Renunciation and Relinquishment of United States Citizenship: Discussion thread (Ask your questions) Part Two
Ask your questions about Renunciation and Relinquishment of United States Citizenship and Certificates of Loss of Nationality.
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NB: This discussion is a continuation of an older discussion that became too large for our software to handle well. See Renunciation and Relinquishment of United States Citizenship: Discussion thread (Ask your questions) Part One
I guessed A.B. was short for Any Body — not too far off I guess.
I got my CLN yesterday!! It came by registered mail from Calgary, nine months after my husband and I had our relinquishment appointment in Calgary. My husband hasn’t received his yet, and he’s very nervous. The Calgary consulate said we’d be getting our certificates at the same time, in the same envelope – the self-addressed prepaid Canada Post Express envelope we gave them – delivered through regular mail, and that it would take about six months.
Instead, I got my CLN certificate in a regular envelope, not the Canada Post Express one, sent by registered mail so I had to sign for it, it took nine months, and my husband has not received his, although we applied at the consulate together. The consulate official who took out documents said she didn’t think there would be any problems. I think my husband’s CLN will come soon, but he’s quite discouraged.
Great news Queenston, another one free before year’s end. Hopefully, your hubby’s will arrive soon and you can celebrate again.
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@ Queenston Congratualtions! What a wonderful way to end the year and begin another! Your husband’s is just stuck in the mail. They just got separated and his is probably going to come in the envelope you provided.
I am now scheduled for my renunciation appointment in 2015. The list of documents to bring specifies only valid Canadian passport – nothing about citizenship certificate. So, another thing I did that cost money and work and was unnecessary and delayed my renunciation appointment.
@DM, I would take it with you anyway. Wouldn’t want to turn up and find they ask for it and you haven’t got it with you. Better to take too much than not enough.
DM You WILL need your citizenship certificate. Some Brockers were delayed because they took the cit. card instead of the certificate. Take both if you have them.
The expatriation *experience* is NOT the same one US consulate to another, even in the same country.
@DM
It used to be they wanted the document (either citizenship certificate or card) that showed the date of the citizenship ceremony. On my documents, that is the certificate. I think others may have indicated that in the past, that was not always the case So check both and/or bring both to be sure.
DM – hang in there; it will be over soon. While perhaps not listed, be proactive and take as many different forms of ID as you can imagine they MIGHT find helpful. All of these (save your US passport) will be returned to you at the end of your appointment. When I renounced last Aprill, I took both my laminated Cdn Citizenship card as well as the “ceremonial” paper document plus my Canadian Passport; more is better than less.
@LM@DM @Tricia Moon
Yes, I agree. Take more documents than you think you’ll need. I made the mistake at the Vancouver Consulate a few weeks ago of taking my laminated Canadian citizenship card with my photo on it issued in 2002 and not the ceremonial citizenship document. Of course Vancouver insisted that the laminated card is not good enough so now I have to mail in the ceremonial document. (I live in Ontario, so I am just happy they did not require a second appointment and will let me complete the relinquishment process by mail.)
Someone on this site informed me that according to the Canadian government the laminated card is the official proof of citizenship, not the ceremonial paper. My husband said the consulate probably knows this but didn’t want to make it too easy for me to get the backdated CLN.
@ Somerfugl
I hope you only sent them a copy of your ceremonial citizenship certificate because these will no longer be replaced if lost or stolen. It may only be ceremonial but I’d think you would like to keep the original. They also are not issuing the laminated citizenship cards anymore either so if that gets lost or stolen you have to pay to get an official citizenship certificate. I really don’t know why they felt they had to mess with the system in 2012 but they did. My husband has an official citizenship certificate (issued in 2013) and he keeps it very well protected — won’t let it out of his sight.
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/helpcentre/answer.asp?q=048&t=5
The new Canadian citizenship certificate is letter size, CIC has not issued the laminated wallet size cards since 2012. I learned this when I applied for a replacement.
Even though mine was issued in 2012, it shows my date of citizenship as April 27, 1973. The Oath of Citizenship is on the reverse.
I understand from CIC that this is now the official citizenship certificate and has several security features in it. It cannot be used as a travel document,
@Blaze: Do I need to apply for this certificate, as maybe that is what Vancouver wants instead of the ceremonial certificate which I have at home? Do you know approx. how long it takes to get one? I have only 90 days to get it to them. Is the address on the government website?
Thanks for any info.
Somerfugl: I do not think you need to apply for the new certificate for renunciation. It has only been provided since February 2012 and I believe the old laminated cards are still being accepted everywhere in Canada as proof of Canadian citizenship.
The advantage of the certificate is it has the date of the actual citizenship. My old laminated photo card only gave the year it was issued–not the date of citizenship.
I think the only people who have taken the new certificate to U.S. Consulates are those who became citizens after February 2012 and those who applied for a replacement certificate because they had lost or misplaced the old one.
If a citizen still has the old certificate, they are required to turn it in to get the new one. It took about five weeks to get the new certificate (although CIC said it would take 10 months!), so someone could potentially be without a certificate for some time. There was a fee of $75 for the replacement.
I did not mean to imply that there is a requirement for the new certificate. I hope I didn`t confuse or complicate things further.
For those who are not yet Canadian citizens, it`s going to be more expensive. CIC has increased the fee to $530.
Anyone who applied prior to today will pay the 2014 fee of $300.
http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/why-canadian-citizenship-fees-have-gone-up-again-1.2168877
I just looked on the Govt of Canada website for info about getting the Canadian citizenship certificate that Blaze posted above. Yikes! It looks like it takes 5 months to get one and they want original pieces of ID like a health card and drivers license. So what are you supposed to do for five months without a health card or drivers license?? I think I will try sending in the ceremonial one issued in 2003, (the laminated wallet card was issued in 2002 which the Vancouver consulate has seen) and see if they accept it.
Somerfugl: I did not send my original driver`s license or health card. I sent a copy. If they are requiring the original, that is new and it ridiculous. As you said, someone cannot be be without those for an extended period of weeks or months.
@ Somerfugl
Further to what Blaze wrote, there is this from http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/citizenship/proof.asp#a1 …
You might want to include that URL and quote to show the US consulate that as proof of Canadian citizenship it’s the card that counts for you. However, the commemorative certificate will likely have the date you actually became a citizen so that may be why they need it.
@ Blaze, @ EmBee
Thanks for the information. I will send in the commerative certificate and see if they accept it. It is confusing because in my case the citizenship card which is proof of Canadian citizenship was issue in 2002 and the commerative one was issued in 2003 (when I attended the ceremony). The Vancouver Consulate official did say they needed the date of actual citizenship (which I assumed was on the card. Why would they issue you a proof of citizenship card it you are not yet a citizen?). So I hope they accept the commerrative certificate. Blaze, does the fee of $530 apply also to those seeking a replacement or just to new Canadians? I think it is an exorbitant fee.
@ Somerfugl
Well that’s confusing — a citizenship ceremony AFTER you obtained Canadian citizenship? When and how did you obtain citizenship? I thought you had to take the oath at the ceremony in order to become a Canadian. I guess all you can do is send in the commemorative certificate and see what happens. Otherwise you’ll have to send in CIC paperwork, pay the fee and get the new-style official certificate. Man, why do they mess with things like this? CIC does have a fast track for obtaining proof of citizenship but it’s at an agent’s discretion. Let’s hope the commemorative certificate does the trick without further bureaucratic hoops to jump through.
http://www.cic.gc.ca/english/citizenship/urgent-proof.asp
@EmBee
In the Fall of 2002 I completed the application for Canadian citizenship, sent in all documents and passed a written test. It was so long ago that I don’t remember if I took an oath at that time, but I was told that I was now a Canadian citizen and was asked if I wanted to attend a citizenship ceremony which was optional. I also remember they had a backlog, so I couldn’t get a ceremony, which I wanted to do, until the Spring. Since they said the ceremony was optional, I assumed that the citizenship card was proof of citizenship, which is why I did not take the certificate to Vancouver. I agree, it now seems weird. I hope I don’t have to get a new certificate, and as you said why do they have to mess with things ( and charge ridiculous fees). The laminated card is much more convenient that having to keep a letter size document.
The $530 fee is for those applying to become Canadian citizens.
It is bizarre that you received your card before your certificate.
I agree the new letter sized certificate is very inconvenient–especially because they advise you not to fold it. That also means it does not fit in my safety deposit box. So, I put a copy in there.
When I closed all my TD accounts last month, I also closed my safety deposit box, Unfortunately, my new credit union does not provude safety deposit boxes, so all copies of my citizenship certificate and my renunciation oath are now at home.
@ Blaze, you can invest in a good fireproof safe. There are smaller ones available that are not too expensive. These documents are much too important.
FYI, anyone needing to provide documentation to the Canadian government can usually go to a Service Canada office near their home, and have “certified copies” made by their agents, to be submitted with whatever application you are submitting. Often the agents will just take the copies and apps, throw them in a pouch, and send them where they need to go. Some offices (small) are restricted in what they can do, check with your local office. No need to be without ID.