may imply an endorsement of what I find neither true nor constructive. There are sins of ‘omission’ as well as of
Brutal expression is not necessarily evidence of honesty.
*calgary411, the US is going to have to change its laws to allow discrimination against national origin, since its banks will have to figure out the nationalities of all of their customers and report them to foreign governments. To assist banks with the costs of this, the government could enforce a sales tax of 20%.
@zuludogm, calgary411, nobledreamer, badger and confederationH,
A common problem with online communication is that misunderstandings and miscommunication are common occurrences. It is easy to overreact or to view a comment differently from its intent or actual meaning. I’d say, relax, don’t take things to seriously, be patient and friendly towards everyone and try to see things from the other person’s situation or perspective. With a bit of dialog, one may learn to see that the interests or intent of another are far different from what one had previously thought. I would think that all of you and I are all more or less following a similar friendly path, but have different means of expressing the journey. I doubt that some differences are as great as they may seem.
*As I have mentioned earlier, I’ve been accused online of being anti-semite maybe around 10’000 times in 10 years. Yet, nobody has ever once made that claim to me in person. Nor have I ever hated a single Semite at any point in my entire life. Nor have I ever advocated, supported or justified for any Semite to be hated. I have always spoken out against the hatred of Semites and will continue to so, but I recognize that Israeli expansions in the nation of Palestine are a condition of apartheid and I will continue to be wrongly accused of being a racist since I believe and recognize that Jewish and Palestinian Semites have the right to be treated fairly and equally in a one or two-state nation. I oppose racism, I oppose the anti of Semites, I oppose ethnic cleansing and I oppose apartheid. Thus, I will forever be hated by racists who will continue to call me an “anti-Semite” to defend their hatred.
In otherwords, the concept of racism has a very different meaning in a world of letters without faces.
@calgary411 and badger
Regarding the paper by KEVIN PRESLAN on “Turn about Fair Play”. It does look like with FATCA and the resulting DATCA being imposed on U.S. Banks, Mexico will get it’s wish. That is unless the Republicans win the whole November 6th enchilada and kill it, and by doing so, undermine FATCA reciprocity. Will be interesting.
I appreciate your well-stated clarification.
FWIW, I missed a lost of posts over the summer and have only a vague idea of what you are referring to. I am always ready to hear what all have to say; if I don’t like what I read, I just ignore it. I was only interested in communicating to zuludogm that I hoped he would remain.
@JustMe, it will be interesting to see what happens. If the US is as large a tax haven as the various articles state, it seems unlikely to give up that revenue. The US and IRS keep saying that they are not promising true reciprocity. I find it hard to believe that in the end, the US banks will be made to comply.
from the paper by KEVIN PRESLAN on “Turn about Fair Play”.
…………” The main
obstacle that the United States would face in exchanging information related to
interest earned by Mexican residents from U.S. banks is the strong opposition posed
by the U.S. banking sector, which has opposed similar requests in the past.“…..
@all and particularly confed
I actually tried to retrieve the post within the time window, but for some reason, it did not delete it. I was venting because I think that these rants are off subject and can lead visitors to marginalize the rest of the information and sentiments here (and I have many other problems with them as well, but stating those would be off-subject).
Confed – as I said, I otherwise appreciate your posts.
On subject: I have voted in every election despite a pragmatic sense that I am spitting in the ocean. However, I will not in this election for a number of reaons: many of them already have been better stated here:
I chose not to vote in this election because the incumbent has made it clear that I will have to change everything in my family’s life in order to survive and live a life with dignity and fairness. I will have to relinquish my US citizenship as quickly as possible to protect my family from expropriation and even loss of basic freedom of movement and imprisonment. I cannot morally participate in the future of a country for which I hold no allegiance and, in fact detest.
The other practical reason is the next wave of misery for USPA’s. We have been focusing on the heavy hand of the US federal government while taking our eyes off the possibly more dangerous individual states.
Voting registration in a state that you no longer reside in and have no intention of ever returning to can be a very serious risk to your liberty.
Despite pleas to vote, I don’t think it’s wise. For those who can afford it, it makes more sense to contribute against candidates who pillory their countrymen abroad (e.g. Levin, Schumer, Grassley, Rangel, Kerry, Biden, Tierney, Honda, Casey, Baucus, Nelson), but even these gestures of resistance are probably futile unless you could bring substantial cash. These are very powerful men and are unlikely to lose an election as they bring conspicuous benefits to their constituents (at our expense).
Perhaps if we made a targeted approach, as the AIPAC did against Graham, then we can set an example, but we are otherwise all, just spitting in the ocean.
So here it is, less than a month from the election, if I had 100$ to donate to sink an enemy of USPA’s, to which opponent’s campaign would it likely do the most good. I am not so sure it would be best sent to Romney, although I feel a sense of relief when I hear Romney-Ryan say “territorial taxation”. Perhaps the co-sponsor of the Ex-Patriot Act could feel some heat:
He’s looking vulnerable and if we were loud enough to be the deciding factor, then our other adversaries would think twice before they become the next target.
So… where do you want me to send my 100$?
I see this story got repeated at the Pittsburgh Post Gazette. Must have been looking for weekend fill:)
I keep looking for signs that the banks will not be required to comply. Geithner and Company have sure ignored Congress and bank complaints to this point. DATCA starts Jan 1, 2013. If the Dems win, I am sure there is an Amendment prepared ready to be attached to whatever agreement is made to avert the Fiscal Cliff. In my unsophisticated opinion, if their lobby efforts play out, that is where it will be buried. Or if the Republicans win, it will be in a massive reconciliation bill (immune to filibuster) where they impose a dare on Moderate Massachusetts Mitt to veto all their Republican pet extreme social and fiscal issues. (He will have to pay up to those that nominated him!) I doubt it gets much public discussion.
@zuludogm: thank you for your generous rejoinder and your decision to continue to participate here. I would remind all readers that the DNA of this website is one of free discussion, meaning by necessity that Confederate’s comments does not reflect the views of the Isaac Brock Society. Therefore, it is not an indication that we’ve become “sleazy” but rather that we continue to allow free discussion.
Still, even some of the most shocking comments at this blog have thus far have not approached the outrageous and rude online discussions that I’ve seen elsewhere, even on much larger successful websites (like Business Insider, Zero Hedge, even the Globe and Mail).
If the US banks are required to comply, costs of implementation are going to be passed on to customers, and not just customers of foreign origin. At this point, I hope the banks tell the customers the truth about why they’re raising fees and perhaps not offering free checking anymore, as someone mentioned, and explain the details of the law to the public.
I maybe wrong, but I don’t think that in the US, we’ll see banks denying banking to visa and green card holders, who haven’t acquired US citizenship yet. If that happens, I expect lots of lawsuits, unlike what is happening in other countries who shut down banking access to Americans.
Just a few lines I’d like to highlight from “Turn about Fair Play”
Swiss banks were sworn to this secrecy in 1934 due to then-Nazi Germany pursuing this information from Germans who were believed to be Jews or political opponents.25 While similar circumstances are not occurring today, Swiss bank secrecy law still exists more than 75 years later.
The United States has little to gain from exchanging this information on a regular basis. While Mexico is willing to offer reciprocity to the United States, this offer has minimal appeal. U.S. taxpayers are not depositing their money in Mexican banks.
According to the United States Department of Justice, “UBS has . . . agreed to expeditiously exit the business of providing banking services to United States clients with undeclared accounts.” While this is a victory for the United States, the long-term effects of the UBS Agreement end there.
The USP abroad could not be more invisible, yet surely account for a significant portion of the great increase in voluntary disclosures brought about by the OVD programs.
Speaking of OVDI, it’s 10 months and counting for mine. Some in the program are speculating that the IRS will let the clock run out on responding to the minnow submissions. What next? Would that result in an automatic opt-out situation? Anyone have any idea what would transpire when the IRS neglects to respond in the time stipulated they would?
What is the timing for IRS response to submissions, bubblebustin — one year?
*There are probably a lot more US person bank accounts with Mexican banks than most realize.
But most of it belongs to Mexicans who hold dual US citizenship. According to the Treasury Department report on tax Form 2555 submitted with tax returns filed from abroad, which was for the most recent year available which was 2006, there were 6,112 form 2555s submitted from Mexico. Considering the fact that there are more US citizens living in Mexico than in Canada, this demonstrates that Mexico is not very high on the food chain of the IRS.
There was a day, 30 years or more ago, when Mexican banks offered a higher-than-average interest rate on US dollar deposits and had a rather large number of accounts with US residents. But when the financial crisis hit Mexico in te 1980s and all of these dollar accounts were converted to peso accounts by the Governmnt of Mexico, Americans with deposits there literally lost their shirts.
I have not followed this in recent years, but as far as I know today you must be a resident of Mexico in order to open a bank account there. I am not aware that Dollar accounts are available with Mexican banks today, like they used to be some 30 year ago.
@bubblebustin- I am not aware that there was a time limit for responses to OVDI submissions. If one calls the OVD hotline, the message is that submissions are being handled on a first come, first serve basis. As far as I can tell, they are now handling submissions from early Sept 2011. They first check them for completeness in terms of documents.
The next thing they do, which makes it feel like the OVDI process will go on forever, is that they will ask you for extensions to the statute of limitations for the time to assess tax until end 2013 for all closed years. They send you a new Form 876. If you were a non-filer, then you will not likely receive this request as your returns are still open for another 2 years. The FBAR statute of limitations that you signed is until end 2012.
10 months is a long time, but at least you heard something on your PLR. If it is any consolation, I am now 24 months in the wonderful world of VD and I had my first contact from an agent last month. I have cooperated with every program and rule change and until now it has only led to more time in purgatory waiting to see how hard the axe will come down. It is disgusting that they have left both of us in limbo so long.
I can’t remember exactly. I have a call in to our lawyer about it. The possibility of this happening is causing us a great deal of added stress with the prospect of more shifting sands from our friends at the IRS. All of this is cruel and unusual punishment for those just wanting to comply!
Thanks for the insight. I had heard that all the Canadian submissions were being held up in Austin and now the RRSP’s are being dealt with within OVDI. I don’t remember seeing anything dealing with response time limits (my memory of the experience is a blur of stress and fear) but another person I’ve been in touch with said there was a form that dealt with this.
@bubblebustin – I hope this will save you some stress and lawyer’s fees. I am sure there is no minimum response time. Look at Just Me. It took him about one year to get his process going. You will not be kicked out of the program. They will get to you. If anything, you should be focusing on what your reasonable cause arguments will be for a potential opt out. I would not count on any flexibility other than for RRSPs within OVDI. I would love to be proven wrong. We will see.
When we spoke with a TAS agent some months ago, she said that TAS had been negotiating first time penalty abatements within OVDI. In a rather unconventional move, and with our lawyers approval, we included what amounts to a reasonable cause letter with our submission. But, as you say, we will see.
*”No question now, what had happened to the faces of the pigs. The
creatures outside looked from pig to man, and from man to pig, and from
pig to man again; but already it was impossible to say which was which.”
– George Orwell, Animal Farm, Ch. 10
I posted this on another IBS thread, but it would be most useful here as well, as it carefully describes the sheer size of those abroad who are unable to vote in US elections from abroad. In other words, US state and federal law prevents them from having any say whatsoever – even symbolically over the laws that punish and bind us, even as we are made vulnerable to US laws that impose draconian and confiscatory extraterritorial tax and reporting burdens:
to a very well written article:
‘Born overseas to American parents, but unable to vote‘
by Brett Goodin, former fellow, International Center for Jefferson Studies at Monticello, Charlottesville, Va.
The author describes how the many US citizens
born and living abroad are disenfranchised – legally made not eligible to vote …..”Depending on the base numbers used for this calculation, the ultimate
number of disenfranchised non-domicile citizens likely range from
308,830 to 363,978, as previously estimated. …”- and
he underscores that this disenfranchisement does not however, exempt us from the obligations imposed by the US for taxation and the US
military draft. …..”To add insult to injury, these “non-domicile” citizens have all the
responsibilities of citizenship, such as being required to file annual
tax returns with the IRS and, for males aged 18, register with the
Selective Service. The “no taxation without representation” sentiment on
Independence Day rings very hollow to those still disenfranchised and
licking stamps to the IRS…. “
A very good link to include in your comments rebutting
the ignorant opinions expressed by homelanders who insist that the
enforcement of US extraterritorial citizenship-based tax ‘buys’ the
right to vote. If only 22 states allow those who have never resided in the US to register to vote (under certain limited circumstances), then effectively, the majority of the states in the US endorse taxation and the military draft without any political representation whatsoever – even symbolic.