Transfer of Records from CRA to IRS Doubled to 315,000
Elizabeth Thompson of CBC is reporting the number of FATCA records transferred from CRA to IRS doubled from 2016 from 2015.
Banking records of more than 315,000 Canadian residents were turned over to the U.S. Internal Revenue Service last year under a controversial information sharing deal, CBC News has learned.
That is double the number transferred in the deal’s first year.
The Canada Revenue Agency transmitted 315,160 banking records to the IRS on Sept. 28, 2016 — a 104 per cent increase over the 154,667 records the agency sent in September 2015.
The article points out the flip flop of Trudeau, Brison and Goodale.
NDP Revenue Critic Pierre-Luc Dusseault finds the increase in reporting “surprising.” He says:
“I don’t see how there would be 150,000 more accounts reportable to the IRS in one year. It is something I will look into.”
Lynne Swanson has no idea why the number has doubled but finds the number low considering the number of people affected by FATCA.
Swanson hopes the Republican controlled Congress and President Trump will repeal FATCA. She is still waiting for the Federal Court of Canada to intervene to protect Canadians in Canada.
“A foreign government is essentially telling the Canadian government how Canadian citizens and Canadian residents should be treated. It is a violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.”
“My opinion, not worth much I know, is that one of yours (above) is particularly uncalled for.”
OK, now I notice it could be read that way. I intended it as the relationship between any human and the IRS. Incidentally I also wondered how any human could socialize with an IRS agent. Anyway, if that comment is considered offensive, I have no objection to having it removed.
@ Norman Diamond
Thanks for acknowledging my concern. Removal is up to the Admins.
@Calgary – excellent response to CCLA. I hope they listen.
@all – Canada is not the only country sending info to the IRS. Why haven’t we seen this information for other countries? I’ve been tweeting to the ATO this morning. Retweets would be appreciated:
@cancivlib is a “tough nut” to “crack.” They are more interested in nonCandian refugees than Canadian citizens as they always tend to jump to defend they view those without a voice.
They view 1 million Canadian U.S. persons with a voice and not worthy of defense, IMO. Who knows how these organisations prioritise? A mystery.
I had an e-mail exchange with Richard Pound a year or two back and the message — who wrote a compliance “pamphlet” for Canadian U.S. persons on how to comply with the IRS – and the message was basically take it up with the U.S. government in the first instance.
Because we are lucky to have a reporter who manages to get it
@Norman & EmBee
Looks to us like you guys handled it just fine.
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2. Right-click the “e.g. Wayback” link
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4. Repeat steps 2 & 3 for the “e.g. Wayback Save” link
“Wayback” will then check whether a site is in the Internet Archive (e.g. if you want to see how it changed from earlier versions; very useful when dealing with government webpages). “Wayback Save” will save the current version of the site.
This comment may sound cold and cruel but I am sure many people are thinking it right now.
This weekend we saw a couple dozen people detained by US Immigration for mere hours and some people in seven countries have had availability of US Visas delayed for 90 days. That caused a major outcry and backlash and heads of state to include heads of state in your Country and mine fighting for the rights of dual nationals.
But here we are and in Canada alone the US Canada IGA effectively strips and destroys the Canadian Citizenship of a Canadian resident in Canada and frankly nobody gives a damn about One Million of their supposed countrymen.
So discouraging and it takes a lot to discourage me.
Its Monday and I am about to $&%% and moan a little bit more…..
This weekend we saw so many embracing those that were the subject of the infamous Executive Order loudly proclaiming these people are not terrorists etc etc.
While on the other hand, we are forcibly stripped of our dominant nationality and then called by the same people that have been protesting, the US Government and by our own Government that we are tax cheats, money launderers, terrorist funders and need to be registered with the Financial Crimes Agency which in my mind equates to having to be registered on a sex conviction list.
I do believe that Trump will grant us the relief that we need but when he does he and all of us are going to be attacked in the most vile manner possible.
@George I am 100% appalled at the breadth and bigotry of this ban but having said that I agree with you. I believe the backlash against us will be huge if Trump negates FATCA in any way.
George and Cheryl: I think the hoped-for demise of FATCA and/or CBT won’t even make the news. It’s not perceived as interesting enough and “won’t sell newspapers” … except to us! We may have to hunt for news about it with the help of people like Lynne, badger, and Elizabeth Thompson, et at.! It won’t hit CNN or the CBS Evening News. Nobody knows or cares about these issues *now* so they won’t be concerned about the repeal of them later.
I’ll take a dissenting view.
A refugee being shipped back to the Middle East is potentially a life-or-death situation.
A dual citizen in Canada might, if unlucky, have some bank account info sent to the US.
I think there’s a difference.
I agree. I didn’t mean to trivialize what the results of Trump’s actions mean to refugees, immigrants etc., simply to highlight the hypocrisy of our governments. It has devastated me to know that I am not a real Canadian but it has not put my life at risk.
I may have missed this, but do we know what 315,000 stands for? Is it the number of accounts, the number of account holders, …?
Do we know what criteria the CRA used to decide what to transmit?
It is normal to see an increase over time. I remember reading the IGA with Belgium and it specified how banks were to proceed in their search for reportable accounts. I don’t remember the details but there was a timeline starting with high value accounts and ending a few years later with a manual search of paper records. Banks respecting this kind of timeline will have more to report as the timeline progresses.
Is it known, in Canada or elsewhere, if banks notify customers that their data has been (as opposed to threatening to possibly) transmitted to the CRA (or local equivalent). And does the CRA notify a resident that their info has been transmitted to the IRS?
As for the whole Trump executive order, it is interesting to see how dual nationals are treated. Apparently the US can decide to treat a British-Yemeni as a Yemeni when it wants to. The person in question does not have the option to be viewed as British even if they have lived all their life in the UK. Naturally if that person were American-British the US would also decide to ignore British citizenship and treat them as American. Green Card Holders are even more interesting. You could be a green card holder and therefore a US Person for FATCA purposes, yet unable to return to the US right now. Are they suspending these person’s tax liability? Do they get to forget their FBARs this year?
Having our accounts reported to the IRS may not have the same effect on our physical well being as being sent back to a hostile country, but in Prof Christians’ words, we are still being “rounded up”.
No, the CRA doesn’t not inform anyone that they’ve been reported (although our Privacy Commissioner recommend they do). I had to ask the Revenue Minister herself for verification.
If any of these citizens of banned countries happen to also be travelling on a Canadian passport, the US allows Canadian citizenship dominance. No travel restrictions for Canadians.
I’m still shaking my head over that CCLA fundraising letter to you. Thank you for your response to them.
Trump’s edict has been a great fundraiser for the ACLU.
One thing I find notable about this most recent controversy is the difference between the immigration bar and the tax bar. The immigration bar is instinctively on the side of the individual whereas as the tax bar and more particularly the academic tax bar is instinctively sympathetic to the state.
@Bubbles, “If any of these citizens of banned countries happen to also be travelling on a Canadian passport, the US allows Canadian citizenship dominance. No travel restrictions for Canadians.”
But thats only for First Class Canadians something you are NOT.
Apologies for my discouragement…..just fed up up.
Glad you caught that. I didn’t put that line in there by mistake.
Apparently I’m not Canadian at all when it comes to me, an American, travelling to the US. The difference between Canada and the US in enforcement of their passport requirements is that Canada’s willing to enforce theirs.
“If you are a dual Canadian citizen used to travelling to or transiting through Canada by air with a non-Canadian passport, you will no longer be able to do so as of November 10, 2016. You will need a valid Canadian passport to board your flight.”
Expect there to be a surge in Canadian renunciations.
Here is post again as I try to remove duplication. Please ignore previous mistake:
Sad to see that reporting of financial records from CRA to IRS has doubled. This adds more info on the subject:
Also contains this warning about Trump:
Repealing Fatca, however, does not seem to be on president Donald Trump’s agenda.
Speaking to International Adviser, Nuri Katz, chief executive and founder of Apex Capital Partners, said: “To the best of my knowledge, Trump has not touched or spoken about Fatca. It’s not on his radar at the moment and is unlikely to be so because all of his slogans are about ‘making America great again’ and ‘bringing jobs back to America’.Repealing Fatca, however, does not seem to be on president Donald Trump’s agenda. “Fatca ensures that American tax money is paid to America.”
“Expect there to be a surge in Canadian renunciations.”
I think so but beware of US Consulate closures due to anti-Trump demonstrations:
“On Sunday, in advance of the protest, the consulate announced it was suspending services on Monday due to the event.”
Sorry, PatCanadian, I meant a surge in Canadians renouncing Canadian citizenship because of the new requirement for them to carry Canadian passports when entering Canada. Of course, those numbers will not even remotely compare to the surge in Americans renouncing US citizenship, with or without Trump.
“This weekend we saw a couple dozen people detained by US Immigration for mere hours and some people in seven countries have had availability of US Visas delayed for 90 days.
But here we are and in Canada alone the US Canada IGA effectively strips and destroys the Canadian Citizenship of a Canadian resident in Canada and frankly nobody gives a damn about One Million of their supposed countrymen.”
Hitler: “I’m going to murder 6 million Jews and 1 bicycle repairman.”
Astonished citizen: “A bicycle repairman?!”
Hitler: “See, I told you no one would care about 6 million Jews.”