We finally have the draft agenda of the European Parliament’s Economic and Monetary Affairs Committee public hearing on FATCA next Tuesday.
Unfortunately, all of the scheduled speakers will almost certain defend FATCA as if their lives depended on it. My sense is there is a real political problem in Europe as more become aware of the IGA terms however, many others with all of Europe’s economic and deficit problems are strongly in favor of cracking down on tax “evasion.” I do know for a fact the reason this hearing is being called is do the protestations of anti FATCA MEPs such as Sophia In’t Veld however the net effect seems to be to have a hearing that at this point is completely dominated by pro FATCA voices. I do expect some tough questions from the likse of Ms In’t Veld that I suspect will cause some real discomfort for the currently scheduled speakers. However, I expect plenty of softballs from the FATCA sympathizers on the committee. I also expect the IRS/Treasury rep to lie through his death and essentially pray on the lack of knowledge many European politicians have of the US system of government.
One problem and issue is the only organized groups against FATCA other than purely domestic US groups like Center for Freedom and Prosperity are those such as AARO, FAWCO, ACA etc that are volunteer based and relatively small. For whatever its worth I have strongly encouraged my contacts at those orgs to make a formal petition for participation(The current schedule is only a “draft”). I have not heard a response back at this point.
@Swedish Citizen, this is also a very valuable clue to TIGTA’s desire to increase revenue by using the FBAR. Worth reading the whole thing. Mentions OECD, mentions limitations of tax treaties re the FBAR. Apparently the report was heavily redacted. See also IRS comment that purpose of FBAR was NOT meant to generate revenue.
I first saw reference to this in a previous IBS post by Just Me,
https://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2012/02/04/letters-to-shulman-or-a-case-study-of-ovdp-communication-attempts-with-the-irs/
and rediscovered it at
http://hodgen.com/a-real-life-voluntary-disclosure-program-participants-story/#comment-234
The commenter cites this TIGTA report: Compliance Opportunities Exist for the Internal Revenue Service to Use Foreign Source Income Data July 2005 Reference Number: 2005-30-101
Thanks for the ideas. The info looks Close to the info I remembered. But it looks a Little Heavy for me to digest on Fri night. My thought was to use that old GAO report to show Sophie that the US objective was to find US persons in Europé and get Money from them.
Beddie bed time in Europa.
United States. General Accounting Office. Tax-motivated expatriation: enforcement of IRS and Immigration Act provisions (1 May 2000) 17 p.
Link at http://usxcanada.wordpress.com/documents/
Wonder why I bother
thanks for that link usxcanada. Very interesting reading, ex.
see excerpt from ‘United States. General Accounting Office. Tax-motivated expatriation: enforcement of IRS and Immigration Act provisions (1 May 2000) 17 p.’
……………………”…25a. In these reviews, what criteria does IRS use to determine
whether a tax-avoidance motive exists?
According to IRS Chief Counsel officials, there is no “bright line” test for
determining whether someone expatriated with a tax motivation. Rulings
are based on the unique facts and circumstances of each case, including
• U.S. and worldwide tax liabilities before and after expatriation;
• countries of residence and citizenship;
• nontax reasons cited for expatriation;
• amount of unrealized gain in assets removed from the United States and
the tax result of the immediate disposition of such assets, should the
taxpayer receive a favorable ruling, compared to the tax result if the
taxpayer had not expatriated; and
• potential U.S. estate tax savings for expatriates who are 60 years of age or
older.”
Amply demonstrates their twisted mindset.
Could Tim, Swedish Citizen, or anyone else planning to attend the EP hearing in Brussels on Tuesday please contact me privately via the site administrator? Thanks in advance.
Jane Doe,
Your email you submitted bounces back on me.
administrator(s), you may give my email to Jane Doe—so long as she is not an IRS agent. Plane tickets are attrocious as I try to find one this morning
ps, I have an email conversation with Victoria, too.–if you already are connected. I will be the guy with the 3 blue Crowns yellow Swedish hockey jersey. A 900 Euro 2 night vacation at the European parliament—-whoopee, I will bring my suntan lotion.
ok. I am booked, arriving Brussels monday night, departing early weds morning. Sure is difficult to find the credit card that has money in the account when you have less than $9999 total in accounts.
Tim and Swedish Citizen, I had set up a new gmail account under a pseudonym but for some reason can’t get it to work. I’ve entered my “real” account now so we should be able to establish a connection via the site administrator. Sorry. Swedish, ha! No, I’m just a poor dual, living in Brussels for the past 26 years and still hoping to wake up from this nightmare.
I sent a message to Victoria a few days back but haven’t received an answer.
Basically, I’m wondering how many of us may be planning to attend and whether we can organise something.
I am in late Monday, available all Tuesday someplace downtown, both before the meeting and also afterwards.
Swedish, any idea how many may be planning to attend?
Victoria mentioned that she is either trying to round some people up, or that maybe she might be the lone person from her area, not sure. I will connect again soon.
I’m not seeing much chatter anyplace.
I have a tough time keeping Eric & Tim apart in my mind. Is Eric also one of those darn socialist Europeans living-it-high-on-the hog near Belgium or is he a Molsen-drinking ex hockey goalie with false teeth?
A reminder…
Live video streaming of EU Public hearings on #FATCA Starts 9:30 am EDT http://bit.ly/13bshUi @EP_Economics JUST SAY NO TO FATCA IGAs #IRS
Some more info about the meeting:
Lucy Laederich’s (FAWCO US Liaison and AARO President) note about the meeting up on the FAWCO website
https://www.fawco.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=2669:eu-hearing-on-fatca-implementation-bulletin&catid=182:us-taxation&Itemid=604
And on the Flophouse a post about logistics for the meeting. We got confirmation (thank you Jane) for the venue and the time.
http://thefranco-americanflophouse.blogspot.fr/2013/05/logistics-for-eu-meeting-on-fatca.html
And finally the event will be webstreamed. The Econ committee is meeting in the morning and the afternoon. When you search for the meeting be sure to find the one at 15:30 – that should be the FATCA hearing. I think it’s this one.
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/ep-live/en/committees/video?event=20130528-1530-COMMITTEE-ECON
I would be very very grateful if you could pass along this link to the livestream to as many places as possible. And if any of you happen to be in Brussels tomorrow, we have lunch reservations and there is always always room for one more. 🙂
May 27 Update – The meeting will be broadcast live tomorrow from the Alterio Spinelli Building ASP 5G3 starting at 15:30 (3:30 PM) Brussels time. Here is the direct link to the webstream:
Committee on Economic and Monetary Affairs Live Broadcast, 15:30 / 19:00 – 28-05-2013
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/ep-live/en/committees/video?event=20130528-1530-COMMITTEE-ECON
Thank, folks.
Thanks Victoria and I’m sure there is no need to remind you to pick up some delicious Belgium chocolate as a reward for your much appreciated effort. I’ll be watching the webstream and look forward to your summary afterwards.
It’s 7:30am Alberta time and for anyone else …
http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/converted.html?iso=20130528T1530&p1=48&p2=55
I think for those of us who can’t be there, this is an opportunity to show that there are people who are very interested in this topic and I hope the committee will pay attention to the webstream counter.
EU FATCA show time in 12 minutes.
Watch here…
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/ep-live/en/committees/video?event=20130528-1530-COMMITTEE-ECON
Tweet using hashtag #IRS and/or #EUFATCA
Hope some of our questions get answered. Probably not.
This is very hard to listen to … too many voices all at once and it goes on and off. I’ll have to rely on Victoria’s report. 🙁 We installed the required plugin but perhaps it just isn’t Mac friendly. Also no video, just audio but maybe that’s all that is available. Anyway I do hear Sophia on and off. It sounds like she is trying to refocus the debate onto how FATCA affects real people.
@Em
I had problems, but finally went to IE, and it streamed fine.
Sophie asked the most pointed questions and represented the interests of Dual Citizens very strongly.
@Tim…
Do you know if the hearing will be on the internet later? It has been VERY interested. Those of us that identified FATCA as the tip of the spear for a global GATCA sure had it right. This hearing makes that VERY clear what the desire of the technocrats is, and of course, the worlds population and America citizens really have no idea what is a foot.
@ Just Me
I gave up on it. We don’t have IE. When you only hear half a sentence and then it goes off it’s pretty hard to make much sense out of it. Looks like being Mac and Canadian are both strikes against me. 🙁 Anyway, glad to hear Sophia made such a good presentation but I was pretty sure she would after watching other videos of her speaking.
I wasn’t able to tune in either, Em. Hope others were successful. Thanks for all the information, Victoria and Just Me.
Meant to say, it has been very “interesting”. I can not listen, watch, tweet, respond to Skype chats and make comments on a blog at the same time. 🙂
The highlight clearly was Sophie’s appearance.
I had to laugh at the fact that after 14 months of fighting for access to documentation regarding discussions between the EU and the US on FATCA she has received access to thousands of documents but they are all redacted with the page numbers being about the only thing not blacked out. The EU or the US are so dead set against the concept of her having access to the documents that some junior underlings spent thousands of hours of taxpayer money blacking out everything relevant.
One interesting point was something that Robert Stack (Deputy Assistant Secretary for International Tax Affairs, International Tax Counsel, US Department of the Treasury) said when he addressed the question of reciprocity in his follow-up time. He said that if the legislation referred to in the budget submission were passed he would fully expect that the US would be implementing full look through procedures to determine beneficial ownership including for Delaware corporations and that this would form part of the reciprocity.
If that is true, that would be a staggering change of tack on the part of the US. If true, they would be willing to put at risk their status as the world’s largest tax haven in order to get the info on US citizens. On the surface that seems like a monumentally stupid trade given that FATCA is only supposed to raise $81 million a year in tax revenue. Maybe they’re betting that in a GATCA world the resulting outflows out of the US will be less? I wonder if Mr. Stack’s statement is BS or if the US is actually serious about reciprocity. I guess we’ll find out if and when the legislation is introduced. I also wonder if Mr. Biden approved Mr. Stack’s statement?